Bumblefoot/Frostbite/Injury/Something else? Photos

[lonnyandrinda]

Prelude- this is an approximately 10 month old Black Copper Marans pullet. First noticed her acting "off" a week ago but didn't pick her up for examination until yesterday and immediately brought her in the house.

Does this look like frostbite to anyone with frostbite experience? At first I thought bumblefoot, but there is no core or scab. There is a small bubble of skin between two toes that at first I thought was an injury that maybe had left her foot vulnerable to infection. But it has been unusually cold here (single digit F with wind chills in the negative) and she is at the bottom of the pecking order.... so frostbite is a distinct possibility except it only affected one foot? Her foot as you can see is very swollen and tender. When I first noticed she was walking funny and looked at her feet they were so swollen there was blood oozing out between her scales. I feel awful but we all know how well chickens hide illness or injury, plus her heavy foot feathering hid the swelling. There are no blackened or white spots as I would expect with frostbite. She barely walks and only eats and drinks with encouragement. I've brought her into the house and have been doing epsom salt soaks, Vetericyn spray, triple antibiotic cream, and betadine on the bandaging. Also tetracycline in her water because that's all I have onhand but have ordered some Amoxicillin online that should be here Saturday. Pen G has also been a suggested treatment but I've heard others including vets and experts say the "caine" ingredient can be harmful or fatal to chickens.

This photo is pre-soak yesterday.




She loved her spa day and drank several Tablespoons of medicine water after the soak started to relax her.


Here you can kind of see the wound or blister between two toes (the two I'm holding apart). That and the weather are the only factors pointing me to frostbite.


I am unsure what to do beyond soaks, bandaging and antibiotics. If it is bumblefoot, will a core eventually form? If it is frostbite I should start to see blackened spots within a few days? I've dealt with frostbitten combs but never had frostbite on the feet. If it is infection I hope these antibiotics take care of it. Poor girl, you can tell it really hurts. She did take a few nibbles of scrambled egg this afternoon and again tonight. Ate one mealworm beetle but wouldn't touch any worms. She will eat and drink if she is "soaking" or if I support her body up to the food and water.

 

[TheChickInn]

Awww. poor thing! It doesn't really look like bumblefoot to me- that usually presents as a round nodule, not a whole-foot swelling. Hopefully it's just a mild case of frostbite. The only other thing I can think of that causes swollen feet is infectious synovitis, I've only read about this in books though, so I really can't offer any good advice. Good luck, hope she is feeling better soon.

 

[ronott1]

Prelude- this is an approximately 10 month old Black Copper Marans pullet. First noticed her acting "off" a week ago but didn't pick her up for examination until yesterday and immediately brought her in the house.

Does this look like frostbite to anyone with frostbite experience? At first I thought bumblefoot, but there is no core or scab. There is a small bubble of skin between two toes that at first I thought was an injury that maybe had left her foot vulnerable to infection. But it has been unusually cold here (single digit F with wind chills in the negative) and she is at the bottom of the pecking order.... so frostbite is a distinct possibility except it only affected one foot? Her foot as you can see is very swollen and tender. When I first noticed she was walking funny and looked at her feet they were so swollen there was blood oozing out between her scales. I feel awful but we all know how well chickens hide illness or injury, plus her heavy foot feathering hid the swelling. There are no blackened or white spots as I would expect with frostbite. She barely walks and only eats and drinks with encouragement. I've brought her into the house and have been doing epsom salt soaks, Vetericyn spray, triple antibiotic cream, and betadine on the bandaging. Also tetracycline in her water because that's all I have onhand but have ordered some Amoxicillin online that should be here Saturday. Pen G has also been a suggested treatment but I've heard others including vets and experts say the "caine" ingredient can be harmful or fatal to chickens.

This photo is pre-soak yesterday.




She loved her spa day and drank several Tablespoons of medicine water after the soak started to relax her.


