BREEDING FOR PRODUCTION...EGGS AND OR MEAT.

[draye]

I have thoroughly enjoyed the discussions in this thread lately.  Very interesting and educational.  The oriental Game discussion was fantastic to read as I have read very little on the oriental breeds, and games in general.

Which in turn, got my wheels turning, and that's not always a good thing. So it's lead me to start thinking about starting a Feral Flock on our farm with some Old English Games.  I think it'd be neat, but also a lot of money to lose, as the OEG are not cheap around here.

Is it possible to have a feral flock in South Central PA climate?  I wouldn't mind tossing out some scratch grain for them during winter if that's what it would take.  Maybe leghorns could make it, and be cheaper to purchase?

Well everyone else is telling their stories so I'll give you kne also.

Y brother had ordered some rare breed site oaks from a hatchery. Hatchery I don't remember and not really that important anyway. He got some Lakenvelders that were not thriving too well and put them outside the runs he has built for his chickens. Me I ordered some Polish chicks ( mine from a different hatchery) that were not doing so well and being very close to the same age as the Lakenvelders I threw them out with them. A few days went by and we didn't see them SH thought something had gotten them, we'll few few days later they showed up and started looking way better than when we put them out. Three them some grain and they started coming in everyday about the same time, feeding time from them on.

They actually started doing really well so we just let them continue to roam. Then one of them came up missing so we decided to put them up. But anyway they were roosting pretty high in the trees and if we had left them out I believe they would have continued to thrive with maybe a loss or two once in awhile.

After we put them up they erred so flighty that we discontinued them and sold them off.

 

[Mini Meat]

A ferral flock would be awesome for me... provide I could round them up in the fall for culling. You could still manage breeding and improve the flock with careful observation an judicious culling.

 

[bramblefir]

The last full-blood Hamburg on the farm is totally feral. She prefers sleeping on one of the window ledges that faces into the large covered area behind the barn and can easily fly from the ground to the barn roof. None of the larger breed mixes that I have have survived as feral birds. The Hamburgs and Hamburg X's are amazingly paranoid alert and very tough.

 

[varidgerunner]

For harvesting from the feral flock, I have a long pole with a T at the top. Stick it under a bird until it perches on your pole and then lower it. At night of course and preferably not too moonlit.

The ones that I have, besides being a moving flower garden of sorts, serve the primary purpose of turning manure and helping with bug control, around barns used by other livestock. It seems that the bantams are just too small, every predatory bird can take them on without hesitation. Any chicken that can fly is pretty safe from most of the mammal predators. If it isn't a breed that goes broody, there won't be any natural flock recruitment to offset predator losses. You will loose some chicks, and a hen every now and then. It is surprising how well they can do.

The advantage that the games have is their super long lifespan. That means that once a hen survives and learns her habitat, she can teach her daughters and so on, where to roost and nest and where to find puddles for water, where the best bugs are. It can be kind of disheartening at first, as you go through some hens that weren't good flock matriarchs, but once you find one she can make it happen. I made the mistake of taking the flock matriarch out of her habitat. Thought I would use her to establish a new colony. Not only did she not make it, but the thriving colony I took her out of collapsed as well. It's not that predators got them, per se, but they shifted into a more inhabited area where they were not welcome, and I had to remove them. One of her daughters had some bad luck and a hen I had turned out took control and she was a little too used to human intervention. I'm just now getting them rebuilt. Lesson learned.

 

[Fentress]

Icelandics might be an option for a feral flock. They might be a bit faddish right now, so be careful where you get them from. They are basically a mutt to begin with.

 

[Fire Ant Farm]

I'd like to tap the experienced folks here for advice. I have my 10 New Hampshires and 13 Naked Necks on Purina Flock Raiser (20% protein), plus what they get in their tractor moved daily (no free ranging quite yet). They are just under 9 weeks old. Goals for these birds: All New Hampshires will go to freezer, as will some of the Naked Necks. Some of the Naked Necks will be kept as the origin of a meat flock (the remaining also to ultimately go to freezer camp). All are fed the same feed (coop for the NN keepers not finished yet).

Is it "ok" to keep them on the 20% protein feed (Flock Raiser), which is working well, and is indicated "for meat birds" per package, or would it be prudent to find a way to separate out some of my NN pullets out and begin to feed them a grower ration (decreased protein). Note that I am not focused on egg production for these birds specifically (I'll have plenty as it is) - I just want to ensure their good and proper growth as future breeders.

I've got books galore, but am also interested from y'all's experience in the sense of "breeding for production". Looking for opinions - share 'em if you got 'em!

- Ant Farm

(To clarify: It is not that egg production isn't important, per se, it's that I personally will have tons of eggs, and that the primary focus for these birds will be meat production - so choices that may affect an individual pullet's future productivity egg-wise, independent of genetics, are less important that making sure I don't impair their breeding ability - if they are different.)

 

[Beer can]

Ant Farm, no experience here but I'm still feeding my sussex and giants 20%, I figure they are still growing. I plan on sticking to it and adding oyster shell on the side when they start laying. They are my breeder flock, keepers though.

