Do I have California Whites, Austra Whites, or something else?

[EmRose]

We ordered Speckled Sussex chicks from a local farm supply store, but because they had no idea what they were doing there, we received little yellow spotted chicks awhile ago. As far as we could tell, they were California Whites, but I've just now read about Austra Whites which have very similar chicks.

Ours are, of course, now white "teenagers," some with black spots, some have turned plain. I noticed in a lot of pictures of Austra Whites, the chickens have gray legs. Ours do not, so I'm still thinking California Whites. Ours are also a little bit flighty despite being held every day since we received them, and Austra Whites are said to be fairly calm. But is there any other breed this could be?

I just want to rule out whatever I can now that I know California White isn't the only possibility. I love these gals but I want to know for sure what they are. There's a picture album of them on my profile, if it helps.

 

[Bullitt]

Cackle Hatchery sells both California Whites and Austra Whites, and they have pictures of both on their website.

http://www.cacklehatchery.com/page2.html#white

 

[Fred's Hens]

Very, very likely, these are commercial layers sold with these various names. They aren't "breeds" at all. They are mixes, hybrids, blends of Leghorn, RIR, BA and other top layers to produce exotic parent stock to produce high production layers for the industry. Yes, these get sold through retail outlets and feed stores to consumers too.

Most of these commercial hybrids make efficient use of feed, mature early, and generally lay up a storm. If you like lots of eggs, you'll likely enjoy their production. Since so many of these kinds of birds have leghorn in them, a bit of flightiness is to be expected.

 

[EmRose]

Thanks. We did get them for eggs so I don't imagine we'll be dissapointed no matter what.

 

[Bullitt]

Very, very likely, these are commercial layers sold with these various names. They aren't "breeds" at all. They are mixes, hybrids, blends of Leghorn, RIR, BA and other top layers to produce exotic parent stock to produce high production layers for the industry. Yes, these get sold through retail outlets and feed stores to consumers too.

Most of these commercial hybrids make efficient use of feed, mature early, and generally lay up a storm. If you like lots of eggs, you'll likely enjoy their production. Since so many of these kinds of birds have leghorn in them, a bit of flightiness is to be expected.

Yes, they are hybrids and not breeds.

California White -- The California White is a cross between a White Leghorn hen and a California Grey rooster.

Austra White -- Austra Whites are a cross between Black Australorp rooster and White Leghorn hens.

 

[EmRose]

Very, very likely, these are commercial layers sold with these various names. They aren't "breeds" at all. They are mixes, hybrids, blends of Leghorn, RIR, BA and other top layers to produce exotic parent stock to produce high production layers for the industry. Yes, these get sold through retail outlets and feed stores to consumers too.

Most of these commercial hybrids make efficient use of feed, mature early, and generally lay up a storm. If you like lots of eggs, you'll likely enjoy their production. Since so many of these kinds of birds have leghorn in them, a bit of flightiness is to be expected.

Yes, they are hybrids and not breeds.

California White -- The California White is a cross between a White Leghorn hen and a California Grey rooster.

Austra White -- Austra Whites are a cross between Black Australorp rooster and White Leghorn hens.

I guess I am still trying to undertand all this. I'm loose with the breed/hybid lingo so forgive my ignorance there... I was aware that CWs were crosses between WLs and CGs and that AWs were crosses between BAs and WLs - If I had not done this much research already I wouldn't have asked my initial question: what do I have? Hybrids can still have names, yes? I'm probably muddling this all up even more, now, and I understand that because the chicks were mislabeled from the beginning we may never know for sure what they are.

The facts I have about my chickens are these: they are white with black spots, they are somewhat flighty (not as much lately), and they are not meaty table birds. I assume they are white egg layers though they are not of age to produce any yet.

What I wanted to know was what known breeds or hybrids fit this description. If it could not be narrowed down to one than I was at least curious about all the possibilities. If I have any particular breed or hybrid, I would want to know what is is so that next time we order chickens we can decide if these are worth getting again, and so that I could give a review of them.

But Fred, are you saying mine are likely watered down beyond hybrid status, as in mutts? Produced from so many different pairings that it is hard to say what they are derived from? I think that's what I'm confused about here.

