Crate to Coop Conversion -- Part 2

[supercoops]

I want to thank everyone that contributed to my last design iteration for the shipping crate conversions. I have access to thousands of crates and a green solution is needed. I'm an engineer, and I redesigned these crates/coops based mainly on inputs I received on this forum. Please be mindful of the price of these coops ($70 to house 4 egg-laying chickens). It's my understanding that chicken-housing can cost $150 per chicken (or please tell me what it is). The price I offer is $17.50 per chicken. I appreciate any input you offer on strengths/weaknesses. This is not an advertisement and I leave no contact information. thank you.

8 Sq Ft Chicken Coop Description

These chicken coops are sturdy, well designed, and crafted with pride from recycled heavy-duty shipping-crates after only one use. The crate floor plan is 42 inch x 30 inch (about 8 sq ft) and the inside height is 22 inch. Coops weigh about 90 pounds.

Design Features (ref pictures)

o Lid that pivots from the rear of the coop. Ventilation is adjusted by tilting lid from the front and placing spacer blocks underneath the front of the lid.
o Awning over the doorway that holds the lid firmly in fully open position. The awning rotates into position as shown in pictures.
o Water proof tarp-covering on the lid that’s easy to clean.
o Trim around the inside of the crate-opening that keeps out the water.
o 2 roosting poles.
o Corrugated polypropylene liner that covers the floor. Use horse bedding for easy clean-up job (see pictures).
o ¾ inch drainage holes in floor near the corners.

The coop has 2 coats of exterior “barn red” latex paint.

 

[21hens-incharge]

I see improvement in the designs. I would like to make a few comments though.

1. Chickens sit on their feet at night to keep them warm. The roosts need to be 2x4 with the 4 inch side up.

2. The drain holes you added will only encourage mice to come on in. They will become clogged with the shavings and feathers.

3. The ventilation may be an issue if the coop is not kept in a fully enclosed run since there is nothing to stop a predator from coming in through the opening. They will have more need of ventilation during the night and unfortunately that is when the bad critters are coming around.

4. The tarp you have on will not last.

Possible solutions.....

1. Simple change the boards to 2x4's

2. Plug those holes.

3. Keep the roof propped up and add a permanent angled piece to keep it open. Incorporate the ventilation into that with a latch to keep the lid closed until cleaning time.

4. Number 3 helps with this. Use some rolled roofing to make it watertight.

Cost added is minimal and value is increased greatly.

Question...
Have you thought about putting it on its side so the lid would drop down for cleaning and put the roost along the back then? I would add legs to get it up off the ground too since only my raised coops have not had mice in them. Then easy peasy wheelbarrow and drop front to clean.

Still rather small since they may end up trying to stay inside in the cold or rain.
Perhaps putting 2 of them together.

Edited to add...
The ramp is a bit narrow for large hens. Perhaps as wide as the door and with some cross boards for their toes to grab. It may be too slick. If you are not raising it they wont need it at all. Mine hop into their coop that is 2.5 feet in the air. ( perfectly good ramp right there and they like to hop into the big door instead of using the smaller door.)

 

[supercoops]

thank you 21 hens. that's about how many hens I have. Does the cost look attractive at $17.50 per chicken, or please tell the cost to house a chicken?


My questions/comments below:

Quote: SC: The roost poles are about 8 inch off the floor which leaves about 14 inch of head room. Is that enough? Thanks for the 2x4 idea. I'll try to use it.

Quote: SC: How do you stop mice from coming through the doorway?

Quote: Quote: SC: Or a chicken wire screen across the opening.

Quote: SC: I'd expect at least 3 years out of the tarp depending on the UV resistance. You can buy tarps that reflect heat and drop the temperature about 10 degree F. Also a tarp is much easier to clean than roofing-shingles.

Quote: SC: What about the the corrugated polypropylene sheets that come with the crates/coops? They are quite stiff and easy to lift for cleaning. They'll stand up to very strong cleaning chemicals.

Quote: SC: I'd elevate the coops so the eggs can be collected without straining the back. I leave this option to the customer.

Quote: SC: Do you use heat lamps during the cold weather?

 

[21hens-incharge]

For me the cost to house the chicken is not discussed as DH would have a heart attack if he knew what we have spent so far. lol I think most folks do not look at the cost to house as much as the health and comfort provided for the laying hen.

