Breed vs color for local fair exhibition

[Susan Skylark]

We are going to try showing poultry for 4H this year, namely our coturnix quail, it is a tiny county fair (a dozen birds total most years) but the rules state ‘limit of 2 birds per breed per class with a max of 12 entries’ but how do I interpret that for non-breed species like quail? Colors (pharaoh, Italian, Rosetta) are very distinguishable and breed true but are not an official breed nor is there a breed standard. He could take 12 chickens (same species but 6 breeds) or only 2 quail? He’s already stuck in the hobby category as it is an obscure species around here, is he also limited to 2 birds? I’m thinking about treating colors as ‘breeds’ for registration purposes and seeing what the poultry superintendent makes of it, anybody else deal with something like this? Thanks!

 

[007Sean]

We are going to try showing poultry for 4H this year, namely our coturnix quail, it is a tiny county fair (a dozen birds total most years) but the rules state ‘limit of 2 birds per breed per class with a max of 12 entries’ but how do I interpret that for non-breed species like quail? Colors (pharaoh, Italian, Rosetta) are very distinguishable and breed true but are not an official breed nor is there a breed standard. He could take 12 chickens (same species but 6 breeds) or only 2 quail? He’s already stuck in the hobby category as it is an obscure species around here, is he also limited to 2 birds? I’m thinking about treating colors as ‘breeds’ for registration purposes and seeing what the poultry superintendent makes of it, anybody else deal with something like this? Thanks!

You might ask someone who raises and shows turkeys....Turkey is the breed and there are hundreds of color mutations. They might be able to tell you how to handle this situation.
There are no breeds of quail only species and color mutations.

 

[Susan Skylark]

Turkeys come in a variety of breeds, turkey is the species. A species is by definition two creatures that can produce viable and fertile offspring when bred together. Hence horses and donkeys are different species as their offspring are infertile. This gets murky in certain species like new world camelids (llamas, alpacas etc.) as they can use the same blood products and interbreed thus are probably the same species but enthusiasts insist they are not! Bobwhite and buttons are different species of quail, Orpington and brahmas are breeds of chicken. A breed is simply a genetic line within a species selectively bred for a certain trait be it ear shape, herding ability or naked necks with enthusiasts establishing standards and possibly a registry of their definition of proper examples, they are all cows whether they are angus or Holstein or longhorn. I just need a plethora of coturnix Enthusiasts to declare Italian a breed and say what is and is not a proper Italian, but as they are still rather obscure, most don’t even know it is a quail!

 

[007Sean]

HiTurkeys come in a variety of breeds, turkey is the species. A species is by definition two creatures that can produce viable and fertile offspring when bred together. Hence horses and donkeys are different species as their offspring are infertile. This gets murky in certain species like new world camelids (llamas, alpacas etc.) as they can use the same blood products and interbreed thus are probably the same species but enthusiasts insist they are not! Bobwhite and buttons are different species of quail, Orpington and brahmas are breeds of chicken. A breed is simply a genetic line within a species selectively bred for a certain trait be it ear shape, herding ability or naked necks with enthusiasts establishing standards and possibly a registry of their definition of proper examples, they are all cows whether they are angus or Holstein or longhorn. I just need a plethora of coturnix Enthusiasts to declare Italian a breed and say what is and is not a proper Italian, but as they are still rather obscure, most don’t even know it is a quail!

Wrong,...the breed is Turkey, they come in a variety of color variations or mutations.
There are only 2 species of turkeys.
ETA-- https://www.britannica.com/animal/turkey-bird

 

[JacinLarkwell]

Turkeys come in a variety of breeds, turkey is the species. A species is by definition two creatures that can produce viable and fertile offspring when bred together. Hence horses and donkeys are different species as their offspring are infertile. This gets murky in certain species like new world camelids (llamas, alpacas etc.) as they can use the same blood products and interbreed thus are probably the same species but enthusiasts insist they are not! Bobwhite and buttons are different species of quail, Orpington and brahmas are breeds of chicken. A breed is simply a genetic line within a species selectively bred for a certain trait be it ear shape, herding ability or naked necks with enthusiasts establishing standards and possibly a registry of their definition of proper examples, they are all cows whether they are angus or Holstein or longhorn. I just need a plethora of coturnix Enthusiasts to declare Italian a breed and say what is and is not a proper Italian, but as they are still rather obscure, most don’t even know it is a quail!

