Challenges of living in the woods with chickens

[Carontheroad]

Do you know if your hens ever lay in random places that aren't their nest boxes? We have ravens here - not many trees though! - and I'd often see one with an egg when I lived on a farm with a flock that liked to lay outdoors.

Hmmm, interesting. No my chickens just lay in the coop as far as I know. But sounds like he might be interested in their eggs. Thanks for the head up!

 

[Carontheroad]

Interesting…this is how I talked my husband into getting feral chickens He hates ticks!

Where does one get feral chickens?

 

[ColoradoChicken89]

Just commenting to follow this thread to read for advice.

I live in deep woods in CO, though, I'm trying the more "secure run/chicken tractor" method, cause I'm just way too nervous of predators. Basically I fight a bear every year during spring and fall, literally it just breaks into our cars and garages to get a few french fries my niece and nephews have left somewhere. lol. We also have a few huge coyote packs, 3 or 4 pairs of hawks that come back every year, a mountain lion pair, as well as a random bobcat that comes by the house. We butt up to Pikes Peak National Forest, where they just released some wolves too. So, the risk is really high, and we don't have a whole lot of lower bush coverage ... Some spots, but the stretches between I think would be hard if something ever figured out they were there.

All of them are very wild, so they are easily scared off by people or dogs or lights, so I'm not too worried, so long as they are in secure cage idea; with a rooster and some motion detector lights. If it becomes a huge problem, I plan on getting a livestock guardian dog, and just training it to live outside the run.

 

[Carontheroad]

American Game and Cubalaya are two I'm looking at. As a native plant enthusiast, might I put in a plea for growing Arundinaria, a river cane that is the only bamboo native to North America? It used to be plentiful and grew in dense stands called canebreaks. Because it is native, it isn't invasive.

I just googled it. I wonder if it would grow in the Pacific northwest? I have planted some clumping bamboo and they are doing okay but not thriving. I’ll have to see if I can get Arundinaria out here.

 

[Seaslug]

How does one plant over another threaten native pollinators when both species in question produce nectar?

Because pollinators need host plants for their larva and THAT is when very specific plants are necessary, not when it comes to pollen or nectar. Caterpillars (which feed the majority of native baby birds) need host plants and few caterpillars are generalists. Most have evolved to eat a family of plants or even a species.
So while the species that you and I are likely thinking of as mimosa (and not gum, which is also sometimes called mimosa) might seem harmless or to not take up much room, or to even provide nectar -- it can not provide the support for the 300+ species that an oak can, so it is better for the ecosystem to plant an oak. Doesn't mean that I do not want a mimosa for purely sentimental reasons... but it is also why bamboo is not a great plant. It is invasive (it is growing into our woods -- it was here when we bought the place) and it does not - can not - support the number of native animals that a native plant could.

 

[Carontheroad]

We have mixed acreage of pasture and woods, and my chickens love the woods. You don't need grass for free-ranging or for healthy chickens. Mine prefer to dig around in the woodland leaf litter for bugs, grubs, worms, and other such things. They love the tree cover of our woods and only tend to hang out in the pasture in the late afternoons once the shade moves in.

Honestly, unless you just want to grow a patch of green for them for fun, I wouldn't put a lot of effort into it. Unless it's a large clover patch, they'll pick and scratch it clean within a day or two. As someone already showed, you can cover it with a hardware cloth screen to protect the clover, and although they'll enjoy it and it's good for them, they don't absolutely need it.

A good feed diet is the most important thing and then you can supplement with kitchen scraps and allow limited free-ranging so they can dig up a little extra protein, etc. They'll find stuff to eat, at least when it's not winter.

Exactly, and you're smart to be aware of this. Predation is the main concern with woodland areas. We have everything here that eats chicken - multiple hawk species, skunk, raccoon, fox, bobcat, black bear, etc. And they live primarily in the woods. Most of the predators tend to be nocturnal, so it's good that chickens are not. However, we've seen all of these animals out in the daytime, at one point or other.

Spend time in your own woods, and keep an eye on your acreage and the surrounding area so you have a better chance of noticing if you have an active den or a huge hawk's nest.

Ditto!

Yeah chickens are like goats, they can clear the land in no time flat. I think I’m drawn to terminators as I have also been wanting to get goats. You are right about wasting my time trying to seed clover. I’m learning alot from everyone posting here and my views are changing.

