Cornish cross birds get weak and die

[MontanaChickDoc]

I do limited feed (twice a day after 4 weeks of age) so that they can grow more slowly and have fewer leg problems.

 

[MontanaChickDoc]

If you are supplementing additional B vitamins and using Corid, you are canceling the effectiveness of both out.

Corid works by mimicking thiamine in a way that makes it unavailable to the cocci so they are unable to reproduce easily. If you are adding more actual thiamine (vitamin B1) to their diet you are negating that effect.

ah - that's good to know. I just opened the bag of duck pellets yesterday, before that they were getting all flock 17%. It's a catch 22, save them from Coccidiosis but then the B vitamin deficiency causes them to have neurologic problems :/ I will have to see which B vitamins are supplemented in the duck feed.

 

[MontanaChickDoc]

ah - that's good to know. I just opened the bag of duck pellets yesterday, before that they were getting all flock 17%. It's a catch 22, save them from Coccidiosis but then the B vitamin deficiency causes them to have neurologic problems :/ I will have to see which B vitamins are supplemented in the duck feed.

The duck feed contains: Thiamine Mononitrate, Biotin, Yeast Extract, Vitamin E Supplement, Zinc Proteinate, Niacin Supplement, Calcium Pantothenate, Sodium Selenite, Manganese Proteinate, Folic Acid, Manganous Oxide, Riboflavin Supplement, Zinc Oxide, Zinc Hydroxychloride, Manganese Hydroxychloride, Copper Proteinate, Rice Hulls, Active Dry Yeast, Vitamin B12 Supplement

So perhaps mix and match is not the way to go...

 

[MontanaChickDoc]

I spoke with an avian pathologist last night at the University of KY Vet Diagnostic Lab (where I did my pathology residency) and she says a lot of times on the post mortem they don't really find anything, or maybe just some cardiac muscle degeneration. So apparently this is a "thing" in some lines of Cornish cross birds, they call it "Sudden Death Syndrome" or something like that.

 

[skeeeter]

Perhaps they are eating their bedding on the sly. It's worth a check.
I have noticed some of my cornishX try to eat shavings and ground cobs, so I've switched to Hay/Straw bedding for them.
I, too, have noticed the wet, stinky droppings produced by "broiler mash" so..I feed 3 times daily, evening feed being "scratch feed" followed by darkness to sleep. If my chicks cannot free range, they get fresh green stuff every day as well as the vitamin drops in their water.
Here, it's not freezing cold and I raise chicks in the fall starting 4-3 months before frost.
We start slaughtering when they reach 3 months old.. starting with the biggest, (my wife refuses to kill, clean or cook anything that cheeps) allowing the rest to grow on.
*Please note: Chickens & most other stock NEED live food to prosper. So do we.*

 

[HenriettaPizzaNolan]

Why do you mix so many feeds? When you do that it's hard to know exactly what nutrition your birds are getting.

I recommend using 20-22% protein feed for the first 2-3 weeks, and then 18% for the rest of the time. I've never had leg or heart issues with this method, and I get nicely sized birds in 8 weeks. I truly believe most leg and heart issues people think are inevitable with CX are actually caused by too high of protein, which causes the birds to gain muscle too quickly and takes a toll on their heart and joints.

I'm not saying your issues with this batch couldn't be something else, but it's hard to tell when you're mixing everything up. I'd suggest going out and buying a bag of 18% chick or all-flock feed, and feed that to the flock. Supplementing with poultry Nutri-Drench and B/K vitamins in the water can't hurt either. If that doesn't help a little, then I'd investigate illnesses with the side effects you're seeing.

Best of luck.

Edit: If you are concerned the birds are eating bedding, they simply might not be getting enough to eat (or think they aren't because CX are always hungry lol). A lot of people have success with 12 hour on, 12 hour off feeding schedule (or I usually just do dawn til dusk). It assures the bird is getting what they need and not resorting to eating foreign materials or feather picking. It gives them time to digest too. I would try this with the 18% feed if possible.

 

[KMR58]

I raise my Cornish with the rest of my flock and feed Kalmbach Flock Maker 20% which I ferment with different spices and herbs. They also get black soldier fly larvae in the afternoons. They have food available all day as they free range with the rest of the flock and then no food at night because they are in the coop/run. My last batch a few weeks ago I processed at 12 weeks and they were doing just fine. This batch is 3 weeks old and growing like little weeds. After about 8 weeks I start watching them closely. As long as they are running around they are fine. Once they slow down considerably and even start laying down to eat they get processed.

 

[MontanaChickDoc]

Why do you mix so many feeds? When you do that it's hard to know exactly what nutrition your birds are getting.

I recommend using 20-22% protein feed for the first 2-3 weeks, and then 18% for the rest of the time. I've never had leg or heart issues with this method, and I get nicely sized birds in 8 weeks. I truly believe most leg and heart issues people think are inevitable with CX are actually caused by too high of protein, which causes the birds to gain muscle too quickly and takes a toll on their heart and joints.

I'm not saying your issues with this batch couldn't be something else, but it's hard to tell when you're mixing everything up. I'd suggest going out and buying a bag of 18% chick or all-flock feed, and feed that to the flock. Supplementing with poultry Nutri-Drench and B/K vitamins in the water can't hurt either. If that doesn't help a little, then I'd investigate illnesses with the side effects you're seeing.

Best of luck.

Edit: If you are concerned the birds are eating bedding, they simply might not be getting enough to eat (or think they aren't because CX are always hungry lol). A lot of people have success with 12 hour on, 12 hour off feeding schedule (or I usually just do dawn til dusk). It assures the bird is getting what they need and not resorting to eating foreign materials or feather picking. It gives them time to digest too. I would try this with the 18% feed if possible.

I admit, it's a weakness, I like to mix and match and try out different things to see what makes a difference, what the hens like or don't like etc. I agree about the 24% meat bird food being too high in protein. Sometimes it's hard to find an 18 or 20% feed that's pelleted. I hate mash because they waste so much of it, even when it's soaked / fermented. I used to feed the meat birds with everyone else but they were stuffing themselves on layer pellets (which are more expensive and lower protein) and the hens couldn't get any. Plus the meatbirds just get underfoot ("When are you going to FEEEED us?!?!") and I kept tripping over them! I appreciate everyone's input. So theoretically I should get another batch of birds from the same hatchery and feed them differently and see if I still have losses at 5-6 weeks.

 

[cassie]

I fed mine broiler feed as in Broiler Starter, Broiler Grower, and Broiler Finisher. They had free access to feed from seven in the morning until seven at night. I put Broiler Booster in their water from start to finish. Broiler Booster is a vitamin electrolyte supplement especially formulated for meat birds. I found it so helpful I would never try to raise a batch of meat birds without it. It is sold by Murray McMurray.

 

[MontanaChickDoc]

I processed my 14 remaining birds yesterday. They dressed out between 6 and 7 lbs, with only one at 5 lbs 5 oz. Three had hydropericardium and 1 had ascites. Of course I don't know if it's genetic or something infectious or how I fed them, but I don't think I will order from this hatchery again. Losing 12 of 26 birds was rough. I will stick to Cackle Hatchery's Cornish cross birds, they have always done well for me.