I treated it as 2 per class at my fair, so theoretically one could show up to 8 (2 hens under a year, 2 hens over a year, 2 male's under a year and 2 males over a year)

 

[NatJ]

Turkeys come in a variety of breeds, turkey is the species.

The American Poultry Association decided to consider all turkeys as one "breed" called "Turkey," with the different colors as different color varieties.

https://amerpoultryassn.com/accepted-breeds-varieties/
If you look at the list here, you can see that other birds have things like:
type waterfowl, breed African, variety White, class Heavy Goose
Chickens get type standard (or bantam), many different breeds, many varieties within some breeds, class any of several abbreviations (various groupings of breeds.)

When I put "turkey" in the search box, I find that type, breed, and class all say "turkey." The only difference is the "variety."

Given that some of those "varieties" are different sizes or shapes, this does not fit the pattern used for the other kinds of poultry, but apparently it is the way the American Poultry Association has chosen to do it

So in the USA, it is at least sort-of correct to say there is only one "breed" of turkey.

I've read that some other countries do consider there to be multiple breeds of turkeys. For example, this wikipedia article lists some turkey breeds and tells what organizations recognize them. It also mentions the APA recognizing only "varieties" instead of breeds:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_turkey_breeds

Wrong,...the breed is Turkey, they come in a variety of color variations or mutations.

If you consider the American Poultry Association to be the only authority that can recognize something as a breed, that would be correct.

But there appear to be organizations in other places that do recognize different BREEDS of turkey.

 

[Zenmonkey]

The OP lists their location as Midwest US, and I would imagine the county fair is also US. I suspect the NPA system, logical or not, applies here.

But anyway, the OP has quail, and the authority most interesting to them will be the fair grounds. Call them up. Ask if they can put you in touch with whoever is going to be judging or running the poultry barn. That might require some phone calls over time, but would also limit the amount of arguing and broken hearts.

Most of those people are putting in a lot more hours than makes sense for the pay, because they love having a fair. They also probably would like more exhibits rather than less.

Best wishes!

 

[Amer]

Are quail allowed in the fairbook?

 

[007Sean]

The American Poultry Association decided to consider all turkeys as one "breed" called "Turkey," with the different colors as different color varieties.

https://amerpoultryassn.com/accepted-breeds-varieties/
If you look at the list here, you can see that other birds have things like:
type waterfowl, breed African, variety White, class Heavy Goose
Chickens get type standard (or bantam), many different breeds, many varieties within some breeds, class any of several abbreviations (various groupings of breeds.)

When I put "turkey" in the search box, I find that type, breed, and class all say "turkey." The only difference is the "variety."

Given that some of those "varieties" are different sizes or shapes, this does not fit the pattern used for the other kinds of poultry, but apparently it is the way the American Poultry Association has chosen to do it

So in the USA, it is at least sort-of correct to say there is only one "breed" of turkey.

I've read that some other countries do consider there to be multiple breeds of turkeys. For example, this wikipedia article lists some turkey breeds and tells what organizations recognize them. It also mentions the APA recognizing only "varieties" instead of breeds:
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_turkey_breeds


If you consider the American Poultry Association to be the only authority that can recognize something as a breed, that would be correct.

But there appear to be organizations in other places that do recognize different BREEDS of turkey.

Thanks for 'clearing' that up! Knowing the OP is in the U.S. the APA's rules would applie. As far as other organizations applying their own rules is something altogether different than what the APA has set as their rules and guidelines.

Quail are known by their species names and common names and by color variants and color mutations...there are 'no breeds' of quail. Although, it would seem to alot of people that raise Coturnux quail, that their color variations are regarded as 'breeds' but that is a false assumption.