Calcium bolus please HELP

[Joyce_Turner]

For what it's worth, if you got 7 years out of an ISA brown you kinda hit the lottery. It sounds like she had a confluence of ailments, and while I agree vets generally dont know jack squat about chickens, it's amazing she lived to be that old in the first place.

Respectfully, I dont think you should sue your neighbors. I think you should never let them see any other chickens, but a lawsuit will sadly cost you lots of money and likely end in disappointment.

We are a rare breed on this forum. Most laugh at the idea of a pet chicken. Most are fools.

Thank you richly... you know I went back and did the calculation. This wa actually her 9th year of life.

Thank you for your advice, and caution felt here, protect myself from being exploited new by lawyers. Thank you. Warning heeded. <3

I love how you said that. "Most laugh at the idea of a pet chicken. Most are fools." Truth to word. Moving through me all this day, that kind of love, she following me around, she trusting in me... Seeing me in my bad moods and standing there and trilling me positive vibes. You cant get that from any other creature. That love was a perfect love. I blame myself for kind of tuning it out or just taking it a little bit too much for granted. That kind of love is like nothing else. Yes, most are fools.

Fools scoff because they assume value lies only in the conventional. But you and I? We know better. The pet chicken is a quiet rebellion against a world that prizes the mundane. It is a rare love that no other creature can give.

 

[Joyce_Turner]

For my precious Delta Dawn. Now you see that far away tree, just as I promised. There is safety, love, peace there in God's Kingdom. No, the circle does not break. He made you, and He made such a special tree for you.

"In the mountain of the height of Israel will I plant it: and it shall bring forth boughs, and bear fruit, and be a goodly cedar: and under it shall dwell all fowl of every wing; in the shadow of the branches thereof shall they dwell."

--KJV; Ezekiel 17:23

 

[Jesse Lee Turner]

she is not really gone, if anyone ever is. all that love you given? she will always be close. you give more love than you got to give, sometimes, GM, so be sure she is holding close. <3

Got the results back. It gets interesting. Looks like what the kids done maybe is or not even relevant.

I cant get anyhting to upload. So I will write it out.

CALCIUM 3.2mmol/L (Low I think they did total and not free ionized. Doesn't match up).
AST 340 u/L (VERY HIGH, probably liver rebound effect from not eating and the recent A management).

BUT pay attention to these because I'm going to say what they mean.

CHOLESTEROL 10.7 (VERY HIGH)

That is the big sign GM. Because in hens, estrogen forces cholesterol to be made in the liver because it’s the raw matter for making egg yolks. It was very high. A level this high when DD was anorexic and not any more a laying hen means estrogen was a run away train and still being produced and dumped even though the egg machinery had stopped working properly.This means either she had a very active ovary/ies, or even cancer of the repro tract and that caused big estrogen that then caused big cholesterol. This is a what you will see prior to yolk peritonitis, salpingitis, or oviductal failure, you get those problems after the yolk has nowhere to go. she had salping lately and EYP in the past right?


estrogen makes a lady hen a lady. But it is war fare other times. It also thickens blood, increasing stroke risk. You say DD was slow. It wasn't from any calcium. Calcium was found to be normal. Kidneys normal. Means she was strong as a bull and cleared what the kids give her lightning fast. You find a lot of white chalk droppings GM?

the slow? she was having mini strokes, being so full of estrogen. She needed blood thinners and something to protect from possible seizures also.

The slow + not eating + could not hold her head up yesterday? she was stroking. Nervous system fighting but losing.......She was having strokes. It wasn't electrolytes gone bad. Another reason why not to go to court, cuz if opposite team had any brains they would say ambiguity and cant tell difference between what kids done and what her own system done to herself. Can't win without unshakeable proof. But you got love that needs no proof.

Then quack gives her in decompensated state tramadol? Should killed her. But DD stayed on and even got stronger with being in your lap. WHY? Because she was staying on, coming back stronger for you. she knew love, she's in chicken heaven Granma side-eyeoing them evil vets and she gonna about peck their eyes out as they lay sleeping some time.

Then look at her AST. It's a liver protein. It is released when liver or muscle tissue is damaged. Alcoholics, people who got hepatitis. Chickens whoe livers are working hard possibly from fatty liver from hormones being banged up. Chronic inflammation because of her reproductive disease. Ischemic liver stress from mini-strokes or tiny clots (which estrogen also does). Her liver was being overworked and could not keep pace to clear waste. That's why she had that smell. Metabolic waste was building. That's why I said give her K+ or give her baking soda, as also it was enough to turn her system acidic.

