Breeding Delawares to the Standard of Perfection

[finnfur]

How do you all track production? Trap nests? Breeding pens keeping track which pen lays more?

individual production you would need trap nest or individual pens-only way I know.= there was a guy working on ID chips on hens and sensors in the nest . But it records nest visits and duration and not eggs - but would give you a idea. Some hens visit nests but don't lay.

 

[Rod-T]

individual production you would need trap nest or individual pens-only way I know.= there was a guy working on ID chips on hens and sensors in the nest . But it records nest visits and duration and not eggs - but would give you a idea. Some hens visit nests but don't lay.

Seems like trap nests would be alot effort specially if you leave for the day.. but if you breeding for more production. . You need to know which ones lay more.. the sensor idea seems good. Give you a idea..

 

[LeslieDJoyce]

Number of eggs each day divided by number of layers.

 

[Rod-T]

Number of eggs each day divided by number of layers.

Seems Like That Would Work. . If each breeding pen had small amount of hens.. too many hens might not give you a good count 10 hens would be too many.. 4 of those could be poor layers and there eggs would get hatched.
. Maybe breeding pens of smaller numbers?

 

[LeslieDJoyce]

Seems Like That Would Work. . If each breeding pen had small amount of hens.. too many hens might not give you a good count 10 hens would be too many.. 4 of those could be poor layers and there eggs would get hatched.
. Maybe breeding pens of smaller numbers?

If your tracking true productivity then it's only fair to use the average over the whole flock over time. Breaking it down by age group is also fair ... knowing how many eggs for the pullet flock vs the first year hen flock vs the second year hen flock (if you keep birds that long). If you don't count all the poor layers before you count eggs each day, then you might as well make up a number. That said, you would be not breeding from the poor layers, ideally. And you'd be culling the non-thrifty birds from your flock if you can identify them. In theory, that would improve productivity with each generation.

Setting up breeding pens is a different topic.

 

[Rod-T]

If your tracking true productivity then it's only fair to use the average over the whole flock over time. Breaking it down by age group is also fair ... knowing how many eggs for the pullet flock vs the first year hen flock vs the second year hen flock (if you keep birds that long). If you don't count all the poor layers before you count eggs each day, then you might as well make up a number. That said, you would be not breeding from the poor layers, ideally. And you'd be culling the non-thrifty birds from your flock if you can identify them. In theory, that would improve productivity with each generation.

Setting up breeding pens is a different topic.

Ok if you breed next year's stock this summer.. by spring they should be prime layers. . By may or june they should be laying great.. so you'd want to breed from the good layers every year. The poor layers you wouldn't want to breed from them and should be culled by may? I'm not trying to be argue I'm just wondering how everyone improves yearly. Production is one of the traits i want to make sure i have...i have another hen and two roosters that will be ready this late summer to breed.. so out of 4 chickens I'll get my start.. so I plan on hatching what I can.. next summer select my stock what ever i hatch 25? out of those 4 chickens. . The records thing got me thinking. . That poor young layers should not be bred from. If your trying to increase productivity. .. I can't worry too much yet since I have what I have to breed from.. next year I'll pick my few out of the 25..

 

[Rod-T]

How often does everyone weigh chicks? I know 3 months is a time since alot shoot for 12 week weights.. what about 1 month? So maybe 1 month 3 month 6 months?
Does anyone have weights to share at that age?..

I read somewhere that the fastest growing chicks at 1 month.. tend to finish under the medium growing chicks.. is that true?
If so maybe the 1 month weights don't matter?

 

[finnfur]

How often does everyone weigh chicks? I know 3 months is a time since alot shoot for 12 week weights.. what about 1 month? So maybe 1 month 3 month 6 months?
Does anyone have weights to share at that age?..

I read somewhere that the fastest growing chicks at 1 month.. tend to finish under the medium growing chicks.. is that true?
If so maybe the 1 month weights don't matter?

At the club site - we have a Chick track chart you can download.
I think the facts of your above statement depend on the Strain/line you are talking about.
My chick weight rankings have been fairly close at cull - they may change one position but thats about it- this is on Cockerals

 

[caychris]

In my opinion if you are breeding for egg production then you need to track the average if a fair sized flock of the same age birds over a significant period of time say the first full year of laying.
Tracking by total and average by week and month.

