Catch 22 Composting

[jthornton]

My buddy dropped off a book that had a chapter on composting. It states to build a compost bin 3' x 3' x 3' and fill it with alternating layers of leaves (carbon) and grass (nitrogen). This seems to be a Catch 22... leaves fall off the trees in the fall when the grass stops growing and grass grows well in the spring and summer when the leaves are green.

Last winter all I had was dead leaves and chicken poop, the result was not ideal compost, it was wet and formed balls but was not stinky. I've been adding grass a bit at a time to those bins and they are coming around and looking and smelling more like compost every day, you know that earthy smell.

The one thing I have year round is chicken poop which I assume is nitrogen??? So for those that compost poop what do you do year round?

My compost bins are 4' x 4' x 2.5' or so...

JT

 

[IamRainey]

Yup! That's the essential dichotomy of composting all right. BUT in the warm months when you've got grass and clippings galore you can still add carbon-rich paper and cardboard to balance it out. And in the Winter when there's not much that's green growing in the environment you can still add kitchen trimmings and waste and also coffee grounds which, tho brown, are nitrogen-rich "green" compostingly speaking.

Check local coffee shops (including the ones installed in grocery stores). They sometimes bag up their spent grounds and leave 4-5 pound bags for those of us who compost to help ourselves to. If you make friends with the produce manager they might save what they pull off the outside of lettuce heads, etc. That stuff can really come in handy during the colder months.

I think it's best not to get too wound up in the ratios every time you add things. It's fine for things to balance out over the period of time that you're turning and mixing your ingredients.

I, personally, don't fuss with it at all. I throw everything into huge piles and let them sit for as long as a year before I start dismantling them, sorting out what needs to go back on a newer pile and turning the loose smaller bits still decomposing. Lazy, but it works for me since I have 4 huge piles in progress at any given time and, so, plenty of humus that's garden ready.

 

[Sequel]

My buddy dropped off a book that had a chapter on composting. It states to build a compost bin 3' x 3' x 3' and fill it with alternating layers of leaves (carbon) and grass (nitrogen). This seems to be a Catch 22... leaves fall off the trees in the fall when the grass stops growing and grass grows well in the spring and summer when the leaves are green.

Last winter all I had was dead leaves and chicken poop, the result was not ideal compost, it was wet and formed balls but was not stinky. I've been adding grass a bit at a time to those bins and they are coming around and looking and smelling more like compost every day, you know that earthy smell.

The one thing I have year round is chicken poop which I assume is nitrogen??? So for those that compost poop what do you do year round?

My compost bins are 4' x 4' x 2.5' or so...

JT

I save leaves in bags! Fortunately nobody can really see my hoard between the chicken compound and the back fence. I made 3 bins out of pallets, just tied them together, used some for the bottom too and put whatever, sheet metal, feed bags to keep the tree roots out of the compost.

Sometimes I'll just fill a bin with leaves and tuck the chicken poo and kitchen stuff into it during the winter. On nice days I go fluff it occasionally, helps break the leaves up and my chickens are happy to help with that. I do add a little dirt too when I can. I pile the bagged leaves on top of the bin to act as sort of a lid, rain can get in but it seemed to moderate it a bit. My bins are under a fir tree so that helps redirect a lot. If I had to move my piles I would consider building a roofed structure, probably a cattle panel hoop thing.

 

[Sequel]

Yup! That's the essential dichotomy of composting all right. BUT in the warm months when you've got grass and clippings galore you can still add carbon-rich paper and cardboard to balance it out. And in the Winter when there's not much that's green growing in the environment you can still add kitchen trimmings and waste and also coffee grounds which, tho brown, are nitrogen-rich "green" compostingly speaking.

Check local coffee shops (including the ones installed in grocery stores). They sometimes bag up their spent grounds and leave 4-5 pound bags for those of us who compost to help ourselves to. If you make friends with the produce manager they might save what they pull off the outside of lettuce heads, etc. That stuff can really come in handy during the colder months.

I think it's best not to get too wound up in the ratios every time you add things. It's fine for things to balance out over the period of time that you're turning and mixing your ingredients.