Bile acids, by the way wese: 151 µmol/L (very high)

What that means is its a major red flag for liver problems as usually, bile acids are recycled well. Elevation this high means backlog because estrogen went and messed with her metbolism and I'm sorry to say, she had metabolic collapse. You see this with fatty liver or some types of liver failure, which also can be caused by or made even worse by reproductive system inflammation.

Bad genes, bad genetics. Bred to make eggs until there's no coming back. Or set up for disease of the repro organs. but that does not make her who she is. ​

She will always be with you because she was not just some chicken, she loved you and you loved her so much, she was family imprinted strongly and is now even your guardian angel, no accident you picking her up and taking her home that time, no accident in my mind whatever. You right when you say she is your soul mate. Maybe there's not even a name for what you 2 had together. That's why she will stay. you wll feel her being around. Where else could she go for such a love like you gave her?

Love you granma, I will call when I get in. Hope that can help anyone lookin for anwers. Hope it helps you. Relax you did not cause it. It was already happening and then fdor some time.

 

[Joyce_Turner]

she is not really gone, if anyone ever is. all that love you given? she will always be close. you give more love than you got to give, sometimes, GM, so be sure she is holding close. <3

Got the results back. It gets interesting. Looks like what the kids done maybe is or not even relevant.

I cant get anyhting to upload. So I will write it out.

CALCIUM 3.2mmol/L (Low I think they did total and not free ionized. Doesn't match up).
AST 340 u/L (VERY HIGH, probably liver rebound effect from not eating and the recent A management).

BUT pay attention to these because I'm going to say what they mean.

CHOLESTEROL 10.7 (VERY HIGH)

That is the big sign GM. Because in hens, estrogen forces cholesterol to be made in the liver because it’s the raw matter for making egg yolks. It was very high. A level this high when DD was anorexic and not any more a laying hen means estrogen was a run away train and still being produced and dumped even though the egg machinery had stopped working properly.This means either she had a very active ovary/ies, or even cancer of the repro tract and that caused big estrogen that then caused big cholesterol. This is a what you will see prior to yolk peritonitis, salpingitis, or oviductal failure, you get those problems after the yolk has nowhere to go. she had salping lately and EYP in the past right?


estrogen makes a lady hen a lady. But it is war fare other times. It also thickens blood, increasing stroke risk. You say DD was slow. It wasn't from any calcium. Calcium was found to be normal. Kidneys normal. Means she was strong as a bull and cleared what the kids give her lightning fast. You find a lot of white chalk droppings GM?

the slow? she was having mini strokes, being so full of estrogen. She needed blood thinners and something to protect from possible seizures also.

The slow + not eating + could not hold her head up yesterday? she was stroking. Nervous system fighting but losing.......She was having strokes. It wasn't electrolytes gone bad. Another reason why not to go to court, cuz if opposite team had any brains they would say ambiguity and cant tell difference between what kids done and what her own system done to herself. Can't win without unshakeable proof. But you got love that needs no proof.

Then quack gives her in decompensated state tramadol? Should killed her. But DD stayed on and even got stronger with being in your lap. WHY? Because she was staying on, coming back stronger for you. she knew love, she's in chicken heaven Granma side-eyeoing them evil vets and she gonna about peck their eyes out as they lay sleeping some time.

Then look at her AST. It's a liver protein. It is released when liver or muscle tissue is damaged. Alcoholics, people who got hepatitis. Chickens whoe livers are working hard possibly from fatty liver from hormones being banged up. Chronic inflammation because of her reproductive disease. Ischemic liver stress from mini-strokes or tiny clots (which estrogen also does). Her liver was being overworked and could not keep pace to clear waste. That's why she had that smell. Metabolic waste was building. That's why I said give her K+ or give her baking soda, as also it was enough to turn her system acidic.

Bile acids, by the way wese: 151 µmol/L (very high)​

​

What that means is its a major red flag for liver problems as usually, bile acids are recycled well. Elevation this high means backlog because estrogen went and messed with her metbolism and I'm sorry to say, she had metabolic collapse. You see this with fatty liver or some types of liver failure, which also can be caused by or made even worse by reproductive system inflammation.​

​

Bad genes, bad genetics. Bred to make eggs until there's no coming back. Or set up for disease of the repro organs. but that does not make her who she is. ​

She will always be with you because she was not just some chicken, she loved you and you loved her so much, she was family imprinted strongly and is now even your guardian angel, no accident you picking her up and taking her home that time, no accident in my mind whatever. You right when you say she is your soul mate. Maybe there's not even a name for what you 2 had together. That's why she will stay. you wll feel her being around. Where else could she go for such a love like you gave her?