To stop mice from coming in the door I have a guillotine style door on a track that I close every night. The door slides down inside the coop and below the threshold. No gap no mice.

Chicken wire only keeps chickens in not predators out. Most will say 1/2 in x 1/2 inch hardware cloth but I would go with 1/4 x 1/4 since I seem to have tiny mice that go right through the half inch stuff.

If the coop is not inside the run you should not have to clean the top. Those are very nice crates and one should get a good 5 to 10 years out of them with shingles. I still think you should join 2 of them. If they are free or cheap to you I would do it. You may find you sell a lot more.

The sheets of poly are ok. I myself prefer discontinued linoleum. It sweeps up very easily and I don't have to touch the poo.

Naw no heat lamps. They are not so safe and in the space you have they would be very dangerous.

 

[donrae]

My first concern is the overall size. I wouldn't put more than two birds in that small space, and most folks have a limit of 4, so they'd need a bigger coop.

Second, is it needs windows and additional ventilation. Birds confined there during bad weather would be huddled in the dark, and the moisture would build up quickly.

Third, where are they going to lay? This goes back to size, but all the available floor space is covered by roosts. There's no place to lay eggs they wouldn't get pooped on. Combined with that is no space for a feeder and/or waterer.

I think the better idea would be to disassemble the crates and use the materials to build larger coops. Those are just too, too small.

 

[21hens-incharge]

My first concern is the overall size. I wouldn't put more than two birds in that small space, and most folks have a limit of 4, so they'd need a bigger coop.

Second, is it needs windows and additional ventilation. Birds confined there during bad weather would be huddled in the dark, and the moisture would build up quickly.

Third, where are they going to lay? This goes back to size, but all the available floor space is covered by roosts. There's no place to lay eggs they wouldn't get pooped on. Combined with that is no space for a feeder and/or waterer.

I think the better idea would be to disassemble the crates and use the materials to build larger coops. Those are just too, too small.

Exactly!

 

[aart]

My first concern is the overall size. I wouldn't put more than two birds in that small space, and most folks have a limit of 4, so they'd need a bigger coop.

Second, is it needs windows and additional ventilation. Birds confined there during bad weather would be huddled in the dark, and the moisture would build up quickly.

Third, where are they going to lay? This goes back to size, but all the available floor space is covered by roosts. There's no place to lay eggs they wouldn't get pooped on. Combined with that is no space for a feeder and/or waterer.

I think the better idea would be to disassemble the crates and use the materials to build larger coops. Those are just too, too small.

Ditto^^^^^


That 'roof' will never shed water properly.....you say you have drain holes but you never want any rain water/snow melt coming in to the coop, let alone enough of a flood to need drain holes.

What is the origin of those crates, can you post a pic of the stamp on them?


ETA: just read your other thread on 'part one'. I have no advice, that I can post here.

 

[supercoops]

For me the cost to house the chicken is not discussed as DH would have a heart attack if he knew what we have spent so far. lol I think most folks do not look at the cost to house as much as the health and comfort provided for the laying hen.

To stop mice from coming in the door I have a guillotine style door on a track that I close every night. The door slides down inside the coop and below the threshold. No gap no mice.

Chicken wire only keeps chickens in not predators out. Most will say 1/2 in x 1/2 inch hardware cloth but I would go with 1/4 x 1/4 since I seem to have tiny mice that go right through the half inch stuff.

If the coop is not inside the run you should not have to clean the top. Those are very nice crates and one should get a good 5 to 10 years out of them with shingles. I still think you should join 2 of them. If they are free or cheap to you I would do it. You may find you sell a lot more.

The sheets of poly are ok. I myself prefer discontinued linoleum. It sweeps up very easily and I don't have to touch the poo.

Naw no heat lamps. They are not so safe and in the space you have they would be very dangerous.

Thanks Hen, good advice.

I have a few comments, questions.

cost:

In the business world, cost and quality both matter where the lack of quality is actually a cost measured in many different ways that involve time, resource, and impaired function. I'm assuming the coop must be good enough to house a chicken before we start a cost comparison. I'm at $17.50 per bird. I can add shingles, metal hinges, etc. and the cost will go up from there. If it sells, I'll do it.

predators versus ventilation:

What size predators would go through the lid opening assuming the box is raised off the ground? The design uses spacers between the lid and box. The picture shows a 4" gap which I think is an awful lot. I've read university articles that say you should have a minimum of 1 square foot of opening per chicken -- assuming a chicken house -- to create air convection where humidity moves upward and out through the roofing eaves. If that is indeed the case, the box works without a lid and I know that can't be right. Drafts must be avoided to -- can you imagine the draft without a lid?