 

[astone]

I live in WV. So you can imagine the predators roaming that have a taste for chicken. I've had one completely tear down our duck pen and it has batted our ""nursery cage"" around the yard a few times. I have a yard but my uncle was Luke Paul Bunyan on a hill in the woods. He built his chickens a big box and sowed different grass seed in it and he had a few of them so ""everybody got their fair share"" but he had his covered over so his birds felt safe as they picked.

 

[Carontheroad]

I live in the woods, relatively. Our property is about an acre of clearing which our house sits on, and an acre of woods surrounded by... Lots more woods.

Our current setup is on the side of the house but we're planning on converting an old playhouse at the edge of the woods into a coop/run. Much larger and won't get direct sun to bake them in summer like our current south-ish facing setup does.

My flock of 5 will be a year old at the beginning of July. We started letting them range with supervision when they were about 3 months old. Had plenty of hawk scares (mostly Cooper's, known chicken hunters). We stopped letting them out of the run around late November when there was less cover for them with the leaves gone off the trees and bushes, because a Cooper's had them pinned under a brush pile after nearly grabbing one of the girls.

We have a pair of red-shouldered hawks that fly over almost daily and watch the girls but haven't hunted them, even while nesting and raising chicks themselves in a tree on a neighbor's property. I've seen/heard red tails, but they don't seem interested, so far.

We have confirmed raccoons, foxes, and large cats (domestic and potentially bobcat). Coyotes and stray dogs and weasels wouldn't be a surprise either. Or fishers, despite them not being confirmed in this area of Michigan. There are several dens/burrows from all different critters on our property.

From my personal experience chickens who have access to both wooded and open areas prefer to stay near the woods so they can dart to the relative safety of the underbrush. They tend to stick to the shade and near covered areas (a large stump surrounded by ferns, a patch of fir trees, an upturned wheelbarrow...) on their way back up to the run.

My chickens aren't very flighty. They can fly and jump up onto (very) low branches but it seems like they'd rather escape under rather than above.

They know what "hawk" means so if I manage to spot one before they do and shout a warning, they freeze and look around. But I trust that they instinctually know what they're doing, so I try not to stress about it much. Most of their ranging time is unsupervised. I check on them every half hour or so and sometimes accompany them while they forage for a few minutes, but mostly, they're on their own. I only tend to intervene when one is by herself, and I lead her back to her sisters (or the nest box, depending on the situation). I don't follow them into the woods because 1) they rarely go more than 5 meters or so in, and 2) it's too overgrown with invasive autumn olive and honeysuckle. Can hardly pick my way through the path anymore that used to cut through the woods when we first moved here

Grass holds a lot of yummy critters for chooks to eat like moths, flies, caterpillars, and spiders, and while my girls enjoy picking through the grass in the yard for goodies (and eating the grass itself), they seem to have more success under leaf litter. Lots of worms, earwigs, ants, spiders, slugs, mice, shrews... Grass is easier for prey to escape into and hide within than dead leaves which are easily scratched away.

That's what I've observed, at least. They also have some luck picking bugs off of low hanging branches and smaller plants that grow on the forest floor like mayapples, raspberry, and virginia creeper.

How long they spend ranging varies day by day and by season. Currently they're getting at least 2 or 3 hours a day. Sometimes more, if I let them out again for an hour or 2 before roosting time.

As far as I know, everybody lays in the nest boxes. Wouldn't be surprised to find a hidden nest somewhere though, there's so many potentially great spots for a hen to hunker down and go broody.

I sometimes throw eggs out into the yard/woods for the wild animals, if they're extra dirty or cracked for example. The wild animals rarely find them before the chickens do and sometimes the eggs sit on the ground for days before something finally gets to them. I don't know what does take them, other than the chickens. Maybe squirrels, maybe crows, maybe raccoons or foxes. We don't have trail cams but dad and I would love to have them.

I don't worry about my egg offerings attracting predators. I'm not one to assume that the mere presence of a predator means my chickens are in immediate danger. If that were the case then my girls would all be dead by now. I do believe however that you can strike a balance with nature through lots of education on one's own part about the local ecosystem and some trial and error. Losing chickens is inevitable at some point, either way.

Personally, I'd rather my flock be happy and able to live as close to natural as possible, able to be active chickens and risk the predators, than keep them always shut in a run of any size.

Generally, I think the more chickens allowed to experience, and when they're allowed to use most or all of their chicken senses and behaviors, the more they learn from and adapt to a variety of situations, including dangerous ones.