Love you granma, I will call when I get in. Hope that can help anyone lookin for anwers. Hope it helps you. Relax you did not cause it. It was already happening and then fdor some time.

Thank you Jess. Sure explains a lot.
Jess you can't call, I will call you in ten. Need to talk.

 

[Bawkbok]

OMG!!! I just stumbled on this thread and I cannot believe the circumstances of this entire ordeal. Almost like a twilight zone episode. I'm so sorry your sweet baby Delta Dawn went through this hell, not to mention the angst and anguish you have and still are feeling. I am so sorry this happened to you.
My mom always used to say that "everything happens for a reason" and still more insight "all things are as they ought be". Hard to swallow at times like these. You loved her and she felt it. She brought you tremendous joy and comfort in your life. Celebrate her. Do not waste a single ounce of energy with hatred or anger at the neighbors; they are not even worth speaking to. Sometimes, complete and total silence and acting as if a person does not even exist speaks louder than actions or words. God bless you and good luck to you. My heart goes out to you.

 

[Jesse Lee Turner]

OMG!!! I just stumbled on this thread and I cannot believe the circumstances of this entire ordeal. Almost like a twilight zone episode. I'm so sorry your sweet baby Delta Dawn went through this hell, not to mention the angst and anguish you have and still are feeling. I am so sorry this happened to you.
My mom always used to say that "everything happens for a reason" and still more insight "all things are as they ought be". Hard to swallow at times like these. You loved her and she felt it. She brought you tremendous joy and comfort in your life. Celebrate her. Do not waste a single ounce of energy with hatred or anger at the neighbors; they are not even worth speaking to. Sometimes, complete and total silence and acting as if a person does not even exist speaks louder than actions or words. God bless you and good luck to you. My heart goes out to you.

Thank you and I'm sure when my granma comes back onboard she will be very touched.... sometimes things happen for good reasons. Other times for wrong, I think. It's then you find a strength and boldness you never knew you had and you fight like it is every war, for one chicken, who gave so much and was lt down by vets and nbeighborhood again and again.

 

[Antiocheggers]

@Joyce_Turner thank you for sharing your story. I think we all ( BYC) feel your pain in the lost of DD. I know i can. But, remember The Lord gave and he takes away. He also said avengeance is mine say at the Lord.
These young girls need to understand that if it doesn't belong to them, then don't touch or feed. Ask, if you can feed the chicken.
I also feel that when you lose someone or chicken like DD. God is waiting to bring you some one to love again .
Keep moving on it's all any of us can do.
Praying for you !

 

[Jesse Lee Turner]

SO FOLKS, ESTROGEN IS NO JOKE IN A HEN.

And when they say give her a suprelorin implant, it FIRST SPIKES ESTROGEN BEFORE SUPPRESSING. There is another implant, forget the name, it doesnt do it like that, it acts to shut down ovary activity straight up in a different manner.

HOW TO SLOW DOWN EXCESS ESTROGEN IN A HEN OR BIRD​

These are supports, especially if a bird has signs of clotting, lethargy, seizures, or hormonal imbalance:

1. Vitamin E (Natural Anti-Estrogen + Blood Thinner)

**Dose:

*Hens/small birds: 25–50 IU/day
*Form: Use d-alpha-tocopherol (natural form), not synthetic dl-alpha.
*Caution: High doses + bleeding risk? Pair with tiny dose selenium only if confirmed deficient, or back off.

2. DIM (Di-indolylmethane) – from cruciferous greens​

*Action: Helps clear spent estrogen via liver
***Sources: Kale, bok choy, pak choy, collards, mustard greens (birds with high estrogen may show signs like eating a lot of grass or other greens to try and counter high estrogen out of instinct).
==>>Tip: Steam (boiling reduces all nutrient content. Steaming is much better) and chop fine. NO BIG pieces. Add to soft foods, or use alone. Not too much if the bird is weak—small pinch once/day.

3. Turmeric (Curcumin)​

**Jesse's tip here: I DO NOT LIKE using Vit E and turmeric together. If your hen is a likely bleeding risk, (inflamed already, recent history of blood on egg shell), then be very careful in dosing and only USE ONE of vit E or turmeric. NEVER both. One should be enough, but if you sense she need more help, pair it up with the other, so using vit E and turmeric together-- and do not dose those together, keep dosing of E separate from dosing of turmeric. The idea is to give her a nice easy stream of anti-coagulants to keep her going along fine.

