BREEDING FOR PRODUCTION...EGGS AND OR MEAT.

[Rock Home Isle]

Well, I guess I qualify as " hot weather chicken people" and I have a bunch of black copper Marans. The roosters seem to struggle a bit more than the hens, and I keep a close eye on them. Mine like to dig holes in the muddy areas and wallow in it like pigs, so they usually look like ****, but they look happy about it. Haven't lost any yet this season.

I want to see some pictures of this....

 

[DesertChic]

Ahhh.... Now that you mention it, it is the boys who look like they're struggling more than the girls, which is I think why I may have noticed it.

It is mostly the youngest birds that have their mouths open. And the last batch (5 weeks ahead of the youngest group, now about 15 weeks old or so) used to worry me with their beaks open in the shade in 80-degree weather at 9-10 weeks old. Now they are totally fine (and it's hotter). As they are in age cohorts (artificially hatched), I wonder if the older group finally "learned" the best ways to adapt and cool off. Thinking that when I get to my goal of raising chicks in a flock with older birds, then perhaps they'll learn from the older birds? Bee, that would fit your experience - you are a broody-hatch kinda person, right? (Though I agree that a healthy/strong bird will do better than a weak bird under environmental stress - I know this may sound harsh, but that's why I refuse to put out ice water, etc., until it gets REALLY hot - they need to make it in 90 degree weather without too much coddling.)

DesertChic, I'm hoping to get a naked neck on just about everything eventually...

- Ant Farm

OMG! I had to read your comment to me twice. I thought you said you hope to get NAKED on just about everything. TMI! TMI! LOL!

(Yes...the heat is frying my brain.I'm beyond punchy at this point.)

 

[Fire Ant Farm]

Quote:

I'm never going to be able to look at my Naked Neck roosters again with a straight face - I'll hear his voice in my head talking to the girls: "Imma bout to get NAKED on all y'all..."

- Ant Farm

 

[Beekissed]

Ahhh.... Now that you mention it, it is the boys who look like they're struggling more than the girls, which is I think why I may have noticed it.

It is mostly the youngest birds that have their mouths open. And the last batch (5 weeks ahead of the youngest group, now about 15 weeks old or so) used to worry me with their beaks open in the shade in 80-degree weather at 9-10 weeks old. Now they are totally fine (and it's hotter). As they are in age cohorts (artificially hatched), I wonder if the older group finally "learned" the best ways to adapt and cool off. Thinking that when I get to my goal of raising chicks in a flock with older birds, then perhaps they'll learn from the older birds? Bee, that would fit your experience - you are a broody-hatch kinda person, right? (Though I agree that a healthy/strong bird will do better than a weak bird under environmental stress - I know this may sound harsh, but that's why I refuse to put out ice water, etc., until it gets REALLY hot - they need to make it in 90 degree weather without too much coddling.)

DesertChic, I'm hoping to get a naked neck on just about everything eventually...

- Ant Farm

Could be your younger birds were having more trouble in the heat due to not having deep enough feathers on their bodies....I know that sounds counterintuitive, but a better feather quality on a bird will insulate them both in the winter and also in the summer months. I don't think it has anything to do with broody raised or not....all of mine act the same, though I haven't noticed any of my young birds suffering in the heat...they are too busy hunting for their food to think about the heat much. Maybe their more natural diet keeps them cooler as well?

No matter how hot and humid the weather, I don't ever put ice in the water or anything like that. Good shade, cool dusting spots, clean water and a light diet for hot weather. I keep my water for them in a black feed pan that sits down in an old tire and that is under shelter, so it stays pretty cool and fresh if you don't count the dog slobbers. After all that, any bird that doesn't do well is a natural cull. A flock just isn't sustainable without that level of hardiness in all weathers and I can't see the sense in breeding birds that need a ton of maintenance to stay alive.

 

[Fire Ant Farm]

Quote: Oh, now THAT'S an interesting idea - you may have something there. Also on your other statement - they are totally ok when actively wandering around eating grass and bugs = it's when they've decided to sit still somewhere that they start to look uncomfortable. (This group is in pretty deep shade all day, coop and run.) And fewer and fewer sit still as they get older. (They got a late introduction to foraging because of the really heavy aerial predator pressure due to hawk/owl nests on my property, lots of stray cats, and the fact that I work during the day and have no LGD.)

Yeah, my goal is to have (or eventually breed) birds that don't need extra help at all. When it gets over 104F for a lot of days in a row (which it does here), I will do something, but many years, 90+ weather is half the year. This is actually why I decided not to raise meat rabbits (though I got right up to the point of planning their housing and putting my name down for a quad of heat resistant New Zealands). Our friends in California have already been dealing with temps of 115F, and I could understand needing to really think about how to protect birds of any breed in those extremes.

I'm interested in what you (and other folks) feed in the hot weather. You say light diet (and I know yours forage widely), whereas I've read elsewhere that appetite is suppressed in hot weather, so it should be more dense/protein rich. Thoughts? What about growing chicks? (Mine are on a paired rotating paddock system, and always have fresh ground and greens in one of each "family's" two paddocks.)

- Ant Farm

 

[ronott1]

Oh, now THAT'S an interesting idea - you may have something there. Also on your other statement - they are totally ok when actively wandering around eating grass and bugs = it's when they've decided to sit still somewhere that they start to look uncomfortable. (This group is in pretty deep shade all day, coop and run.) And fewer and fewer sit still as they get older. (They got a late introduction to foraging because of the really heavy aerial predator pressure due to hawk/owl nests on my property, lots of stray cats, and the fact that I work during the day and have no LGD.)

