Farming and Homesteading Heritage Poultry

[Yellow House Farm]

Cybercat, we too are looking into software. As you use yours more, and more, let us know what you think of it as a product.

The "visibility" of the marker is a good point. We have wing bands, which, though accurrate, are not visible for a quick and unassuming observation. I think we might start the colored leg bands on mature birds. I don't like the idea of leg bands on growing birds because they require me to be on top of replacing them as they out grow them, and I often forget, which gets their circulation into trouble.

 

[Urbanfarmerkc]

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I like the idea of raising chickens for both or for that matter what ever makes you want to have chickens. There are a LOT of folks who are vegetarian on here that raise chickens I've even seen some that are vegan and they don't even eat the eggs... LOL but we need as many folks raising birds as possible.

As far as ornamental v/s utility... When I got back into chickens after not having them for years, I ordered as many breeds as I could handle (truth is a lot more than I could handle) The chickens I didn't want, went to an Amish family who butchered them for me. Although small, the silkies made an absolutely DELICIOUS soup... Weird because it was black but good really good tasting. The Polish turned out to be small and had the body type of a quail but tasted good none the less. I ended up baking these. My cochins again were small but tasty... Not as good as the others but they definitely deserve a mention for being a good eating bird.

So, you can raise and eat any bird even the so called ornamentals but my biggest point here is not to pass judgement on the folks raising birds just to have as pets. The chicken world needs as much and as many folks working to keep these birds from extinction, and also to keep big brother at bey, as possible.

 

[saladin]

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Toe punches and nostril cuts would be much easier to use in your situation Yellow House.

 

[saladin]

Quote:
I like the idea of raising chickens for both or for that matter what ever makes you want to have chickens. There are a LOT of folks who are vegetarian on here that raise chickens I've even seen some that are vegan and they don't even eat the eggs... LOL but we need as many folks raising birds as possible.

As far as ornamental v/s utility... When I got back into chickens after not having them for years, I ordered as many breeds as I could handle (truth is a lot more than I could handle) The chickens I didn't want, went to an Amish family who butchered them for me. Although small, the silkies made an absolutely DELICIOUS soup... Weird because it was black but good really good tasting. The Polish turned out to be small and had the body type of a quail but tasted good none the less. I ended up baking these. My cochins again were small but tasty... Not as good as the others but they definitely deserve a mention for being a good eating bird.

So, you can raise and eat any bird even the so called ornamentals but my biggest point here is not to pass judgement on the folks raising birds just to have as pets. The chicken world needs as much and as many folks working to keep these birds from extinction, and also to keep big brother at bey, as possible.

I will gladly stand in judgement of the chicken pet people when they start breeding the birds and can't cull! Hopefully, others will join me in that judgement before the pet people ruin our farm breeds like the ruined our Hunting Dogs (Irish Setter is a good case in point: in the States).

 

[saladin]

Pet people give me much more cause for worry than Big Brother. That is just my opinion, but last I looked I was entitled too it as you are too yours.

 

[Yellow House Farm]

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Toe punches and nostril cuts would be much easier to use in your situation Yellow House.

We use toe punching and wing bands. Nostril cuts? Do explain!

 

[vnsseed]

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Ditto on what they said. I am very interested in this as well. We are breeding Dominiques and Speckled Sussex, mainly for dual purpose/utilitarian reasons, as well as temperment (as our birds will be interacting with the public in museum environments) but also looking to try and hold to the Standard. We are also working on a cross breeding project where we are trying to bring back the look and use of the "Dunghill Fowl" (thru zooarchaeology and research) so prevelant on New England farms in the 18th and 19th century. We have a couple of museums on board with our project as well. I'll be keeping an eye on this thread and look forward to good conversation.

 

[Yellow House Farm]

Quote:
I like the idea of raising chickens for both or for that matter what ever makes you want to have chickens. There are a LOT of folks who are vegetarian on here that raise chickens I've even seen some that are vegan and they don't even eat the eggs... LOL but we need as many folks raising birds as possible.

