Chickens for 10-20 years or more? Pull up a rockin' chair and lay some wisdom on us!

[NikkiMiChickie]

Bingo!!!   The birds are said to "represent" the breed.  In other words, kinda, sorta, like the breed.  The have just enough of the breed in them to "represent".  The fact is, a keen eye can see that many of these hatchery birds only vary from another hatchery "breed" by coloration.  Body type is blah, blah blah, virtually the same light weight, similarity.  I see folks post photos of their BR or RIR or NH and I can clearly see the same shape.  Boring.  They aren't supposed to be the same, mediocre shape.  They all lay too much as well, feather too fast, and enter POL too early, never reaching the size their breed calls for.   I can see Leghorn blood in most of them, to be blunt.

Again, I don't mean to appear anti industrial/commercial/utility bird.  That's not what I'm saying.  I just saying another 40 years of this trend and all these "breeds" will all be the same bird, virtually, only coming in different decorator colors.  Sad thing is that even those colors are boring.  Rant over.

After showing my husband the pictures you posted, I was thinking more about the differences between our birds. I had just finished comparing the coloring differences when I read the 10 new posts (or whatever) and Bee had taken the words right outta my mouth! And you're right, Fred! My birds are all hatchery birds and their body type is all virtually the same. I see slight differences in my Wyandotte and my Orpington, but my RIR and BR especially look alike besides color. Come to think of it, my production red looks like them too....

When breeding for a utility flock, none of this reallllllly matters though, right? So long as I specify that my birds are a utility mutt. But I'm seeing, more and more, the importance of the work you are doing with breeding to carry on the true heritage breeds as they were intended to be. I admire the dedication that you OTs have put into your chickens. Even Bee, who claims her fame with "hatchery mutts" clearly knows what she's doing in the selective breeding regime, not just breeding for the important backyard qualities such as egg laying etc., but as Walt has pointed out, her culling yields some beautiful birds. I *hope* to attain half of the OTs level of knowledge, commitment and intuition about chickens.

 

[Beekissed]

That's all anyone can do with a utility flock. If you are determined to raise birds on the cheap as I am, then you know you will get acceptable losses each time you cull. But, the beauty of it is that the birds you keep will breed more of the same. Then you look at those and remove the ones that do not fit your criteria and it goes exponentially onward.

Just by sheer accident, the ones you did not cull are usually the ones that look better, lay better, have better form and color...because the other traits they have that are good are probably because they come in the same package. That's what Fred and Walt are trying to say about SOP..it's not just about pretty birds with the right body parts. All those right body parts and feathering mean something and usually means they are right in other areas as well....breeding, laying, health, broodiness.

Everyone pretty much gets what they work for in a flock, but not necessarily what we would all love to have. If I had my wish, all good flock owners would magically all have the old timey breeds how they used to look and perform and then they could just maintain all that goodness in much the same way. Cull the worst, breed the best time after time. No exceptions.

No Cuddles, or Suzy Q or big, fat pet roosters to be kept back for placing in handbags and showing off to friends because you just can't part with them because of blah, blah, blah. I love my chickens too, I keep them for simply EVER, but there always comes a time of parting and this is inevitable. Might as well be when they are still healthy enough for you to eat them.

 

[Fred's Hens]

When Bee posted photos of her White Rocks a few weeks ago, I commented just how nice they were. We both gushed for a few posts about the WR being our all time favorite breed. Fact is, for utility birds, Bee's WR are super nice and brought out some 50+ year old memories. Of course, a white fowl always looks sharp.

I said it then and I'll repeat it now. If I can get a trio or two of top bred White Rocks, I'd be so geeked. Had a secret shopper look for me at the Ohio National, but we struck out. Nothing there worth bringing home. Too bad. If I don't or cannot secure some top bred birds this spring, I probably do what I recommend others do. I'll order a box of 50 from the best hatchery line I can find. Grow them out and put all but 4 or 5 in the freezer. They'll eat good. Then, spend the next few years breeding those 4 or 5 birds. That's all can I can do.

Some White Rocks will go very nicely with my great, expensive coffee I now drink.

 

[Beekissed]

I got mine from Meyers 6 years ago. Five WR hens and each and every one of them made my cull cut for all the years I had them, so did the New Hampshires. Three have survived the worst care possible for a year and a half and came out on the other side looking like queens, the New Hamp survived but not looking stellar like the WRs, the rooster looks great as well. One WR goes broody each spring like clockwork, the others do not. She is my biggest and finest hen even yet.