Here you can kind of see the wound or blister between two toes (the two I'm holding apart). That and the weather are the only factors pointing me to frostbite.


I am unsure what to do beyond soaks, bandaging and antibiotics. If it is bumblefoot, will a core eventually form? If it is frostbite I should start to see blackened spots within a few days? I've dealt with frostbitten combs but never had frostbite on the feet. If it is infection I hope these antibiotics take care of it. Poor girl, you can tell it really hurts. She did take a few nibbles of scrambled egg this afternoon and again tonight. Ate one mealworm beetle but wouldn't touch any worms. She will eat and drink if she is "soaking" or if I support her body up to the food and water.

I do not have experience with frostbite or Bumble Foot. I have seen pictures of Bumble foot and they do not look like that.

occam's razor says when you have two competing theories that make exactly the same predictions, the simpler one is the better. If it has been very cold, then it is likely frostbite. Hopefully someone can help with what to do for chickens.

Sorry she has hurt feet!

 

[lonnyandrinda]

Awww. poor thing! It doesn't really look like bumblefoot to me- that usually presents as a round nodule, not a whole-foot swelling. Hopefully it's just a mild case of frostbite. The only other thing I can think of that causes swollen feet is infectious synovitis, I've only read about this in books though, so I really can't offer any good advice. Good luck, hope she is feeling better soon.

Did some research and although it COULD be M. synovitis I don't really think it is.

I do not have experience with frostbite or Bumble Foot. I have seen pictures of Bumble foot and they do not look like that.

occam's razor says when you have two competing theories that make exactly the same predictions, the simpler one is the better. If it has been very cold, then it is likely frostbite. Hopefully someone can help with what to do for chickens.

Sorry she has hurt feet!

After more research and looking at lots of icky pictures I found another BYC thread whose hen's foot looks almost exactly like mine, and it was frostbite. Guess I have some toe loss to look forward to. Hopefully she will still retain most of her foot, poor girl!

https://www.backyardchickens.com/t/736128/bumps-on-feet-but-not-bumblefoot

 

[speckledhen]

In the photo where I see the bottom of her right foot, I see a spot that could be a point of entry for bumblefoot, which corresponds to the thing on top between her toes. Doesn't look much like frostbite, but I've had limited experience with that; she could have some minor frostbite, though. Frostbite can make toes yellowish-whitish, skin will peel off like she's been standing in water a long time. She doesn't have black crusty areas on the bottoms of her feet. Here is a picture of frostbitten rooster feet:

 

[1muttsfan]

The -caine ingredient you want to avoid is Benzacaine, or long-acting penicillin. Procaine Pen G is the one you can use.

Hope your hen does well. It does not, to me, look like frostbite, although it could be that the cold exacerbated an injury or infection.

 

[Hangtown Farms]

Poor thing hope she's ok

 

[speckledhen]

The -caine ingredient you want to avoid is Benzacaine, or long-acting penicillin. Procaine Pen G is the one you can use.

Hope your hen does well. It does not, to me, look like frostbite, although it could be that the cold exacerbated an injury or infection.

True that extreme cold could make the injury worse. I've always used Penicillin procaine, which is not the same as a "caine" anesthetic. If there is frostbite, you would want to use penicillin to offset any developing infection. I never use it specifically for bumblefoot because treating it topically does more good, however, we are not really sure what the deal is with the hen. It's hard to say when we cannot see it in person. This cold is making everything worse, certainly, so if there is some infection, decreased circulation from the cold could turn it into something sinister.

 

[lonnyandrinda]

Hm. The swelling is better today, the pad is much less tight. But she wouldn't eat or drink this morning even after soaking her feet. Will go to atwoods this afternoon to look for Penicillin then. Thanks for the ideas.

 

[speckledhen]

Her general look says something else is going on besides her feet. At least, that's what I'd think if she was here at my place. Her comb is shrunken and she looks just puny. Is she laying?