 

[bnjrob]

I'd like to tap the experienced folks here for advice. I have my 10 New Hampshires and 13 Naked Necks on Purina Flock Raiser (20% protein), plus what they get in their tractor moved daily (no free ranging quite yet). They are just under 9 weeks old. Goals for these birds: All New Hampshires will go to freezer, as will some of the Naked Necks. Some of the Naked Necks will be kept as the origin of a meat flock (the remaining also to ultimately go to freezer camp). All are fed the same feed (coop for the NN keepers not finished yet).

Is it "ok" to keep them on the 20% protein feed (Flock Raiser), which is working well, and is indicated "for meat birds" per package, or would it be prudent to find a way to separate out some of my NN pullets out and begin to feed them a grower ration (decreased protein). Note that I am not focused on egg production for these birds specifically (I'll have plenty as it is) - I just want to ensure their good and proper growth as future breeders.

I've got books galore, but am also interested from y'all's experience in the sense of "breeding for production". Looking for opinions - share 'em if you got 'em!

- Ant Farm

(To clarify: It is not that egg production isn't important, per se, it's that I personally will have tons of eggs, and that the primary focus for these birds will be meat production - so choices that may affect an individual pullet's future productivity egg-wise, independent of genetics, are less important that making sure I don't impair their breeding ability - if they are different.)

Haven't had a problem feeding Flock Raiser. We start our chickens at a higher protein and then take them to the Flock Raiser at about 4 months old. We've got dual-purpose birds that we do eat, so we want ours to have the available protein to build that muscle meat.

 

[bramblefir]

I'd like to tap the experienced folks here for advice. I have my 10 New Hampshires and 13 Naked Necks on Purina Flock Raiser (20% protein), plus what they get in their tractor moved daily (no free ranging quite yet). They are just under 9 weeks old. Goals for these birds: All New Hampshires will go to freezer, as will some of the Naked Necks. Some of the Naked Necks will be kept as the origin of a meat flock (the remaining also to ultimately go to freezer camp). All are fed the same feed (coop for the NN keepers not finished yet).

Is it "ok" to keep them on the 20% protein feed (Flock Raiser), which is working well, and is indicated "for meat birds" per package, or would it be prudent to find a way to separate out some of my NN pullets out and begin to feed them a grower ration (decreased protein). Note that I am not focused on egg production for these birds specifically (I'll have plenty as it is) - I just want to ensure their good and proper growth as future breeders.

I've got books galore, but am also interested from y'all's experience in the sense of "breeding for production". Looking for opinions - share 'em if you got 'em!

- Ant Farm

(To clarify: It is not that egg production isn't important, per se, it's that I personally will have tons of eggs, and that the primary focus for these birds will be meat production - so choices that may affect an individual pullet's future productivity egg-wise, independent of genetics, are less important that making sure I don't impair their breeding ability - if they are different.)

I feed a 19% poultry feed to all of my birds with oyster shell available free choice. They of course get scraps and whatever they scrounge up while ranging (spilled grain and alfalfa from larger livestock, mushrooms, insects, greens, etc.).

Protein primarily goes to feathers, muscle, and also into the eggs. I feel that it's good for all breeding stock to be on a slightly higher protein feed than just a backyard layer flock which does just fine on the 14-16% layer rations. Breeding ability will be most greatly affected by too much fat. Some breeds are more prone to "obesity" than others and I see it much more in backyard flocks where the birds get lots of high energy treats (scratch grains, cracked corn, sunflower seeds, etc) and are limited in space. Most backyard owners don't realize that they're participating in the good old fashioned method of finishing livestock for butchering and just think they're spoiling their pets.

 

[Fire Ant Farm]

I feed a 19% poultry feed to all of my birds with oyster shell available free choice. They of course get scraps and whatever they scrounge up while ranging (spilled grain and alfalfa from larger livestock, mushrooms, insects, greens, etc.).

Protein primarily goes to feathers, muscle, and also into the eggs. I feel that it's good for all breeding stock to be on a slightly higher protein feed than just a backyard layer flock which does just fine on the 14-16% layer rations. Breeding ability will be most greatly affected by too much fat. Some breeds are more prone to "obesity" than others and I see it much more in backyard flocks where the birds get lots of high energy treats (scratch grains, cracked corn, sunflower seeds, etc) and are limited in space. Most backyard owners don't realize that they're participating in the good old fashioned method of finishing livestock for butchering and just think they're spoiling their pets.

Very helpful. I do have some laying pullets (Cream Legbars) on Layena Plus - but they are weird picky birds about their feed (OMG, don't get me started!), and actually prefer it. If I breed them, I may try to mix in the Flock Raiser. But regardless, after trying a number of things (fancy schmancy non-GMO organic blah, blah, blah), I've been very pleased with Flock Raiser, would love to keep it long term as the main feed for (almost) everyone. But there's some good experience here, so I thought I'd check. Also, there's some scary stuff about how "horrible" it is to feed higher protein to pullets that I've read - not sure I buy that for a meat flock or breeders - non-hatching eggs from them will just be bonuses.

- Ant Farm