Yeah, my goal is to have (or eventually breed) birds that don't need extra help at all. When it gets over 104F for a lot of days in a row (which it does here), I will do something, but many years, 90+ weather is half the year. This is actually why I decided not to raise meat rabbits (though I got right up to the point of planning their housing and putting my name down for a quad of heat resistant New Zealands). Our friends in California have already been dealing with temps of 115F, and I could understand needing to really think about how to protect birds of any breed in those extremes.

I'm interested in what you (and other folks) feed in the hot weather. You say light diet (and I know yours forage widely), whereas I've read elsewhere that appetite is suppressed in hot weather, so it should be more dense/protein rich. Thoughts? What about growing chicks? (Mine are on a paired rotating paddock system, and always have fresh ground and greens in one of each "family's" two paddocks.)

- Ant Farm

You are correct!

Imagine what you would have to do if you lived in one of those Arabic places where the temps get over 130F. Remember that what works in one place will not work in all places. You need to adjust for both climate and breed. There are breeds that cannot take temps over 80 and it does not have to do with health. It is a breed characteristic.

You might be able to selectively breed for individuals that can take the heat. That would mean having a lot of them die though. It would be better to pick breeds that live and do well in your climate.

In other words, find out what some of the old timers have and get your flock from them.

 

[Fire Ant Farm]

Quote:
Yes - this time of year (when things being to get hot), I watch the chickens very carefully (hence my obsessiveness and all my questions) - specifically those breeds/lines that are new to me (still building my flock and "trying out" some different breeds). Whether I decide to actually cull or not, I won't breed from a bird that struggles in the heat. But I learned before I ever had chickens, via gardening, the importance of varieties suited to one's local climate, and have only gotten chicks or hatching eggs form Florida, Arizona, or Texas.

- Ant Farm

Edit to add: As I also have all kinds of NN cross ideas, I can understand DesertChic's desire to keep her Biels alive long enough to get a more heat resistant NN cross out of them. But I also have to thank her for sharing her experiences here - I have loved the look and characteristics of the Biel, but if they may struggle in the heat, I will take a pass (and I did...).

 

[Beekissed]

Oh, now THAT'S an interesting idea - you may have something there. Also on your other statement - they are totally ok when actively wandering around eating grass and bugs = it's when they've decided to sit still somewhere that they start to look uncomfortable. (This group is in pretty deep shade all day, coop and run.) And fewer and fewer sit still as they get older. (They got a late introduction to foraging because of the really heavy aerial predator pressure due to hawk/owl nests on my property, lots of stray cats, and the fact that I work during the day and have no LGD.)

Yeah, my goal is to have (or eventually breed) birds that don't need extra help at all. When it gets over 104F for a lot of days in a row (which it does here), I will do something, but many years, 90+ weather is half the year. This is actually why I decided not to raise meat rabbits (though I got right up to the point of planning their housing and putting my name down for a quad of heat resistant New Zealands). Our friends in California have already been dealing with temps of 115F, and I could understand needing to really think about how to protect birds of any breed in those extremes.

I'm interested in what you (and other folks) feed in the hot weather. You say light diet (and I know yours forage widely), whereas I've read elsewhere that appetite is suppressed in hot weather, so it should be more dense/protein rich. Thoughts? What about growing chicks? (Mine are on a paired rotating paddock system, and always have fresh ground and greens in one of each "family's" two paddocks.)

- Ant Farm

I always feed the same feed all year round, though in the winter months I cut it with a whole grain like oats or barley. I feed simple layer mash that has been fermented. During the hotter days/months the birds let me know how much of that to feed....moderately hot days(90s) in the spring/early summer they will usually rely more on foraged feeds and I barely feed anything....a few small scoops for the whole flock, if that. Some days not even a whole scoop.

Later in the summer when it's that hot, they tend to not want to forage as much, so they get fed a little more. Come late Aug/Sept. on to winter they barely eat anything at all in the coop....fall is a forage bonanza and even if the weather stays hot, the nights are cool and the grass nutritive values climb, especially in the morning and evening, so they don't rely on the commercial feed much at all but put on fat like crazy.

My growing chicks, particularly after they've split off from their mothers, hardly ever get any grain based feeds at all....a few mouthfuls snatched when they can, but the cockerels, in particular, pretty much exist entirely on what they forage. The chicks are truly raised on foraged feeds for almost their entire diet, from 1 wk onward until they reach full size and are able to maintain their feeding rights at the feeder. The cockerels usually split off for good long about then, as the older hens nor the reigning male will let them in the coop at feeding time....those fellows pretty much eat wild until butcher time. Last year they were all rolling in fat....I've never seen that much fat on cockerels in my life...or on any rooster, for that matter. I was stunned at how well conditioned those birds were on foraged feeds. Needless to say, I'll be doing the same thing this year and, hopefully, netting the same results....cockerels that get fat without me spending a dime on them.

 

[Fire Ant Farm]

Quote:
Thank you - very instructive. And I recall some photos of exactly how much fat your cockerels had on them. Indeed, that was impressive...

- Ant Farm

 

[3riverschick]

Well, I guess I qualify as " hot weather chicken people" and I have a bunch of black copper Marans. The roosters seem to struggle a bit more than the hens, and I keep a close eye on them. Mine like to dig holes in the muddy areas and wallow in it like pigs, so they usually look like ****, but they look happy about it. Haven't lost any yet this season.

That makes sense, since they are a French swamp chicken.

Best,

Karen
( I do not like Windows 10, sigh)