Decrowing Roosters.

[bluedogsonly]

One of these days I'll probably end up in the NE. My gal (she's a vet too) is from New Jersey and I figure we'll do a stint up there in the future. But it'll be hard for this country boy to make it up there. Ha.

Dr. James

 

[centrarchid]

One of these days I'll probably end up in the NE. My gal (she's a vet too) is from New Jersey and I figure we'll do a stint up there in the future. But it'll be hard for this country boy to make it up there. Ha.

Dr. James

Have you thought about doing a study to verify scientifically for interest of city officials that modified roosters would operate at noise levels that would not violate ordinances?

 

[bluedogsonly]

That actually is my plan. I just need objective numbers, tried a free decibel meter for my computer but doesn't seem consistant enough. I would need to buy a real one and do bunches of birds to get my n up enough to make it valid. But I think it'd be an easy argument if you tested your bird and he was under the city ordinance for noise levels. I also need to do young roos and see if they would develop a crow as they mature, I have only tried adults so I had a before and after.

Dr. James

 

[Time-Out]

I had no idea caponising is illegal in the UK. That's interesting...

Re pain, my local vet once gave one of my hens pain medication when she got attacked. I hadn't expected it, as I thought most vets just view them as farm animals (and without nerves or whatever reason they give for not administering pain killers). I REALLY appreciated the thought and almost hugged her. They also seemed to have an effect on the hen who perked up very quickly after that.
I think you should offer some sort of pain relief. If people are paying that sort of money for surgery, they care enough to want their birds to be without discomfort.

 

[janinepeters]

Re pain, my local vet once gave one of my hens pain medication when she got attacked.

Time-Out, do you know which pain med she gave?

Dr. J., can you tell us what pain meds are appropriate for chickens? Is there anything, local or oral, that can be given for bumblefoot surgery? A lot of people do this procedure on their own chicken, without any anesthetic, and it has to be quite painful for the bird. Just wondering if there's anything that can be done for the pain.

 

[Time-Out]

Just rung to ask. It was dexafort.

 

[Reurra]

Im a low income person, and though Ive saved over the years, I just got done paying to have a chimney installed in my house, which was 2k. That ate up my savings and left me dried up. Then my kitty ends up getting hurt and I now have to find some how to get 1k surgery to fix the leg, or put her down. I was floored at the cost. Most Vets want money up front. No ifs and or buts.

$300 to get a cat spayed, cash in hand. These costs, I believe are one of the reasons animals suffer or get neglected. Most people i know cant cough up that kind of cash. I know a vet has to make a living, but so do the people that have pats. Its a sad thing when you have to give up a beloved pet because you cant afford medical costs, either by surrender or death. I think things would be so much better if the costs were easier to handle.

Making a payments option might help. I know they can be a headache for the vet, but a percentage down, say for materials, and then afterward a payment to cover the rest. It would be easier to pay $50 a month for 4 months to get a roo decrowed. Not so much with $200 cash in hand, up front.

 

[Melabella]

One of these days I'll probably end up in the NE. My gal (she's a vet too) is from New Jersey and I figure we'll do a stint up there in the future. But it'll be hard for this country boy to make it up there. Ha.

Dr. James

Dr James,

As a proud born and raised in New York all my lifer, I am here to tell you that there are so many areas of both New Jersey and New York that are spread out, and quite rural, especially New York. Our state is vast, and huge, and still home to many farmers and homesteaders that raise their herds, flocks, and families in their little slice of Heaven. You'd make the transition just fine! Come on up and see! The beauty is, one is only a day trip away, or less, to one of the greatest cities on the planet. I wouldn't move for anything, I love the NE!

This being said, I am a recent escapee from Long Island and their ridiculous real estate taxes to settle 90 miles north of NYC. I am also a recent recipient of Meyer's 10% mistake rate of sexing day old chicks, and have 1 8 week old Colombian Wyandotte cockerel and 9 assorted brown egg layer growing pullets. After chewing up the plethora of information here on BYC, I have decided to inch along, allow him to stay and see if I too can reap the benefits of having a roo watch over my other 9 hens. I have a young daughter and lots of smaller nieces and nephews here all the time, so his personality will dictate if he gets to stay. This being said, I also have a potential problem with a close neighbors house on one side of our six acre property. Mind you this is the man who feeds deer and bears because his wife likes to have "nature TV" off of their deck! I pray I don't come face to face with Mama bear and her cubs one day sniffing around my feed room for my horses, and now chickens!

