Electric fence question

[LittleFeat]

I'm hoping some of you experienced with electric fences can help. I am putting a small Pet & Garden electric fence around the base of my coop/run 9" up from the ground. The run is basically predator proof but want the fence to keep my dogs from hassling the chickens. They can't get to them but constantly run around and butt their noses against the wire. My question: I have hardware cloth under the coop perimeter approx 2' out from the sides and just laying on the ground. It will be a couple of months before I get a load of dirt to put on top of it. If my dogs are standing on it when they touch their noses to the elec. fence, will it hurt them more than the normal zap of the fence to nose? I don't want to burn their feet but also don't want to wait 2 months to turn the fence on. I could possibly lay some cardboard sheets over the wire until they have gotten one good zap and they probably won't go near again but wanted your experienced advice first. What do you think?

 

[anngili]

If the hardware cloth is touching the dirt, the dog will most certainly get a much bigger zap, unless the ground is very, very dry. If you have one of the chargers that produces a continuous current, the dog can even get stuck there because of their muscles contracting. You want the dog to get some contact with the ground or a ground wire, but the hardware cloth could be a bit too much!
If it were me, I'd cover the hardware cloth with something that doesn't conduct electricity very much and run one or two ground wires parallel to the first so that the dog gets a zap of the intended strength.
If you're using one of the chargers that gives short, intermittant zaps, it's much less likely that any damage will be done to the dog (or any other animal, for that matter). They're usually more expensive but the zap they give is, in my experience, more than enough to deter predators, even dogs with very high prey drives. They're also a lot safer, too.

 

[LittleFeat]

Thanks Ann. That's kind of what I was thinking. I guess I'll go ahead and get some dirt even if I have to just buy it by the bag rather than a truck load like we are planning. I was hoping to wait until we had some raised garden beds ready to have the dirt delivered, but I really don't want my dogs getting zapped worse than what the fence connection itself will do. The chicks don't move out there permanently for a couple more weeks so maybe by then. Oh and I'm not sure whether the pulse is intermittant or continuous. The guy at the co-op said it wouldn't grab and hold on? It's a Patriot Pet and Garden and does have a ground rod.

 

[jhm47]

I have used electric fencers for about 50 years. The newer models are MUCH safer than the old ones. The old ones would sometimes start fires, because they gave a much longer duration shock. The new ones give an intense shock, but for such a short time (thousandths of a second) that they cannot cause fires or muscular lock to animals. An animal that comes in contact with one will have plenty of time to react and get away.

I wouldn't worry much about the dogs. They will most likely not get shocked more than twice. Dogs don't like electric fences, and learn quickly.

 

[Tala]

I wouldn't worry. Sometimes with the newer, safer electric fences you have to run a ground wire NEXT to the hot wire so that the animal touches both. I've done it because my neighbors had a Boxer that would charge the e-wires fast enough to break them while receiving minimal shock before they broke. I added a ground wire to the mix so he would receive more shock. (this was when we had hot wires only, no other fence up)

My own dog is wire-trained and never had to get shocked that way, but I have

Try it yourself, if you're really worried about it.

 

[Swamp Roo]

I am a firm, firm, firm believer in electric fences. My latest coop/run has a charger on it that is in the lower mid range of output as far as chargers is concerned, the point is something with a bit more power than yours. I took in a dog recently, she touched her nose to it once, and only once. I think she hit a low earth orbit when she did. She now absolutely refuses to go within 25 feet of the coop. Something I did differently on this coop that I will retrofit on the other coop, is I used 2" x 2" x aprox 2' long pieces of PT lumber. I made my own out of 2 x 4 stock, but you can buy 2x2s and cut to length. I then nailed an insulator 6" from the bottom, one just shy of the top, and one between the two on each 2x2x2. The outriggers (for lack of a better term) were then nailed at 45 degrees to the coop/run every ten feet with two at the corners (inline with the sides of the coop). Then I hot wired like normal. I had to drive some pieces of rebar on the inside of the "end" outriggers at the corners to keep them from moving (they wanted to be pulled towards the center of their respective walls). The thing that all this does, is it moves the hot wire away from the fence and any digging guards you may have. Now a coon can't reach between the wires and grab something, and if they jump up onto the run fence, they are to high to reach down and grab anything with out siting on a hot wire. I also ran more hot wire half way and all way up the run fence in case something did jump onto the fence. Oh I highly recommend not only running the ground wire to a grounding rod(s), but also to the fencing itself. It doesn't matter how dry the ground(dirt) gets, the critter will still close the circuit that way.

Swamp

 

[LittleFeat]

Thanks everyone! First off the coop is secure by itself, the electric fence is JUST to keep nosey noses away. The whole coop and run is completely enclosed with either wood, roofing, or hardware cloth, thus I wasn't looking for a strong electric fence. Oh and also our whole yard is also enclosed with chain link fencing. I have gone back and covered all the hardware cloth that is on the ground with dirt and then a layer of cypress mulch.

Thanks everyone for your advice as we are also putting in a large garden and will need to fence it off with an electric fence. Your input will greatly help with that as well.

I haven't turned the fence on yet but will this weekend and will give you an update of the introduction of it to my dogs and cats!

Swamp....I ran the wire 9" above the ground and used 2 insulators on each corner to keep the wire off the corners.

 

[gsim]

I am doing 4 strands on my fence charger job. I would not worry about the dog either. All newer fence chargers are pulse-type and deliver a very short duration pulse. Mine is 4 KV. Good that you have the hardware cloth aroung the perimeter. My perimeter is 180 ft so I opted to have a shallow trench and set my 6 ft tall welded wire 2x4 fence in cement. Cheaper by far. That and the charger will do it for any four-legged varmints. I did put a 24 inch tall roll of chicken wire around the perimeter too, to keep my peeps from poking their heads out of the pen and keep coons from grabbing them and pulling them through in pieces, which they will do. I am installing a strand of barbed wire above the top of the fence and am tensioning it using turnbuckles. I will then attach the top of the fence to it. This will stabilize and stiffen the top of my fence and add a bit of protection in the event of a night time power failure.

 

[Swamp Roo]

Quote:
For dogs, perfect (unless they are tiny or huge). Make sure to keep the weeds down, especially with a relatively low powered unit. You might still consider puting in a couple of more hot wires up the side to the coop. Cheap insurance, and you probably have enough materials left over to do it. Personally, I wouldn't relax unless my whole coop and run was 1/4'' welded steel and 3/4"bars, but I don't live in bear prone a area so that would be enough here. But that's just me... "Captain Overkill".

Try to be around when the pups "meet" the fence. They will want reassurance, and if they react weird like jumping forward instead for back, they could catch a collar or something. Be prepared for a pretty good squawk coming from the dogs. Not my favorite thing in the world, but better for everyone in the long run.

Swamp