bloody feces

[liltexas409]

I went out this evening to do a final check up on my crew,and found some feces with blood in the stool.After looking over the chickens I noticed that my one hen has a protrusion on her vent that is beet red in color,almost like a big hemmroid. She is missing feathers from around the vent area. I have just had these chickens for four days. I was reading about worms and had wondered if that was what may be making the red area and Im not sure who is doing the bloody feces although I looked and did not see worms. She is six months old as are the other 2 hens and have laid no eggs.I have them on DE as well as in the dust box and have ordered Piperline and Ivermectin online. What could this be?

 

[eggdicted]

waiting to here the experts on this one i also have a few 2 1/2 week chicks with bloody manure was wondering if they could eat to much grit and cause this or grass with out enough grit

 

[Sillystunt]

hummm, blood is stool = cocci

Isolate her until someone better to give advise chimes in

 

[threehorses]

Actually blood in the stool doesn't necessarily = cocci, particularly in 'adult' hens and ones about to lay (around 6 months) but it's certainly something to rule out (eggdicted - more for you in a separate post from me in this thread). It can also be bacterial irritation of the cecum, worms, egg binding, or (possibly in this case) blood from the vent protrusion.

Would you say that the vent looks like this:

If you feel this is it, then here's an article I think you will find useful. Note: This is the ONLY time I would consider using any 'caine on the bird at all, and the bird must in all cases be separated from the others.
http://www.browneggblueegg.com/Article/ProlapsedOviduct/ProlapsedOviduct.html

Or does it look more like a sore at the side of the vent.

Also, has the hen laid an egg yet? If you very delicately feel the abdomen, do you feel what could be an egg inside? Is it possible that any of that dropping was actual blood from trying to lay an egg? Was the stool mucousy?

If the stool was mucousy and the blood is in that mucus, then I'd consider coccidiosis. But it's not really very high on my list. I'm thinking more wound or prolapse based on your answer. I'm leaning more towards prolapse as you used the term hemorrhoid and as she's about the age of beginning laying. Beginning layers can often push too hard and prolapse their cloaca, particularly if they have a soft shelled egg, etc.

In case of a wound only, you will want to cleanse the area (preferably with a mixture of betadine iodine with warm water til it's the color of a very weak iced tea). Pat dry once it's quite thoroughly washed. Dress with neosporin (with no pain killers and no cortisones).

In ALL cases keep this hen inside and separated from other birds. Birds will pick her til she's dead. Flies can easily get to a wound/prolapse like that and will lay eggs, causing maggots within hours in the summer. So she must be inside while you treat as long as there's anything red and raw outside.

We'll look for your answers so we can figure out whether to go more towards prolapse or wounds. In the mean time, consider vitamins/electrolytes (for poultry use as labeled) in the water, make sure she eats and drinks, and clean off the area at least with warm water.

 

[threehorses]

Eggdicted:

Are you chicks on a feed medicated with amprolium? Is it a 'starter crumble" or "starter-grower"? If no to any of those, I would recommend starter or starter-grower with amprolium as their main feed.

Also at 2 weeks, their brooder temps should be around 80 degrees at the coolest. Because it's summer (here anyway) you will want to watch to make sure it's not too hot.

What are you using for the brooder flooring? Is it particularly dry and very very clean?

For chicks, I would highly suspect coccidiosis and just tell you to treat based on symptoms as blood is a sign of serious coccidiosis (among other things, cocci being most likely in babies because brooders are warm and moist). I would recommend Corid over Sulmet. But if you can only get Sulmet you can certainly use that.

Corid is still amprolium - but in a "coccidiocide" strength (to kill all cocci) rather than the medicated feed's "coccidiostat" strength (designed to not sterilize the chick from cocci in order to allow the chick to develop its own immunity to that species of cocci.) It's gentle, only works against protazoa, and isn't an antibiotic. Sulmet is an antibiotic which is why I prefer Corid for babies.

In all cases, you will want to boost the GOOD bacteria that live in the digestive tract with more living bacteria. We do this using a "PRObiotic" which is literally just live bacteria in some media in which they can live until they get into the gut. It's usually lactobacilli and possibly some others.

You can use plain yogurt very effectively with babies and adults during illness daily, or weekly from weeks 1-8 to help them be more resistant to illness of the digestive tract. (Note: if you use any meds ending with -cycline or -mycin, you must not use yogurt but something like acidophilis capsules from the drug store's vitamin section, or Probios powder from the feedstore).

My babies love yogurt on its own. If yours don't, you can withhold feed for 30 minutes to an hour. Then mix yogurt (1 tablespoon per 4 chicks) with a little water. Use that water to mix with an equal amount of crumbles. Let sit 10 minutes til it absorbs and makes a damp, not wet, mixture. ONly make a little bit - enough for all babies to get some in 15 minutes. If one or two get more than the others and hog it, pick them up and place them in a cardboard box temporarily til the others can all get their share. Then put them back when it's all done. Clean the feeder and replace with their free-choice baby crumbles.

So in a nutshell:
Buy Corid (or Sulmet). Treat as labeled in the water as the sole source of water.
Buy plain yogurt - feed 1 teaspoon per 4 babies daily during medication and every other day for 2 weeks afterwards.


Now prevention: once birds get over coccidiosis to one species, they're mostly immune to it for life (unless they're just overloaded). But there are 9 species total. To keep your babies safe from coccidiosis, other than of course feeding coccidiostat (amprolium) feed and giving probiotics, you will want to keep the environment clean and dry.

Moisture (spilled water - chicks are so bad at that) and heat (brooding temps) cause cocci to bloom. So make waterers tip free (put on something solid not bedding), remove wetted bedding immediately and replace it and any underlayer with more clean dry bedding. If babies poop in the waterer, wash it with hot water and soap, rinse, fill, replace. Putting waterers at the chicks' back level helps them to not take little strolls through their waterer as my barred rocks always LOVED to do with their little feet that inevitably stepped in poop. Make sure that any food that gets pooped in gets removed, not just the poop taken out tempting as it is. Lots of ventilation in the brooder room (not drafts ) helps keep the bedding dry. I really like kiln-dried pine shavings over all other beddings. Using this method, I've kept from getting coccidiosis in my chicks for 10 years. It really works. I hope it works for you, too.

In the mean time, treat now - time is of the essence. Please let us know how you do.

 

[eggdicted]

wow you really know your stuff and thanks my brooder may have gotten too hot a couple times but is always clean and dry i use pine chips for the first week and now am making my own pine shavings with a planer i will go to the feed store tommorow they arent open today and i really appreciate your help and they are on a starter grower with aprilium or however its spelled as well as vi-tal vitamins and electrolyte

 

[threehorses]

To be honest, bagged pine chips are safer because their way of drying them dries some of the aromatic oils out of them and they're more absorbant, so I'd stick with what you have. Just lettin' you know.

And thank you. The information sticks with you one you hear it.