Echoing the sentiments of member DonRae's excellent post, if my roo turns out to be a treasured pet, and valuable member of the animal pack here, and my neighbor's complaining to the town became an issue, I would save several weeks our animal stipend, and send him off to you. Worried, and scared for his well being, beating my self up for spending the money, but I would do it if it meant keeping the peace, and keeping a valued and treasured animal pet. My main concern past his individual health and concern with it would be the quality of life pertaining to his ability to make sound, not just where the crowing is concerned but all the little and subtle nuances of sound communication that animals make to each other. I see the way they all communicate now, at 8 weeks old, and realize this would all be altered. I imagine myself with the inability to suddenly speak or make sound. I imagine it would be quite frustrating, yet, given the choice of it being the only way I could stay in my home, with my family, and maintain my life, I would accept it yet no disputing it would make a change that would quite diminish the roo's and hens way of life.

Thanks for listening, and great thread, lots to think about.

Good Luck,
MB

 

[Sk8inChick(en)]

Translation: never underestimate the ridiculous amount of money people will spend on an animal.

I'm trying so hard to be respectful...I understand that everyone has to make a living and that you've put a lot of effort into satisfying what very well may be a niche market for rich idiots. But, oh my, no, just, NO! This is weird science and designer pets and...everything that makes me crazy.

I don't know if this is an accurate statistic at all, probably just an urban myth, but it sums up my response to your request for opinions relating to this designer pet surgery, "If we took the money Americans spend on their pets each year we could end childhood hunger."

So long as there are hungry children in our country, so long as there are parents who cannot feed their children, there are better uses for an extra $250 than de-crowing a rooster.

Hmm, this is an intersting quote.

It does make you think, I will admit that.

However, I also think it an appropriate statement (even if not proven accurate) to say that "if Americans took half of their money that they spend on unneccesary clothing, shoes, make-up, eating out, going on vacation, etc. that could also add up to a child-hunger-ending figure."

Now, I don't wish to offend anyone, and I'm not trying to say that you are wrong at all. I think you have a good point there. I just believe that there are many different unneccesary things, including pets, clothing, gourmet food, hobbies, etc. that Americans spend their money on.

I think in truth, people are just going to spend their money on what they want to spend it on.

Thanks for listening to my speech!

And as for the rooster de-crowing surgery debate, I think if there is a low level of risk involved, and it saves your rooster's life and allows you to keep your pet, than it sdoesn't sound like a bad idea to me.

If a person wants to spend that money on their beloved pet, and they think it's a good idea, then that is their decision.

 

[bluedogsonly]

Melabella, Kate's from Sussix county, Ive been up there twice so far and once to South Jersey (gross). Pretty country, just a lot of laws and houses. There seems to be a town every 5 miles! A few dairy cows around, some very spoiled horses. Just not for me. Make sure you hang electric fence around your coop. Thats the only thing thatd stop a bear if he really wants in. Thats what Kate's mom does with her pens.

About pain meds, I have used Banamine in my birds. Really works and perks them up when they are dumpy. But can be kidney toxic. Everybody out there, PLEASE do not use human pain meds in your animals. Not worth trashing liver and kidneys. Tramadol is very safe in mammals, dont know about birds. I'll need to do some researching to find what NSAID is ok for birds. The Dexafort suggested earlier is a steroid, would not be a first choose for analgesia in any patient, in my opinion. Does reduce inflammation and thats most likely the response you saw. Makes a dumpy critter feel better. But feeling dumpy and sick is not the issue here, pain is the concern. From my observation, these guys dont even look the slightest bit sick and I dont see any type of behavior that would indicate pain. They eat, fight, fly, mount, crow and cackle, just without the noise. But an injection of banamine would be cheap and easy, as long as the bird is hydrated enough for it. We hauled 4 roosters, shortly after the procedure, the long way from AZ back to OK, no issues with a respy outbreak. They all handled the stress of the trip nicely.

I understand the cost issue. But, we do the same procedures with the same equiptment and drugs as MD's, radiologist, anesthesiologists, surgeons and dentists etc. Just compare the costs. I agree that human medicine is too expensive, but there are alot of vets that undervalue their services (yours truly) and some over value it. With the cost of things, interest on my school loans (which are huge, over a quarter million between my gal and I) and such, this is still a business. And I'll get off of my soap box. I hope I didn't offend anybody.

Thanks heaps.

Dr. James

P.S. Tried a guinea, seems to work but I didn't like it. The anatomy is a bit different and I'm not sure that it'll be permanent. But he's doing great.