Cornish x's vs Heavy Breed Cockerels Any suggestions

[walkswithdog]

It's not that we "don't get it." It's just that we "don't want it."

Ditto. Don't want it.

I know what it is, what it's for, how it's made and why it suits an industry. I don't want it for my meat purposes because by definition it doesn't exist in nature, can't. When I want weird science foods I drink soda pop. When I want food, I want it from healthy sources, because my health depends on the quality of the food going into me.

Did the meaties thing. Not normal, not healthy, not right. Not doing that again.

Hence the discussion of rangers, colored broilers and mixes. I'd rather add some time, and gain sustainability and trade ultimate wt off for better for me.

We know what they are and are for. We're not slamming people who make that choice.

We just don't choose that for ourselves or our situations.

I grow my own vegetables for the same reasons or buy from growers whom I know as often as I can.

It is shooting ourselves in the foot if cost, speed and poundage were all that mattered. That's not my only reason for raising my own meat.​

 

[Bossroo]

Hooraaayyyy for you for trying to develop a sustainable chicken with enough land and conditions to economicaly and organicaly free range. I wish that I did! Step into my shoes and see what you think. Some of us just don't have the luxury of space ( myself , I have 20 acres but with only 9.5 " of rain average per year = very little grass or enough well water [way too expensive ] to grow any + summers with 100* - 117* ( would need mega air conditioning) + keep breeder chickens + incubators ( or brooder hens) to produce a chick + very high cost of feed, + way too many PREDATORS to raise a chicken on free range. I need a Fort Knox to raise a chicken to harvest. That would cost me over $100 a bird ( if amortised over 30 years) to free range, if at all possible. [Just another case of " how to make a million in the chicken business"... start out with $3 million]. Ain't going to happen. I can go to my local grocery chain store and buy chicken for $ . 99 a pound any day and forego all the hastle of trying to keep them alive long enough to harvest. So, don't slam the Cornish X Rock chicken that some of us can buy a day old chick and safely grow out in my environment (winter time at best), to produce a 5-6 pound frier + buy another chick to grow out a 1-2 pound game hen in the SAME TIME that you can produce ONE 5-6 pound free range frier. I wish all of you my best who are lucky enough that have the wherewithall, land and conditions to acomplish your goals.

 

[dancingbear]

Quote:
As has been said repeatedly, that's what you want, no problem. Have fun. Go for it.

Are you under the impression that people not growing the same birds as you, only raise one bird at a time? That would be pretty silly.

Do you think we're some sort of elitist group? We're not. We're not rich. My spouse and I have 22 acres. We live here. We'd have the same 22 acres whether we raise any chickens on it or not. We didn't just happen to get this land because we're "lucky". We saved our money, (that we worked hard to earn, nobody just gave it to us, and we didn't just get lucky and find it somewhere) we looked around, we read, we researched different areas, we bought property. We bought property in an area where the climate would allow us to do the things we want to do.

It sounds like you chose to live in an area with a less hospitable climate. That was your choice. I didn't make you live where you need Ft. Knox to raise a chicken. You did that. All by yourself. Now you seem to be mad at everybody who lives in areas where they can raise free-range birds, while you can't. You try to make us sound like bad guys or idiots for doing so.

My DH and I are not raising millions, thousands, or even hundreds at one time. We don't need to. We don't want to. We're not supplying supermarkets. We're supplying our own household. There's a big difference between raising birds only for home use, and raising them on a large commercial scale. For some reason, you seem to have trouble grasping that concept.

There are people raising Red Bros and others ranging meat birds commercially, on pasture, and doing pretty well with it too. They seem to be very happy with the results, and from the pictures they post, the birds look happy and healthy.

 

[Bossroo]

I wish that my jealous, mad and silly brain can grasp the consept of someone raising chickens another way than what I can in my ecosystem. I wish that I could, and I applaud those of you that can. By the way, my 20 +/- acre ranch is for sale if you would like to purchase it. My wife and I worked extremely hard to buy the land then design and build a home with my 2 callased hands onto 2 acres of grounds with 72 Redwood trees that we planted as seedlings, each with it's own underground drip system, and about 100 tons of moss covered boulders that I dug up out of the mountains for retaining walls and landscpe. I made quite a nice living on it for the last 12 years. But not with chickens and I love the satisfaction and taste of healthy, home grown and cooked chicken. We will be moving about 700 miles away and purchase a property where we can retire on and too, can raise some chickens the old fashioned way.. It seems to me, that someone that commercialy raises free range chickens posted here saying that he/she can't market their free range chickens without making any or loosing money at it. Something to akin as to a loss leader that some other food product perveyers practice. If my feeble brain can remember corectly, He/ she also stated that one can procure a packaged ,organic free ranged chicken for a lesser price at an organic store than one can raise an organic free range one themselves. So my venture may be a money loosing proposition. Foolish me, as the price of land there is VERY dear, so free range is out of the question. Be that as it may, I still want to raise a few chickens of my choice, for myself and for my own family, the way that I was raised on my parents farm, my experiance, my choice of meat birds... Cornish X Rock that I can butcher in 4 or 8 weeks, also RIR + BR hens for eggs , under the environmental and economic conditions that allow me to do so ( in a solidly built as nearly predator proof coop and yard as possible). I want to have a few healthy and tastey dinners without being slammed for my own choices and methods . Is that too much to ask?