That's not to say I'd just let a predator take one of my girls without at least trying to drive it off first. My role in the flock is basically part-time weird-looking rooster. I escort them to and from the nest box. When they squat for me I "breed" them by petting their backs. I find and give them treats. I guard them while they dirt bathe, separate them when their fights get too serious, scold them when they peck me too hard, herd/lead them around the yard as they forage, and when I see a hawk watching them I alert them, keep an eye on it, and wave my arms and shout at it if it gets too close until it flies away. I'd do the same for any other predator.

Lots of chicken shelters throughout the area if you don't have much underbrush are essential. Many birds of prey hunt by waiting on high branches and scanning the forest floor. Accipiters like Cooper's are notoriously agile in forest habitats and will chase birds and squirrels through the trees like it's nothing. Juveniles are especially bold but less successful hunters. That doesn't mean they won't injure or kill a chicken on impact, though.

Fishers also hunt from up in trees and are very agile both in the trees and on the ground.

Brush piles can serve as great shelter for chickens but also for certain predators (and pests) so it's a good idea to check/rotate (burn and replace/relocate) them often.

Flies love the shade and relative dampness of forests so definitely keep things clean to prevent flystrike.

Oh! The wildlife also serve as great alarm systems that my chickens really pay attention and react to. Blue jays, crows, robins, chipmunks, chickadees, titmice, sparrows, finches, woodpeckers... They all have specific alarm calls for different types of predators and my girls seem to have picked up on at least a few of them! Maybe it's just me but sometimes it seems like they follow the wild birds as they forage around the yard, maybe so they can take cues from them about what's happening in the area (as well as steal the goodies)

(Not to mention the delicious fledglings they find when they follow the chipping sparrows )

What I worry about most (besides flystrike. 3/5 girls have lazy cloaca and/or mega butt fluff, dangit) is branches and trees falling. It happens all the time in our woods. Lots of poplars that don't live long but grow fast and fall virtually every windstorm. Dead and heavy limbs come down a lot too, especially in winter. Not sure what to do about that, we have no money to hire someone to take out the widowmakers.

Anyway.

I think once we start building the new setup, critter-proofing it will be the most annoying part. Mice, squirrels, skunks, voles, probably rats too and who knows what else use it as their own personal clubhouse and cafeteria, there's a groundhog that has lived underneath it in previous years... There's going to be so much hardware cloth involved...

Ok I've blabbed on long enough (can't think of what else to bring up )

Wow, thanks for painting us such a clear picture of your neck of the woods.

I saw a video of a guy that could get all his chickens to run into the coop by imitating their warning call. I’d sure like that skill.

One thing to keep in mind regarding moving your coop farther away from the house: A friend of mine said they didn’t start losing chickens and dealing with predators until they moved their coop to the other end of their property away from the house. Something to think about.

 

[Carontheroad]

Deserts, volcanoes, and other environments generally described as desolate do support many forms of life. Just because you can't or don't see it doesn't mean it isn't there and thriving, and not every environment needs to be habitable to humans to be healthy


Is that based on British surveys from hundreds of years ago (outdated, less informed about natural sciences in general), potential Indigenous accounts (much more reliable than surveys done by early colonists), and/or recent looks at what the island used to look like with the added bonus of modern science?

There might not be a technical "meant to be" ecologically but there definitely is a "not supposed to be" when it comes to human interference in natural environments. Like the disappearance of prairies and wetlands across the US in favor of farmland and sub/urban development.

Interesting back and forth between you and No coop. You both make good arguments and I can see both points of view. I’m too ignorant on the subject matter to chime in. Other than to add that we have an invasive plant here call Scotch broom or witches broom, brought over from Europe somewhere, I think England. Anyway, people are always trying to stomp it out but they aren’t going to win. The native reservation next door to me just let it grow. It’s really quite pretty with edible yellow flowers and it’s evergreen leaves apparently can be used to make brooms (on my to do list). It can also add alot of nitrogen if placed in pots and raised beds at the bottom of the dirt. Invasive, yes, a threat to other plants, probably but that’s not clear to me as they seem to cohabitate quite nicely with other plant life. Useful, in some ways, yes. A pain in the arse, sometimes, since I have to cut them back every so often to keep them under control.

 

[Carontheroad]

Sorry, I got about 5 pages behind in reading everyones comments so some of my recent posts are a little late. Nice to hear from everyone though.