BW quail chicks dying, dont know why havent had this happen in 5 years

[JJMR794]

You Said They Were 4 Days Old? Thats About The Time The Yolk Nutrition Is Finished.... Are You Sure That They Are All Eating? You Have Some Older Quail-- 6 Wks I Beleive? Try Using A Couple Of Them As Brooder Nannies To Show The Bitys How To Eat/ Drink. Maybe That Will Help?

 

[randyandmegs]

Thanks for the suggestions. I not only filled the feeders but I sprinked it around the floor. Im going back in a little while to check them out and see if removing the shavings has fixed it. Funny you say that about nannies. Some 6 week old birds had gotten out of their pen because I forgot to latch the door good. They were in their brooder eatting away at that started feed so I guess In a way I did do that by accident. I have have had probably 40-50 hatches in last 5 years and have not had any issues past the first year and the learning curve that goes along with getting into this hobbie. This is something new I have researched this hobby a lot and learned a lot through trail and error, this problem now is just got me baffled.

Off the subject: Starting out 5 years ago I would have a good many spraddle legged chicks born, my soon to be wife and I (she is a nurse and Im a Paramedic) would hobble their legs wit a small strip of bandaid. Within a few days we would have the leg problems corrected. We dont have that problem anymore. I think it was a temp issue that was causing that. I had stable footing for them at that time. I just love this website and all the helpful infomation. I keep trying to post pictures of what I have done to pay it forward for all those who have helped me learn in the past.

 

[CountryMom]

I started last year with bobwhite quail. I can say they are a challange at times. I use long retangle shaped storage containers for ours and yes they have corners. I haven't had any die from piling up since we don't have but about 50 in there at a time. However, I have figured out that they do better if you top the shavings with paper towel. I haven't had any spraddle leg issues since I started topping their shavings. I either tuck the sides under the shavings or use that blue masking tape for painting and tape the paper towel to the sides. I then just change out the papertowel unless it has gotten very damp under there in the shavings. The only losses I have had recently were when the temps started hitting 100+ here and we were gone for two days. I think they got over heated and passed. Lost about 15. I have since then moved them into the area of my quail barn that has a fan and the new batch has done great - without the heat lamp also.

 

[randyandmegs]

Shavings have been completely removed and vaccumed out of brooder. That was 2 1/2 days ago. They are still dying like left and right. Out of 500 chicks im under 100 now and still no clue why. Temp checked out. Shavings wasnt the problem. Im left now with only one other conclusion. I have 3 pens beside them with adult birds on wire floors. They are about a foot off the ground. Im using a converted milking barn with an area to wash out droppings on the side from under all 3 pens. The only other thing I can think is that I havnt had that grown bird in there before and their droppings may be creating too much of a gas before I am getting them cleaned out killing the chicks. Anybody else have any other ideas im all open for suggestions to try. I have another 700 hatching in 2 more weeks and fear that this is going to repeat itself for the 3rd time this year.

 

[JJMR794]

Either 1. They Were Already Sick From The Shavings And The Damage Was Done Before You Removed Them, 2. You May Be Experiencing The "gas" Effect You Describe, 3. You May Have A Contagen That The Older Birds Are Carrying, But Not Actually Succumbing To Themselves, 4. Is This The Exact Same Spot You Have Always Used? Could It Be A Ground Contamination? Any Gas/ Diesel Fuel/ Kerosine Nearby? Perhaps Its A Inhalation Poison(chemical Pnuemonia) ? Is The Area Well Ventilated?--- I Say This Because As The Ambient Temp Rises The Fumes Or Inhalents Will Be More Readily Given Off--- And Reach More Deadly Inhalation Levels....

I Dunno, I'm Grasping At Straws Like You....

Any Other Transmission Factors? Possums, Wild Birds, Other Fowl Wandering Nearby? I Once Had A Brooder Nannie (young Hen Chicken We Used To Brood Babies) Pass A Coryza Like Illness To A Whole Batch Of Baby Pheasants Yet She Has Never Been Ill A Day In Her Life. I Have Had Batches Of Quail Come Out With Encephalitis, Which Is Readily Spread Thru The Egg From Hen To Embryo And Wipe Out An Entire Hatch. One Thing For Sure--- Gamebird Hatching And Brooding Can Certainly Drive You To Drink At Times!

 

[randyandmegs]

I cleaned the other pens like crazy hopefully to eliminate any gases that may be created. It is the exact same spot I have used the last year and 1/2. No fumes nearby that could be bothering them. The barn has 6 large windows plus I added a small osclilating fan to move the air but its not pointing at or near them. They are still dying. My next move is to switch the feed and see if that helps. I use a good quaility 28% feed but that could be the problem. I will keep trying and let you know.

 

[randyandmegs]

Ok got the results in from the North Carolina Vet. Diagnostic Laboratory System. I need advice once again if anyone knows anything about this bacteria.

My birds were dying from
Diagnosis: Bacterial Enteritis and Septicemia - Enterococcus sp.

I know the septicemia means throughout the whole body but everthing else if foreign to me almost.