If you have to take your chances on a hatchery, look into Meyers...I'd be thinking they might have the same lines as mine? I have nothing but good to say about these girls.

Out of all the birds I got in that order from Meyers, the rooster, the WR girls and one scraggly little NH is all I have left after being at the bad place and they are 6 years old. The NH just stopped laying a few weeks ago to go through molt but before that she was still laying 5 days out of 7 when all other younger birds had stopped.

 

[Cynthia12]

You might want to ask Al about taking that rooster off your hands...he's in the market for new breeding stock.

My opinion on decrowing roosters? Inhumane and the same as cropping ears and tail on a dog or declawing a cat...entirely not necessary and done purely for selfish reasons on the part of the human.

But Bee...aww man..I'm selfish.

I never thought of myself being selfish. But it's a thought I guess, me wanting to be able to have a rooster in my life. Sigh..maybe I won't.

 

[Beekissed]

But Bee...aww man..I'm selfish.

I never thought of myself being selfish. But it's a thought I guess, me wanting to be able to have a rooster in my life. Sigh..maybe I won't.

No worries, dear...that's just my opinion. No one really listens to me anyway.

Think about it like this, if you can...do you really need that rooster as much as he would like to keep his voice? How important is your voice in your life? If you want him to have the best life you can provide for him, taking his only big words from him would not be the place to start. It's like stealing a dog's bark or a cat's meow...having silent pets would be horrible. I've seen and heard how they sound after this decrowing and it's about as sad a thing I've seen done to a bird.

 

[Ridgerunner]

Ok Ot's looking for your opinion.  My hen is laying but she is laying in the bottom of the coop right below the nesting boxes. Now I know she knows where they are since I was watching her this morning to see if I could see her lay an egg and she spent a good amount of time in them kicking out all the shavings.     I have put hay & pine shavings in the nest box in the past. But they always went in there and emptied them for some reason........


Do I put a couple of golf balls or easter eggs in there so she gets the hint or put the egg she laid below in the nesting box till the next day?  The divider in the middle comes out if you think a bigger nest box might help?  She is big but she easily turns herself around in one nesting box without a problem.

To stop them kicking out the shavings, try putting a higher lip across the bottom. I've had hens go into a nest with the vertical opening 6". You have plenty of room to raise the lip.

I've retrained hens from laying on the floor by locking them in a nest when I catch them in their nest on the floor. I built a couple of nests so I could lock a chicken in there if I needed to. Having a place to stash a hen or some chicks for a little while has come in handy a few times.

I leave them locked in the nest until they lay, then let them out. It usually takes about a half hour and they were laying in the nest the next day.

 

[Cynthia12]

No worries, dear...that's just my opinion. No one really listens to me anyway.

Think about it like this, if you can...do you really need that rooster as much as he would like to keep his voice? How important is your voice in your life? If you want him to have the best life you can provide for him, taking his only big words from him would not be the place to start. It's like stealing a dog's bark or a cat's meow...having silent pets would be horrible. I've seen and heard how they sound after this decrowing and it's about as sad a thing I've seen done to a bird.

Oh my goodness! You got me there. I had spine surgery on my neck last year. As a side effect..I have problems with my voice. It's very irritating, and, I can't sing anymore. Serious, or I cough and cough. And, I can't yell at my husband anymore.

Or I cough and cough. No seriously, I can relate to throat problems. I guess I can relate to a rooster that's been decrowed. I listen to folks thoughts and ideas. It's a smart thing to do.

 

[Beekissed]

You can't yell at your husband??? You poor dear!

That takes all the fun out of being married, doesn't it?

Here's a video that will show you how a rooster sounds...and it sounds like you are describing for your own voice changes. It shows the before and after.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mqpCy1pMPVo&feature=player_embedded

 

[Mountain Momma]

You can't yell at your husband??? You poor dear!

That takes all the fun out of being married, doesn't it?

Here's a video that will show you how a rooster sounds...and it sounds like you are describing for your own voice changes. It shows the before and after.

I copied someone's question that I just loved and was totally curious about and then didnt see an answer. I will paste it here, forgot who originally asked it though....

"How fast does the comb and wattle change colors? Is it a happy/sad thing like a mood ring where they can change the color, paler or brighter depending on their mood or security?"