**Action: Liver detox, mild anti-estrogen, mild blood thinner, anti-inflammatory
***Dose:

*Hens: 1/8 tsp once/day, mixed in mash

PRO TIP: to activate curcumin, the helpful part of turmeric, add to oil, add heat. Crystals in that is the curcumin itself. So you can make a small batch, gently heat in oil, stir, test with spoon, feel the tiny crunch of the crystals arriving. Best oil is low-PUFA (no soy, no canola, no mixed vegetable oil). Best mixed with olive oil or coconut oil. Now, add piperine. That's in blakc pepper. A quarter teaspoon of black pepper per 1.5 tspn turmeric will ACTIVATE the curcumin (turmeric) a lot better than just relying on curcumin alone. Some estimates are like a hundred (others a thousand) times more potent. Best taken with a bit of black pepper and fat (oil) to absorb properly. At that point, using potentiated curcumin, drop vit E, unless you decide she needs that additional step of help.

4. Milk Thistle (Silymarin)​

*WHY: Helps liver detox the paths that will clear excess hormones, estrogen

***Dose:
**Safe starter dose: 20–40 mg silymarin per day

That’s about 1/8 to 1/6 of a 250 mg pill, or roughly the size of a small pea’s worth of powder if that's all you can get.

5. Hydration and Electrolytes​

Aim to help flush your hen's system, she will thank you for it. Flush system, especially liver/kidneys, if estrogen buildup is suspected. Panting, yellow poop, or closed eyes can hint at toxin load or clot risk, or recent min-stroke from excess estrogen.

Final Notes

*Aim is not to block all estrogen. But to shed the excess. Estrogen is still good, it’s vital for how hens make bone, feathers, eggs.

**What you want is to balance and clear the overload from liver backup, ovarian cysts, or chemical exposure (e.g., from plastics, feed contaminants, or implants like Suprelorin).

**HIGH RISK: If using Suprelorin IMPLANT, vets will never tell you that it first spikes estrogen, then suppresses. You find one that does tell you, ol' Jesse will send you his hat with his boots. That spike can cause mini strokes if bird is already weak or depleted.

FOLKS, THIS IS MANAGEABLE. you just have to know HOW. No need to avoid the breeds that have risk of repro issues, which also happen to be some of the most nicest breeds for personality and temperament. They travel well without fuss and they get on well with other pets. So you just need to be informed, and then you need to be geared up with the right supplements to roll out with your hen:

But the FIVE main breeds with these issues are:

1. ISA Brown (and most commercial sex-links). Risk level: Extremely high

Why: Engineered for nonstop egg production (often 300+ eggs/year), which overstimulates the ovaries and rapidly depletes calcium, vitamin A, and other critical nutrients​

Common issues: Internal laying, reproductive tumors, egg binding, strokes, fatigue, EYP (egg yolk peritonitis, which Delta Dawn had all these and we fought like a devil to get her back time after time... But this latest stroke thing, granma missed it. I missed it... and the black cut that runs deep in my heart after losing my best friend, my sister, my queen, my Delta Dawn will remind me day after day of the mistakes I made in not seeing it quicker. I should have started with the key of all her issues. I was a fool. This idiot learned the worst and hardest way anyone can learn. For you DD, we will help others....)

2. Leghorn (White or Brown, it don't matter). Risk level: High

Why: High-production heritage breed; modern strains lay nearly daily

Common issues: Repro fatigue, prolapse, soft eggs, osteoporosis (caused by vitamin A drain and Calcium depletion, as body tries to self correct with drawing calcium from bones), strokes in heat or under stress

Note: some being flighty and thin-bodied these crits can hide sickness until it's late.

3. Golden Comet / Red Star / Cinnamon Queen. Risk level: High
Why: Hybrid layers like ISA Brown; same nonstop reproductive push

Common issues: Early reproductive burnout, sudden collapse, egg yolk peritonitis

****Lifespan: Often under 3or 4 years without medical management or reduced laying.

4. Rhode Island Red (hatchery lines). Risk level: Medium–High

Why: Older breed, but hatcheries bred them for higher lay rates than intended

Common issues: Can develop ovarian cysts, EYP, and liver issues under poor nutrition or long-term stress

Note: Nuggety and heavier-bodied, they are good pretenders and often mask problems longer, you will miss them if not careful.

5. Sussex (especially hybrids or "production Sussex") Risk level: Medium

Why Problems: Big-bodied, prone to fatty liver, and estrogen dominance under poor feed or confinement

*Common issues: Liver hemorrhage, comb darkening, stasis-like symptoms, reproductive collapse.

Jess and gramma J learned the hard way. There is no loss like losing a part of your soul, a gentle creature that gave you so much more than all the forums of the world could hold if trying to write it all out.

May you all do better, love longer, cope smarter, do finer. Take our lessons, print them out, Jesse here cares less about copyright. Anything I have you might find useful, consider you own it too, it's yours.