 

[chiknlady]

I want to say thank you to all who have posted here to answer my basic question pertaining to the advantages of dual purpose birds vs Cornish Crosses. I have gotten a wealth of information about the pros, cons and arguments pertaining to sustainability. I appreciate everyone's point of view and would hate this to deteriorate into a "my way is better than your way" argument--because I think what is best for each of us--depends on our situation. I am at the bottom of the spectrum. I have decided to no longer buy the chicken in the market and to try my hand at home meat production. I think I will try FR.s or Redbroilers or Corndel crosses if all goes well with this brooding. But I encourage us to be open to a better/different way of doing things--because that's where progress will come from. New breeds, new attributes, and new conditions on our farms and homesteads will drive the poultry breeding and rearing of tomorrow. There is a revolution afoot and having a dialouge may yet prevent a war.

Thank you everyone for your passion and candor.

 

[walkswithdog]

I hang out here to see what crosses people are getting, what is working, what didn't, after not liking cornishXs, I came looking for other options. Gladly I found a lot of other people doing the same thing.

As I dink along here with my own research and eating

I love being able to compare notes with others.

I don't want to bash anyone who can or must raise the cornishx's. I choose not to, I feel it is fair to say why.

It is still far better to rear your own than buy what's in the market. At least you know the food and drugs going into the animals.

That I make the choice to trade speed for sustainability and overall health shouldn't diminish the success and pride in someone else's rearing their own food.

I do happen to think the actual health and nutritional benefit of a healthier animal should be something for people to consider.

Vegetables are better for you reared on better soil. What is good for them is good for you. Controlling what you feed the birds you raise certainly affects their benefit to you and it's important. I just happen to think there is additional benefit to the animals actually being from strains that are naturally healthy enough to live a normal long life.

 

[walkswithdog]

I hang out here to see what crosses people are getting, what is working, what didn't, after not liking cornishXs, I came looking for other options. Gladly I found a lot of other people doing the same thing.

As I dink along here with my own research and eating

I love being able to compare notes with others.

I don't want to bash anyone who can or must raise the cornishx's. I choose not to, I feel it is fair to say why.

It is still far better to rear your own than buy what's in the market. At least you know the food and drugs going into the animals.

That I make the choice to trade speed for sustainability and overall health shouldn't diminish the success and pride in someone else's rearing their own food.

I do happen to think the actual health and nutritional benefit of a healthier animal should be something for people to consider.

Vegetables are better for you reared on better soil. What is good for them is good for you. Controlling what you feed the birds you raise certainly affects their benefit to you and it's important. I just happen to think there is additional benefit to the animals actually being from strains that are naturally healthy enough to live a normal long life.

That's not bashing someone else's situation or choice. It's just why I do what I do. We all can only react to our own situation and opportunities. Mine shouldn't dictate anyone else's.

 

[LocoPollo]

So if I bought regular cornish roos and mated them with white rocks, will i get the same cornishx cross, or something a little different? I am confused.

 

[walkswithdog]

They will be a cornish cross but not the specialized hybrid that the big producers have been developing for decades.

The one's marketed by the big hatcheries have hundreds of generations of hybridizing behind them.

You'd be creating an F1 cross. It takes many generations to set new traits and establish stable outcomes. An F1 will have some traits of both parents but won't breed true - produce progeny like itself. It takes approximately 6-12 generations to set traits and see what you're getting.

That's the primary reason for buying cornishXs they're already as tweeked as they're going to get and you don't have to put generations of chickens on the ground and feed into the chickens, to get the highest fastest meat producing bird.

Hope that helps.

 

[LocoPollo]

Yes that helps a lot. My other question would be then, could you keep some to continue to breed yourself? I know they are unstable, and perhaps that is the reason you cant. Or do you just need to keep them confined?