 

[Fred's Hens]

I'll try to explain. It is a complicated world.

If you find a breeder of true Rhode Island Reds, for example, and there may only be 10 or 12 TRUE breeders of heritage RIR in the United States. A half dozen of those folks are members here on BYC. Same with most breeds. True, pure bred birds are only kept by preservation, enthusiasts or show minded folks. Hatcheries mass produce birds by the hundreds of thousands, literally. Some of the birds they sell are said to "represent" the breed. Or, look and act sort of like the breed, enough to get away with saying, "This bird is a hatchery quality RIR", for example or "hatchery quality Barred Rock".

But... 99% of all the birds hatched in the world are commercial strains intended for the commercial hen houses. These commercial strains are hatched by the millions and billions, literally. Their purpose is to lay eggs. The commercial houses flip or rotate their flocks quickly, so there is always a need for new pullets. There are a few dozen strains of commercial laying birds that are most popular with the laying industry. ISA or Hubbard Browns, (and similar) for brown eggs and Leghorns for white eggs. But, also popular are derivations or hybrids using Leghorn. Lots of strains have been tweaked/mixed/crossed off the Leghorn base breed.

The hatcheries often merely call their strains White #1806 or White #1604. Or Brown Sex Link#2307 or Bovan Brown. Some of the hatcheries and genetic companies do attach "names" to these strains. Later, at the retail level, many of these commercial birds are indeed sold to the retail public for backyard or small holdings use. Even more names get indiscriminately applied. There are all kinds of made up names used to market and sell these various hybrid strains of commercial laying birds.

Why names at all? Well, people like names. They like to say about the birds they own and love, "This is Tetra Tint" or this is an Austra White. It gives people a sense of identity and value. Everything needs some kind of name. Even Labradoodle, for example, in the dog world. Mutt is such an avoided name. Nobody like hybrid much either, it seems. But in reality, yes, they are mixes, mutts, hybrids, etc. But, done with a purpose not just a "across the backyard fence mistake". The poultry genetics folks spend millions of dollars researching these various blends and hybrids. They are after specific results and hope to sell them to buyers would specific results as well.

Hope that helps.

 

[Fred's Hens]

BTW, if pressed to the wall, I'd absolutely guess California Whites.

 

[EmRose]

Thank you, I think understand better now. Indeed it is dissapointing to not be able to peg a definite name to them, but I love them just the same. I definitely get the dog reference... Those overpriced "designer" breeds are a laugh...

So for times sake, rather than calling them my "random white chickens," is it safe to stick with Cali Whites? And if we had actually received the Speckled Sussex like we ordered, would they have also been something similar to what we wanted but not true Speckled Sussex?

What I gather from all this is that the only way to be sure of what you have is to get them directly from true breeders. We ordered from a local chain, Farm King, which people from Illinois and Iowa might be familiar with, but I don't know where they get their chicks from.

 

[Fred's Hens]

Yes, saying California Whites would be just fine. It's just a name anyhow. The poultry genetics corporations that specialize in producing these super layers use highly selected strains and their information is closely guarded and kept as a trade secret. They've bred these strains and mixes for 10, 20 and 30 years. They are now so far from whatever they started with that it doesn't matter. I have some commercial hens too and like their performance very much.

I also have some very rare, heritage Barred Rocks and the difference is night and day. They too are terrific. Yes, both are chickens, but the difference between a heritage old line purebred bird and a modern, genetically selected, commercial bird is astounding. As far I as I am concerned, they both have their place.

As far as buying any breed, including the Speckled Sussex, from a mass producing, mail order type hatchery, well..... yes, they will be hatchery quality Speckled Sussex. Here's some we got from Hatchery X a few years back. Yes, they "represent" the breed. Nice birds in many ways, but I'm sure they're no where close to what old line, carefully bred, old line Speckled Sussex are. It's just the difference between buying a Beagle from a Westminster Dog Show champion breeder (for show looks) or a National Field Champion blood line Beagle hunting dog strain breeder produces versus buying a beagle from a local pet store or puppy mill. I've had lots of experience with both kinds of Beagles and again, both have their place, but it's night and day, it truly is.