Can anyone tell me if my chick is sick or if she is injured?

[californiachick74]

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I was under the impression you had let them out to freerange and not that they were in the garage... botulism is usually from a tainted water source or from an insect or a carcass (dead)...insects can also carry it from a carcass they have fed on (think mouse) or they can also carry toxic substances they have ingested (think if they fed on a mouse that had eaten mouse poison) .... it might be something toxic instead of botulism...it might be from a head injury (though you did not mention a head injury it can happen without showing outward injury)...

See thats the thing. They havent been outside at all yet. The only thing I have changed recently is moving them to the garage and instead of filling their box with pine shavings we bought straw. So they are now nesting on straw. Could she of eaten some of the straw and it made her sick?

Well I purchased some polyvisol it has vitamin E in it. 5IU to be exact. Now that I have seperated her from the flock she has a small lid filled with a bit of water. Do I just add 1 drop to that little bit of water? I guess Im asking if their is supposed to be a measured amount of water that I had the dropper full of vitamins too?

 

[dlhunicorn]

Which polyvisol formulation did you get (as I do not recall the enfamil having vit e?)
yes...there might have been something in the straw (straw contains sometimes mold spores or toxic weed seeds...)
that 5 IU is not at the kind of dosage recommended for neurological symptoms (200 to 400 is the therapeutic dosage level though you must have the selenium with it for it to be absorbed at that dosage) ... however, go ahead and try just that and see if it helps... I am assuming that if it were (extreme) botulism she would be drooling and totally unable to stand by now so as far as that goes things are looking positive!
Separate and keep on shavings and so you can monitor her (feed and water) and keep her out of any drafts or environmental stress which would exascerbate things.
Give straight into beak the first time and keep dribbling water with electrolytes. Have you plans for getting the handfeeding formula?

 

[californiachick74]

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Well she seems to be holding on strong. I have been out there hand watering her. I did give her the Polyvisol drops in her water this morning and then had to leave her for a few hours. I felt really bad having to do so but my daughter pulled her shoulder out of socket over the weekend and I had to take her to the chiropractor. I was worried she may not survive the few hours I was gone but she has. We are praying that she will keep holding on. It seems though that she actually was moving better after I gave her the polyvisol drops and I returned. Though she is looking dehydrated (but thats probably from me being gone and she not having any water). This morning she could hardly stand without falling forward into a summersault. She isnt doing this as much now. I havent introduced to her the electrolytes yet. Though I called my feed store and they recommended I start giving her and all the other chicks an antibotic. Its called Terra Vet (Oxytetracycline HCI). So I have started her on this as well. Our plan of attack is to keep watching her and continue to hand water her every 30 minutes. Hopefully by tonight we will see a continued improvement and the dehydration gone.

 

[dlhunicorn]

IMHO you were misinformed by your feed store (they tend to be under the impression that terramycin is some kind of "cure-all" and will advise it for any and all problems not realizing it may do more harm than good when a bacterial infection is not the problem)...you have said nothing about respriatory distress or given symptoms that indicated your bird was ill from a bacterial infection. You may have for got to do so but if not...if the only signs are the nerological symptoms (tucking head under) then please stop the terramycin immediately...this is very hard on a birds intestines and will not only kill pathogenic bacteral organisms but ALL organisms and weaken your bird by doing so.
Offer some live culture yogurt (plain unflavored with the live acidopholus cultures) and offer free choice to all your birds.

 

[californiachick74]

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Damn feedstore! Thank you so much for all your advice. I will stop giving her the antibotics! And just continue with the polyvisol wayer and electrolytes. She seems to be doing well. She has worsened! We got up all night to keep her drinking and eating! Shes alert, drinking and eating (all by hand). Her head dangling is still going on. If we beat this when will the head dangling stop?

 

[dlhunicorn]

I honestly have no idea... only that in order to give her a chance you must keep supporting her with the basics

 

[californiachick74]

dlhunicorn Im posting pics for you to see of my sick moonlight. Hopefully this will give you an even better idea of what I have been describing. The second picture posted is how she tries to stand most of the time. She will back herself up into the corner of her box and tuck her head down (uncontrollably) between her legs and it looks like she is standing on her head. Someone else her said to give her molasses and water. I have done so and she willingly drank that. The most she has drank all day. Shows no interest in food today. But I figure as long as I keep her drinking hopefully she will start eating again. I seemed to perk her up today when I diced up some apples. She seemed to light up. Though she only nibbled on a few she finally showed interest. Here are the pics.Thanks again for your help!

IMG]http://i261.photobucket.com/albums/ii49/nevermindme74/IMG_20080408_0405.jpg[/IMG]

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[californiachick74]

Were holding on. Moonlight goes in spurts where she will eat and then not eat. We keep making her drink water. So overall I can say things havent changed...she seems to enjoy our companionship and is still very much alert to our voices and sounds around her. This all being a good thing. I am hoping today will be a turn around day for her. I plan on trying to get the baby parrot food that was suggested. So hopefully by later today she will be eating more to help her fight this.

 

[californiachick74]

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dlhunicorn I want to thank you! You have been so supportive and helpful the last few days. Me and my little moonlight thank you! I took some extra time this morning and clicked on your link..Dragonflies and Dandelions...Wow! If only I had taken the time soon to check out your site. Better late than never. Im 100% postive that my chicky is injured with Crookneck and does not have botulism. This is a relief to some degree! I read all the symptoms and this is it. Every single symptom she has!

1. Tucking the head between legs (yes)
2. Tucking the head between legs and backing up (yes)
3. Tucking the head between legs and tumbling over (yes)
4. Walking in circles (yes)
5. Holding the head to one side (yes)
6. Loss of balance (and YES)

So because of your site and the info posted I can now rest at ease with my other chicks. I was really worried about an outbreak of botulism and losing all my girls and my roo.

I happened to have some predisone on hand. My girls are asthmatics. I tried calling a few vwts to get it prescribed in the exact dosage needed but the only way they will prescribe it is if I bring her in. So I am taking charge and guess working here a bit. Though I am being real careful not to overdose her with the steriod. I did purchase the baby parrot food and she will be getting this in a bit as well as some bird electrolytes. Doing everything your site says to the T! I hope to see an improvement in her the next few days...She is still with us so I guess IM doing something right!

 

[dlhunicorn]

It can sometimes also be exascerbated from some types of vitamin deficincies so the handfeeding formula will help to keep that at bay...
Alan Stanford gets the credit for researching this therapy... he has had a few with the limberneck form (limberneck is where the head hangs down and crookneck is where the head gets thrown onto back) ... both he has treated with that therapy and had success though I warn you it may take several weeks... Good Luck!