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Cocci question Update page 2 using organic treatments it worked!!

Discussion in 'Emergencies / Diseases / Injuries and Cures' started by AHappychick, Mar 3, 2009.

  1. AHappychick

    AHappychick Wanna-be Farmer

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    Dec 16, 2008
    westchester
    I have one 7-8 week old roo showing signs of cocci (bloody stool lethargic) I am treating him with milk and he is separated. All the brooders are kept clean, have a bit of DE in them, and they all get clean water with ACV.

    None of the other birds seem to have it though, or at least all their poo is normal and they are acting normal.

    Could it be that this particular chick has a week immune system and thats why it is effecting him in this way, or am I on the cusp of a big problem???
     
    Last edited: Mar 5, 2009
  2. mypicklebird

    mypicklebird Chillin' With My Peeps

    Aug 8, 2008
    Sonoma Co, CA
    bloody diarrhea is a common sign of coccidia, but not the only problem that can cause that.
    if you want to know if your roo has cocci- get a fecal check at a vet's

    If your birds are recently introduced to dirt, or a new dirt area, or the rooster is new- cocci is likely your problem. It is in the soil of pretty much anyplace chickens have lived. The chickens become immune to it as they get older, but it is still there- which is why when new birds come in, they get sick. Where is the brooder? Any access to dirt or any of the chicks been outside at all?

    Most people will have their birds on medicated feed when introducing them onto dirt. Chick start has amprollium in it, which prevents the cocci from reproducing well in the chicken, but does not help too much when the bird is ill. It is important to have them on the medication before they get exposed. You can get amprolium or albon from the feedstore if you think you have cocci- off label for laying hens, but no big deal for a rooster.

    The other birds may get ill or they may not, it all depends on what they are eating, if it is their sole ration (if medicated), and how much cocci they got exposed too (if it is cocci).

    I don't personally find DE to be very useful, but that is just me.
     
  3. AHappychick

    AHappychick Wanna-be Farmer

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    the birds have not been exposed to dirt. Some of the chicks are from a hatchery and I had the vaccinated. The others (including the one with the symptoms) I hatched and they were not vaccinated. I don't use medicated starter I am trying to raise my own flock organically and the roo was destined for the dinner plate so I have not used any conventional medicines. I am thinking about looking for a vet who could do a check on the stool but there is not one close by so it will take me a while.

    In the meantime I washed all their waterers, added extra ACV and took their food away and replaced it with a yogurt, milk and starter food mix and they will just have to eat it when they are hungry enough.

    The sick one is still on his own where I am monitoring him and treating him.

    The bedding is all new so I scooped out the bloody poop and am monitoring that or any others that might have the same problem.

    I don't want to use medications if I don't have to I am trying to follow the organic protocol but am starting to wonder how others do it. I keep a VERY clean chicken area and have been trying to be so careful with bio security. [​IMG]
     
  4. mypicklebird

    mypicklebird Chillin' With My Peeps

    Aug 8, 2008
    Sonoma Co, CA
    unfortunately, the only thing I know much about is conventional medicine. not much help for the organic folks. Vaccinated for what? Coccidia? The vaccine does exist, and if done, the medicated starter is not recommended/not necessary. Check to see what vaccine was done- there are many kinds. If you can't/won't medicate, you are stuck with supplements, and they may or may not work. Hopefully if this is cocci (which is sounding less likely due to lack of exposure), the bird will live long enough to become immune on it's own.
    If it is not cocci, it could be bacteria;, and you are back to where you started- test, alternative care, or best guess medicate with a drug. Bloody diarrhea really is a hallmark of coccidia, so until proven otherwise with a negative fecal- that would/should be the working diagnosis.
     
  5. Kelpie

    Kelpie Chillin' With My Peeps

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    May 20, 2008
    Charles Town, WV
    I have had problems with it. I lost a goat and a silkie to it before I knew about new meds. I used to use corid but most bugs are resistant now. I just treated my goose for it in january. The vet said most animals just live with it and do fine but occasionally one will just get knocked out by it. The vet prescribed penazaryl (sp?) and that and some force feeding of $4/ounce wheatgrass juice from the juicebar she was fine after a week in the bathtub. Call a vet and ask if you can buy the meds from them, it must be measured out for their weight.
     
  6. mypicklebird

    mypicklebird Chillin' With My Peeps

    Aug 8, 2008
    Sonoma Co, CA
    ponazuril= marquis paste
    actually kills coccidia, unlike albon and corid which just prevents them from reproducing. very expensive, and I think is labeled for horses- but works really well in mammals at least. overseas the drug baycox = toltrazuril is in the same class and is labeled for chickens.
     
  7. Bullwinkle

    Bullwinkle Chillin' With My Peeps

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    Nebraska
    Quote:Coccidiosis is an intestinal disease caused by a protozoan parasite called Eimeria. To vaccinate the chicks a particular strain (weakened or a less severe strain) is administered to the chicks. In essence the chicks are infected with a particular strain of Coccidiosis. Once the chick is vaccinated (err... infected) you are not supposed to feed medicated feed precisely because it takes time for the LIVING coccidiosis in the chicks gut to induce resistance.

    What I am trying to say, is that your non-vaccinated chicks HAVE been exposed to Coccidiosis through the droppings of your vaccinated chicks. I got my chicks vaccinated for Coccidiosis, but I got them all from the same hatchery.

    A good link I found on Coccidiosis is: http://www.netvaxforpoultry.com/related_topics/coccidiosis.html
     
    Last edited: Mar 3, 2009
  8. Bullwinkle

    Bullwinkle Chillin' With My Peeps

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    Quote:Good point.... Most hatcheries offer Mareks Vaccinations, but being vaccinated against Mareks doesn't provide any resistance against Coccidiosis.

    On a side note, is McMurray the only hatchery that currently offers Coccidiosis vaccinations?
     
  9. AHappychick

    AHappychick Wanna-be Farmer

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    westchester
    The chicks were from Mt Healthy I cant find where they say what it is but I am assuming Mareks, I just was not sure if maybe they put other stuff in them.

    I just thought it was strange that it seems to be only effecting 2 I hatched and everything else about the chicks are the same.

    Anyway I am trying to see if I can have my flocks with out chemicals so I am using organic methods trying to take care of the problem that way.

    I can get him to eat the milk and yogurt and starter feed and am hoping that the others will develop and immunity to it. I have been told that usually the first one to get sick is the worst as the others build a tolerance to it.

    I fed all the others in the same brooder the same mix and I am not having the problem anywhere else I did a complete poo check of my flock and all other brooders. Everything is clean and as it should be. I am hoping this is an isolated incident. [​IMG]
     
  10. AHappychick

    AHappychick Wanna-be Farmer

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    Dec 16, 2008
    westchester
    Update:

    Well today the roo seems better. He has been having the yogurt/milk/starter mix and other natural treatments and his poop seems much better. I will let you all know how this turns out. I will be very happy if he gets over it and survives. So far still no others showing signs of the cocci just him.

    He still seems a bit tired but better then yesterday for sure.
     
    Last edited: Mar 4, 2009

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