Completely Self sufficient systems

[Red-Stars-in-RI]

Even if not sustainable, it would be an improvement!

Yup… chickens/goats > herbicides/pesticides

 

[saysfaa]

I’m not on the beach, but I live a lot closer to the ocean than the corn fields of the Midwest. An insane amount of agricultural land goes to producing animal feed…with all the chemical fertilizer, runoff, erosion that go with it. ...

Perhaps not as much as you think. Nine tenths of the land used to grow feed for livestock is pasture. Most of it can't be used to grow any other kind of people food. In the case of the Flint Hills, the soil is too shallow. In other places, it is too dry or too steep.

This is a picture I took of the Flint Hills in Kansas, looking west from the road between I80 and Manhattan. A tiny, tiny part of them. No more runoff or erosion than it had when the buffalo grazed it.

I'm sure there are pictures that make even pastures look bad. They aren't typical.

Edit to add: the picture isn't as clear as I thought it would be. I added one that isn't mine - it is what it looks like for hundreds of miles.

 

[3KillerBs]

I personally have no issue with land used to grow animal feed.

I don't want to live on corn and beans instead of chicken and pork (at current prices I look at beef, sigh, and buy more chicken leg quarters).

 

[U_Stormcrow]

I personally have no issue with land used to grow animal feed.

I don't want to live on corn and beans instead of chicken and pork (at current prices I look at beef, sigh, and buy more chicken leg quarters).

beans and rice, or beans and pasta, are a better (that complete protein thing) choice.

But yes, I look at prices, grab the pork on special, go home, and butcher another excess cockerel or two. ...and look at the older goat, whose time ends as soon as our doe drops a... what do you call a baby goat, anyways??? I should put as much effort into learnign goat as I've invested in learning chicken.

 

[Red-Stars-in-RI]

Oh, believe me, I'm not talking about the % of agriculture because I want us to eat less meat...I want us to eat more sustainable meat...and maybe more of it!

This article has some interesting breakdowns of land use in the US: https://www.bloomberg.com/graphics/2018-us-land-use/

It actually counts pasture/range separate from cropland, which makes sense for the reasons @saysfaa mentions....it's different land, and if managed well, can actually be a huge carbon sink.

But of cropland, a sizable percent of cropland is used to grow grains for animal consumption. If we can replace that with something grown more sustainably, it saves that land for growing more food for more people.

Obviously, not all things can be grown in every place, soil, etc....but we could grow things a lot smarter and "greener".

 

[3KillerBs]

beans and rice, or beans and pasta, are a better (that complete protein thing) choice.

Yes. But corn is what grows well here.

Wheat does better a little further north with some clay in the soil.

Farmers in the northern half of the county often do a wheat/corn/soybean rotation. In the southern half it's more likely to be either corn/soybean or tobacco.

I am better off here than I was before we moved. The town at the southern tip of the county has what the Ag Extension agent called the worst soil in the county and I found that I had to make quite intensive inputs to grow anything at all.

 

[addctd2plnts]

What are some completely self sufficient and sustainable systems we could all use. For example one is growing food in the garden to feed rabbits them using rabbits for dog an human food.

In the cycle you need food to feed things everything has to have a job to serve something else, this is how it works in nature.

You can do this better on a limited basis and get very good at what you do. Joel Salatin has several books about raising pasture raised poultry and pigs. IMHO 6 mos of solid work/year on pastured pigs and poultry, would give the income and freedom to make the rest of the regenerative system, if you chose to do it. He raises cattle too, and follows his cattle with the chickens. The sticking point for some people is to really make good money at it you MUST process your own chickens (check out your state laws). There's also some very good books on Permaculture. For a really cool greenhouse system, check out Ceres Green House Solutions: https://ceresgs.com/ They use a very simple system of tubes and low velocity fan to cool the greenhouse in the summer and heat it to approx 55 degrees in the Winter. Then, you can use a rocket stove for times you need to heat additionally. If you gather the wood for free, you can heat your greenhouse for nearly free! There are lots of cool ideas out there and really neat videos about these things on Youtube.

 

[Red-Stars-in-RI]

I am better off here than I was before we moved. The town at the southern tip of the county has what the Ag Extension agent called the worst soil in the county and I found that I had to make quite intensive inputs to grow anything at all.

The few times I've been to NC and seen "disturbed earth" I do wonder how anything grows in that red clay!

I think we need a major change in this country to save organics from landfilling and make them into compost to help some of the tired (or just terrible) soils out there be more productive.

 

[3KillerBs]

The few times I've been to NC and seen "disturbed earth" I do wonder how anything grows in that red clay!

I think we need a major change in this country to save organics from landfilling and make them into compost to help some of the tired (or just terrible) soils out there be more productive.

That clay is FERTILE stuff. It will grow just about anything.

I'm in the Sandhills -- nutrient-deficient, acidic Miocene beach remnants. The natural environment here is called a "fire dependent, impoverished ecology".

A large part of what my chickens are FOR is to improve my land with their composted bedding and poop.

 

[Red-Stars-in-RI]

That clay is FERTILE stuff. It will grow just about anything.

I'm in the Sandhills -- nutrient-deficient, acidic Miocene beach remnants. The natural environment here is called a "fire dependent, impoverished ecology".

A large part of what my chickens are FOR is to improve my land with their composted bedding and poop.

Interesting on the clay being fertile. I guess it's got some challenges with water, but glad to hear it grows stuff.

Yes, chickens can be great for soil fertility. If you do it right, you could have an oasis of green in an area of moonrock.

My dad has been on the same plot for 50 years plus, and has been adding lots of organics that whole time...fall leaves, manure/bedding, cover crops, etc. His soil organic is 7%, compared to 2-3% for the surrounding area. I remember him telling me last summer "the neighborhood is having a drought, but I'm not".