Choose the right Cockerels

Eggcellent advice all around.

One of my biggest criteria in choosing a cockerel is who his mom is. It sounds like you might not have that information- most of us starting with our first chickens usually don't- but this may help down the road. Choosing cockerels from productive hens with longevity sends you off in a good direction. I'm lucky enough to have chosen the "right" cockerel from the offspring of my original group of then 1-yr old hens, now 4 yrs old and still laying large eggs consistently. So, there is some guessing involved in the beginning!!

I took an applied genetics course as part of my degree once upon a time in a land, far far away. It was focused more on selective breeding for meat and milk production in cattle/goats, that kind of thing. An example of the application side is using data to choose a pairing that will give a low birth weight (so the cow/goat has an easy birth) and a high weaning weight and of course, carcass weight, for profitability. In other words, small, easy to birth babies growing into heavy, money-making meat animals.

I was shocked to see how little of an impact selective breeding has on egg layers. One of these days I'll unpack the box with my text book so I can look at the actual numbers again, but they were very low. Ridgerunner touched on this in saying it matters more who the ROOSTER's mom is to the future babies, especially pullets.

Chickens are opposite from mammals. Females are XX and males are XY. Therefore, the female always passes along one of her X chromosome to her offspring, whereas the male will either pass along his X chromosome to a daughter or his Y chromosome to his son.

In chickens, females are Zw and males are ZZ, so it's backwards. This is important, because lots of "information" that we selectively breed for is carried on the Z chromosome (our "X" chromosome). By comparison, the "w" has very little on it.

That is important, because the hen only gives her daughters that "w". The daughter's only "Z" with so much more information on it- comes from the rooster. The rooster got one of his Z's from HIS mom, and one from HIS dad. Now, the annoying part is roosters don't lay eggs, so we don't have a production record on him as an egg layer.

I think this is why the heritability/selective breeding (don't hold me to those exact terms, it's been a long, long time) numbers are so low when it comes to chickens and egg laying. The newly hatched pullet's only Z chromosome comes either from her paternal grandmother or her paternal grandfather.

SO: How to make this information work for you. If you can, try to keep a laying record on each hen. Then in the future, when you're choosing whose eggs to set under a broody, or which eggs to put in the incubator, you've got an objective measure. If you can keep track of which baby is which (mom, dad), you can start to build your data and make more calculated decisions. If meat is part of your equation, weighing the offspring at consistent ages and keeping a record.
 
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I don't usually do individual breeding, but flock mating. I do value longevity, and keep older birds in my flock as long as possible. When setting eggs in this situation, more productive hens will have more eggs per clutch, and if I confine the older birds away from the youngsters, that will help select for those traits; health, production, and longevity.
This is far from ideal compared to most other livestock breeding!
Obviously selecting both hens and cock birds is necessary, as poor individuals won't improve a flock.
Mary
 
Duckfarmer1 is talking about another flock, it's not the OP at all.
Mary
Yes, these these are my new guys that I got Aug 1. I already have 12 hens and 1 rooster. We bought straight run at TS and 5 turned up cockerels..lol.there are 2 hens. I took pictures on phone..I’ll switch and add to thread...
 
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Yes, these these are my new guys that I got Aug 1. I already have 12 hens and 1 rooster. We bought straight run at TS and 5 turned up cockerels..lol.there are 2 hens. I took pictures on phone..I’ll switch and add to thread...
ok. I think as the pictures go they are my new hen I adore Miss Lydia. The cockerels. Then one of the round guy I like because he’s friendly then one of our proudest then the nice guy then Spike and his ladies. Even though they have 3 roosts and a stool thing. They cuddle. Lol. Who would you choose
 
I agree about doing your final pick slowly. After removing the obvious losers, take time to evaluate the other cockerels. As they get a bit older, behaviors may develop that eliminate another one or three.
In general, smaller birds will be better layers, and larger birds will give more meat. That's a sweeping generalization though.
I personally like birds that are larger, and for purebreds, want them to fit into the SOP as much as possible.
Wide and deep, not shallow and narrow.
Mary
Wait.. I thought. When we talk about cockerels it means young rooster so why the reference that small birds are better layers...and what does SOP mean? Slope of ...?
 
Eggcellent advice all around.

One of my biggest criteria in choosing a cockerel is who his mom is. It sounds like you might not have that information- most of us starting with our first chickens usually do- but this may help down the road. Choosing cockerels from productive hens with longevity sends you off in a good direction. I'm lucky enough to have chosen the "right" cockerel from my original group of then 1-yr old hens, now 4 yrs old and still laying large eggs consistently. So, there is some guessing involved in the beginning!!

I took an applied genetics course as part of my degree once upon a time in a land, far far away. It was focused more on selective breeding for meat and milk production in cattle/goats, that kind of thing. An example of the application side is using data to choose a pairing that will give a low birth weight (so the cow/goat has an easy birth) and a high weaning weight and of course, carcass weight, for profitability. In other words, small, easy to birth babies growing into heavy, money-making meat animals.

I was shocked to see how little of an impact selective breeding has on egg layers. One of these days I'll unpack the box with my text book so I can look at the actual numbers again, but they were very low. Ridgerunner touched on this in saying it matters more who the ROOSTER's mom is to the future babies, especially pullets.

Chickens are opposite from mammals. Females are XX and males are XY. Therefore, the female always passes along one of her X chromosome to her offspring, whereas the male will either pass along his X chromosome to a daughter or his Y chromosome to his son.

In chickens, females are Zw and males are ZZ, so it's backwards. This is important, because lots of "information" that we selectively breed for is carried on the Z chromosome (our "X" chromosome). By comparison, the "w" has very little on it.

That is important, because the hen only gives her daughters that "w". The daughter's only "Z" with so much more information on it- comes from the rooster. The rooster got one of his Z's from HIS mom, and one from HIS dad. Now, the annoying part is roosters don't lay eggs, so we don't have a production record on him as an egg layer.

I think this is why the heritability/selective breeding (don't hold me to those exact terms, it's been a long, long time) numbers are so low when it comes to chickens and egg laying. The newly hatched pullet's only Z chromosome comes either from her paternal grandmother or her paternal grandfather.

SO: How to make this information work for you. If you can, try to keep a laying record on each hen. Then in the future, when you're choosing whose eggs to set under a broody, or which eggs to put in the incubator, you've got an objective measure. If you can keep track of which baby is which (mom, dad), you can start to build your data and make more calculated decisions. If meat is part of your equation, weighing the offspring at consistent ages and keeping a record.
Oh geez, that’s great info..I do keep charts onmy rabbits, for size and not broken pairs, etc.. but, we are not letting my existing hens go broody till spring, I already I have two goats due in Jan and 100 more animals...but.. I will definitely need to ask you how to keep track and chart those eggs...
 
I don't usually do individual breeding, but flock mating. I do value longevity, and keep older birds in my flock as long as possible. When setting eggs in this situation, more productive hens will have more eggs per clutch, and if I confine the older birds away from the youngsters, that will help select for those traits; health, production, and longevity.
This is far from ideal compared to most other livestock breeding!
Obviously selecting both hens and cock birds is necessary, as poor individuals won't improve a flock.
Mary
Once I do it, I plan to just do flock breeding, since, my chickens are not exactly beautiful nor for meat
 

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