I, personally, don't fuss with it at all. I throw everything into huge piles and let them sit for as long as a year before I start dismantling them, sorting out what needs to go back on a newer pile and turning the loose smaller bits still decomposing. Lazy, but it works for me since I have 4 huge piles in progress at any given time and, so, plenty of humus that's garden ready.

You said it very well! Putting bigger pieces back to a newer pile and turning the rest you are anything but lazy! lol It's what I do too, I love it.

 

[ChocolateMouse]

I get bales of straw that I use in my coop layered thick and deep along with shredded newspaper. Straw and paper are high in carbon. I use wood chips in the run - also high in carbon. I layer the bedding up along with the rabbit bedding, cut plants, kitchen scraps, leaves, small sticks, and anything else I can get my hands on. I live in suburbia and I run around and pick up peoples lawn bags on the streetside with leaves and small sticks sometimes and layer those in. Wood ash gets layered in sometimes and charcoal bits from the firepit. Sometimes those go straight in the beds.

I pile it all in but it's still too much nitrogen right now because of the soiled rabbit bedding and chicken poop. But it does break down to the right amount still, just needs more time. The extra nitrogen will either wash away or go into the air, but that's not great for the environment or for your garden. This year we're going to be working on putting in even more carbon.

 

[Compost King]

I keep a giant leaf pile all year round (or a few months of the year as I go through them quick) I guess that's the only way to get around that catch 22. Grass Clippings come a little bit at a time so I guess if you were to compost as that book directs you add a layer of leaves from a large pile after you add a layer of grass. I just throw my leaves in the chicken runs a little bit each week until I run out by then I am adding grass a little bit at a time. During october when I am waiting for leaves and have no grass to mow I do clean up projects for neighbors where i pull out all sorts of carbon goodies to add.

 

[IamRainey]

Putting bigger pieces back to a newer pile and turning the rest you are anything but lazy! lol It's what I do too, I love it.

I love it too! And composting is probably my best gardening skill. There's something so fundamentally satisfying about creating rich, sweet smelling earth out of what was once garbage.

When we moved into the house we've been in for 20 years there was a stand of rapidly growing fir that all died off at the same time. The trees came down but the roots were in the ground for years before I could work them out. Then they went on the compost pile. Roots are adapted to a moist environment so they broke down V-E-R-Y slowly and they made appearances in many, many piles before they finally became soil. But Nature is relentless and nothing escapes her. I'm glad to have them back in my soil as soil but I miss encountering them every year and following their evolution, or should that be devolution...

 

[IamRainey]

I also want you to know, jthornton, that while you want to balance out carbon and nitrogen it's not a 1-to-1 relationship. The ideal is 25 to 30 parts of carbon to 1 part of nitrogen.

I'm going to repeat that there's little to be accomplished by getting a headache being obsessive about this. Compost is going to happen eventually anyway. But your pile will be happy with lots more "browns" than "greens". And I also wanted to mention that if, by chance, you use shaved pine as bedding when chicken poo gets added it's just aching to turn into compost. So add that stuff to your pile liberally when you clean out.

Here's a list that will give you a feel for what's carbon ("brown") and what's nitrogen ("green"). Also leaves are "green" when they're green and pliable. When they dry out and get brown they're "brown". Makes sense, right? But, again, brown coffee grounds are "green". That's just to keep you on your toes! And chicken poo is "green" regardless of what color it is when it exits a chicken.

 

[HopeSprings]

I just dump the garden debris in a big pile and toss the poop on top! I've got a friend in town who brings me his leaves and I top the garden beds with these, increasing the soil's organic content and reducing weeding without effort! The compost gets added as needed for certain crops (melons, squash, peppers, etc.).
Would love to let the flock in to clean up the beds, but my garden is never done for the season -- there's always something growing!

 

[IamRainey]

While we're discussing composting, if anyone has information security concerns, a compost pile is an excellent and secure place to dispose of sensitive printed info. You don't even need to shred it, just bury it well into your pile. In a day's time it's damp and fragile. And who's going out there anyway to mine your data?