Looks like they tested 8 different treatments on it to which most were resistant.

I have serveral pages of information they sent so I will try and be brief.

Erythromycin....................................... Sensitive
Gentamicin...........................................Intermediate
Penicillin...............................................Sensitive
Spectinomycin......................................Resistant
Sulfisoxazole........................................Resistant
Tetracycline..........................................Resistant
Trimethoprim/Sulfamethoxazole..........Sensitive

Can anyone offer any help on my problem? Where did it come from and how do I treat it. I went back to medicated feed but the vet said the Amprolium in my feed wont work on this bacteria. He actually said there was very little know about this bacteria that he could find as far a treatment. At least I know finally what the problem was now I just need to know how to fix it.

Thanks,
Randy

 

[farrier!]

So sorry for all you have gone through. I have been following this thread because it was close to what happened with my one hatch.

There are things out there that can pass into the egg. With early deaths not associated with management this seems to be the cause. Luckily the ones that live do fine.

How clean the brooder is does not help much. The chicks were infected before hatching...

If you feel you still have sick quail any of the "sensitive" antibiotics will work.

 

[AK_Button_Mama]

ok here is my suggestions on this topic... first off you should obtain some VANODINE look it up on the net. its amazing stuff (I even use it on myself-though the label says not to be used on humnas.) once you get the vanodine you should mix it as a eggwash. it comes with instructions on how to mix it to make it effective for several uses... you would use this as a mash when you move the eggs to the hatching area! just spray it on (or dunk in the juice for a second) then in the bator to dry off.

I know allot of people are gonna say that washed the Bloom off.... well I have to tell you that I dont care about the bloom. I want healthy chicks. I have set eggs that have been washed and refridgerated and got the same hatch rate as eggs that werent washed or refridgerated.. so to tell you the truth I would rather wash the eggs off and have one less contaminate to contend with one the chicks are born! also this vanodine can be used in the incubator you can spray it in and wipe it out to sanitize the baotr and hatcher.. this stuff can even be sprayed in the air whith live animals to clean cages and it doesnt affect the animals. (used it on rabbits when I had pasturella issues)

your test results say that the bacteria is sensitve to penicillin. I would get some water soluable penicillin and treat all yout bird with it for 14 days. (the other options are the three other antibacteria that it was sensitive to.) amprolim isnt gonna work. so its prolly best to take them off the food that has it in it. we used medicated feeds too much....this is why we have bacteria that resistant.. but I am just as guilty of feeding medicated feeds. I use it till they start laying! so i am no angel! just a suggestion if your treating with penicillin removed the medicated feed.

ok enteritis is basically angry bowels..... and of course the bacterial is bacteria---so what you have on your hands is angry bowels from bacteria.. its kinda nuts that they went thru the trouble of doing a culture and sensitiviy test without telling you the specific bacteria that is causing the bacterial enteritis.. B.E. is a very broad term. but apparently they did a sensitvity on the birds and were able to tell you what antibodics to use... thats a good thing!

as far as what to do..... I would clean pens treat birds that are sick with the medication that the lab recommended....

where did it come from.... well the best thing I can tell you is that bacteria is ubiquitous... its every where... no telling where it came from and there are to many variables to think about to discover where it came from.... (the WHO cant even figure out some of the really big diseases) so dont make your self mad trying to figure it out. the best thing to do it treat the issues and move on! it happens.. it sucks... but it hapens!

good luck and let us all know how it works out!

 

[JJMR794]

Ok Randy Lets See Here--- As Far As Treatment Get Erythromycin Or Penicillin From Cutlers Or Another Suitable Source So You're Ready For The Next Go Round! If It Happens Again.

Now If It Were Me I'd Completely "nuke" Everything! Anything That Babies Can Come In Contact With! The Brooder, All Your Appliances Used, The Ground On Which You Place The Brooder, The Watering System, The Feeders, The Incubator, The Hatcher, The Heat Lights==== I Mean Everything!!!!!!!!!!!! Make A Bleach Water Solution---- 1 To 2 Cups Per Gallon Of Water--- Soak All Items In The Solution For 30 Minutes And Then Allow To Air Dry. As Far As The Ground I'd Bleach The Heck Outta It 3 Or 4 Times Over The Next 2 Weeks And I''d Do It A Day Before I Set The Brooder On It Again For Use (note As Soon As It Air Dires All Chlorine Is Disapated) I Use This Exact Technique With Everything Here On The Farm Every Week--- I Bleach All Brooders, And Appliances Every Weekend And If I Am Taking An Appliance From 1 Brooder To Another It Gets Bleached And Dried Before It Gets Used In Brooder #2! This Is Our Own Internal "biosecurity" If You Will. It Has Worked Very Well To Protect Us From Any Such Outbreaks And The Only 1 I Did Have Was The Only Time I Broke My Routine!

My Moto Is "when In Doubt.... Bleach It All Out!"

So Far Its Worked Quite Well As Long As I Dont Get Stupid Or Lazy Or Both And Brake The Rule.