 

[supercoops]

My first concern is the overall size. I wouldn't put more than two birds in that small space, and most folks have a limit of 4, so they'd need a bigger coop.

Second, is it needs windows and additional ventilation. Birds confined there during bad weather would be huddled in the dark, and the moisture would build up quickly.

Third, where are they going to lay? This goes back to size, but all the available floor space is covered by roosts. There's no place to lay eggs they wouldn't get pooped on. Combined with that is no space for a feeder and/or waterer.

I think the better idea would be to disassemble the crates and use the materials to build larger coops. Those are just too, too small.

Size

How much does a bigger coop cost to house 4 chickens? My coop costs $70. The rule of thumb is 2 square feet of housing per egg-laying chicken. The footprint is 8 square feet, hence the math works to house 4 chickens.

In addition, I have 17 chickens that choose to stay inside one, even during the day. They are quite content with it. I attached a picture -- it's the pen on the left side with the red hens. I'm at 3,000 feet elevation. Day time temperatures average the low 80s and night temperatures are in the low 60s.

Windows

Maybe for a full size chicken coop, but not for one this small -- it would be too drafty. A gap around the lid allows natural convection to work -- the same idea as a hen house with eaves. Natural convection moves smoke up a chimney -- warm air rises. The crate also has cracks between the wall-boards where you can see daylight. I don't think ventilation will be a problem when you can open the lid half a foot and a breeze already sends air through the cracks in the walls.

Space

There is room in any one of the corners for an egg laying box. I heard one egg-laying box is enough for 5 hens. Is this not correct? Likewise, food and water can go in any of the 3 remaining corners.

too small?

Let's assume the coop houses only one chicken at a cost of $70. Surely it's large enough for that! Now please tell me -- what is your housing cost per chicken? When you tell me that, we can start making comparisons.

thank you for your inputs, and I have no plans do disassemble crates. I'd be better off selling them as.... crates rather than disposing of them where I put in labor and pay the garbage dump to take them away.

 

[21hens-incharge]

When it comes to housing chickens there are a few things to remember.


Your customer is not the chickens. Your customer is probably a female human.

Fickle I know.
What your human will be looking at is ...
1 Space for the chickens
2 Space for food and water
3 Space to lay eggs
4 protection from the predators ( these vary by location but everyone has predators)
5 and this may end up being the most important to some.... Is it cute?

I will tell you that I built a 4x5 foot coop raised 2 foot off the ground, shingled roof, screws to hold it all together, 2x4 construction, 3/4 inch plywood floor, windows with 2x4 welded wire and 1/2 inch hardware cloth, pop door that shut, clean out door that had a hasp and latch, etc. etc.

I delivered it to a friend that had promised to have a predator proof run built before it got there. Not built is what I found. I understand folks are busy and don't get things done. Sadly I included in the coop 3 chickens.

When we were leaving I told my husband that I give the birds 30 days til the predators find them. Not far off. They made it 90 days. Coyote tore the roof completely off and a side wall to get to them. Now this was a coop weighing in at about 350 pounds. They also killed 2 yearling calves that night. I guess chicken was only a starter course.

What predator will go through a 4 inch gap. They all will if it is not secured fully. They will just flip it up an in they go. Boxed lunch style. I have even seen mice chewing feathers off of my roosting hens.

What a chicken needs may differ from what a hen house buyer is looking for or what is designed into it. A thing is only worth what someone is willing to pay for it. For me I have around 3500 invested in my hens and am redoing their set up to better suit their needs not mine.

When people are looking for a crate coop they are hoping for something like this one. But will settle and still pay for less.

https://www.backyardchickens.com/t/617973/our-shipping-crate-coop-finally-finished-pic-heavy

You will see in this link the things people need in order to keep chickens healthy and happy.

Maybe rethinking the whole crate coop thing may be a better idea. I would pay 80 for the crate as a crate to store my chicken supplies in, for the deck cushions, for a planter box, raised garden, bench, toy box (safety hinges to be added by user) etc.

I do like the concept I just think this may be the wrong crate.