Once you have these numbers then you can break each group of birds down into smaller breeding groups and determine how the group does compared to the wholes average. after 2 months of laying you should have a good idea if you have lagging birds you can then try trap nests or other methods to further break down a breeding group to remove the lagging birds.

You can use shorter time frames if you wish but giving the birds time to fully mature in their laying cycle before hatching would probably be good and should ensure larger stronger chicks.

There are so many things that can effect laying though including flock politics that moving groups of birds frequently can effect the numbers.

For example If I had a flock of 20 layers after determining my average. I would then sort breeding groups by pelvic widths and other possible SOP related characteristics into 3 groups of 5 birds ranking the groups. Then I would compare the 4 groups(including the left overs) to my previous averages for a couple of months. This should give you a good indication of how much uniformity there is in the flock as well as give you something some idea of what to breed forward from. By grouping around some uniformity standard this will insure that what goes forward should replicate. By using a largish breeding group (5 or so) you still maintain some genetic diversity

As for weighing chicks Id weigh weekly till culling or through 24 weeks for keeper birds as this would give me the best data about growth rates
Personally Id grow out a group of birds to 24 weeks so I could get as much data about how they finish as possible. This will also help select your forward breeders.

Feeding practices and a variety of other things can effect over all gain so I would grow them out in expected production conditions as best as possible. Feed input is an important factor to monitor. I would not change too many things at once that includes breeding select on. If you want to compare raising methods run multiples off the same breeding group. There are lots of factors that go into production qualities of the bird that have nothing to do with breeding. In order to ensure your breeding program achieves its best results then you need to ensure that you have a consistent method of raising the birds and maintaining their health. If you do that then you will get the best birds you can from the environment you provide. Once you have established a measure of uniformity from within that environment then the subtle changes to that environment can be easier to track. You have to determine how you plan to raise the birds. Commercial birds have been breed to be raised in an efficient environment for a short period of time. Your breeding program will produce the best possible from the environment and raising program you choose.

 

[Rod-T]

In my opinion if you are breeding for egg production then you need to track the average if a fair sized flock of the same age birds over a significant period of time say the first full year of laying.
Tracking by total and average by week and month.

Once you  have these numbers then you can break each group of birds down into smaller breeding groups and determine how the group does compared to the wholes average. after 2 months of laying you should have a good idea if you have lagging birds you can then try trap nests or other methods to further break down a breeding group to remove the lagging birds. 

You can use shorter time frames if you wish but giving the birds  time to fully mature in their laying cycle before hatching would probably be good and should ensure larger stronger chicks.

There are so many things that can effect laying though including flock politics that moving groups of birds frequently can effect the numbers.

For example If I had a flock of 20 layers after determining my average. I would then sort breeding groups by pelvic widths and other possible SOP related characteristics into 3 groups of 5  birds ranking the groups.  Then I would compare the 4 groups(including the left overs) to my previous averages for a couple of months. This should give you a good indication of how much uniformity there is in the flock as well as give you something some idea of what to breed forward from. By grouping around some uniformity standard this will insure that what goes forward should replicate. By using a largish breeding group (5 or so) you still maintain some genetic diversity

As for weighing chicks Id weigh weekly till culling or through 24 weeks for keeper birds as this would give me the best data about growth rates
Personally Id grow out a group of birds to 24 weeks so I could get as much data about how they finish as possible. This will also help select your forward breeders.

Feeding practices and  a variety of other things can effect over all gain so I would grow them out in expected production conditions as best as possible. Feed input is an important factor to monitor. I would not change too many things at once that includes breeding select on. If you want to compare raising methods run multiples off the same breeding group. There are lots of factors that go into production qualities of the bird that have nothing to do with breeding. In order to ensure your breeding program achieves its best results then you need to ensure that you have a consistent method of raising the birds and maintaining their health. If you do that then you will get the best birds you can from the environment you provide. Once you have established a measure of uniformity from within that environment then the subtle changes to that environment can be easier to track. You have to determine how you plan to raise the birds. Commercial birds have been breed to be raised in an efficient environment for a short period of time. Your breeding program will produce the best possible from the environment and raising program you choose.

Thanks chris... great info..