As far as ornamental v/s utility... When I got back into chickens after not having them for years, I ordered as many breeds as I could handle (truth is a lot more than I could handle) The chickens I didn't want, went to an Amish family who butchered them for me. Although small, the silkies made an absolutely DELICIOUS soup... Weird because it was black but good really good tasting. The Polish turned out to be small and had the body type of a quail but tasted good none the less. I ended up baking these. My cochins again were small but tasty... Not as good as the others but they definitely deserve a mention for being a good eating bird.

So, you can raise and eat any bird even the so called ornamentals but my biggest point here is not to pass judgement on the folks raising birds just to have as pets. The chicken world needs as much and as many folks working to keep these birds from extinction, and also to keep big brother at bey, as possible.

Well, firstly, I don't know that I've personally said anything on here to "pass judgment" on pet people, but, to the point, this thread is distinctly not about "pet people". THe whole purpose of this thread is to discuss fowl in their farming context which is to include meat and eggs.

Do I have contention with the ideas espoused by pet people? Yes and no. That which people do at home with their chickens is of no concern to me in an ideal universe. If you want to put your chicken in a diaper and bring it inside, cool. I once was visited by a distaught woman who was deperately looking for a modern game bantam pullet to replace her recently deceased female, who had left her mate very loney. They lived inside, roosted on her bed board, and she didn't mind the droppings because they were "so little and not intrusive". The NH Libertarian in me could care less.

However, right off the bat, I can think of two very big issues concerning pet people:

1) These people anthropomorphize and cathect their poultry--not a problem. However, when they mistake these harmless fantasies for reality and then think that there should be laws to make everyone else live by their notions, well, hmm..... The adult in me starts to take distinct issue with this. So it is not that I begrudge people the bambi-ization of their fowl, although I do think it a bit silly, but I do object to their ideas as a political presence.

2) In concert with Saladin, "breeders", who psychologically cannot submit to the discipline of proper breeding, need to be outstandingly forthcoming with those who would purchase their "stock" to make a start in chickens. Just because someone is kissy-kissy with their chickens doesn't mean those chickens are of any quality. Moreover, if they sell these chickens to others, they potentially undermine the noble efforts of those hoping to make a good start in chickens. After a few years with some silly "breeder's" silkie-cochin-olive-egger cross, they might throw in the towel thinking themselves unable or lacking the "green thumb" (what color is a chicken thumb? Don't answer that....). They may not realize that the problem is the poor breeding which they purchased.

Propagating poofy and muffy does not make anyone a breeder, and no farm or homestead, which is the focus of this thread, needs poofy or muffy. Although I am very gentle with poofy and muffy people, I do not pass up an oppotunity to say a quiet word here or there to help them grow as a keeper of poultry. Poofy and muffy-based emotions, although they may seem to be about the chickens, are actually ego-centric, as is always the case when we cathect, which is fine, it is what it is.

Being a good breeder is chicken-centric, and never the 'twain shall meet.

 

[Yellow House Farm]

Quote:
Ditto on what they said. I am very interested in this as well. We are breeding Dominiques and Speckled Sussex, mainly for dual purpose/utilitarian reasons, as well as temperment (as our birds will be interacting with the public in museum environments) but also looking to try and hold to the Standard. We are also working on a cross breeding project where we are trying to bring back the look and use of the "Dunghill Fowl" (thru zooarchaeology and research) so prevelant on New England farms in the 18th and 19th century. We have a couple of museums on board with our project as well. I'll be keeping an eye on this thread and look forward to good conversation.

Aahh! Two worth breeds, but the Dunghill fowl......an interesting idea.

Here's my idea about Dunghill fowl in New England. I don't actually think they were ever a breed in the APA-sense of the word. I believe they were what was referred to when I was a kid as bantams. Bantams had nothing to do with ABA birds and were certainly not the size of a robin. When I was a kid in rural NH, you had bantams, which were quasi-feral fowl based in Old English Games with untold amounts of utility fowl crossed in without any rime or reason. Saladin, check me up on this, but I believe cockers refer to them as something like "mean games" (??).

When I was a kid there were bantams all over the place. As a boy we had 100 at least that slept in the bull pines surrounding the house. There were so many of them we never knew when one disappeared, but she turned up one day with a dozen chicks in tow. Bantams were great, you'd find bantam nests in every hay stack or loft, under wood piles, stumps, what have you. The cocks would fight like the dickens, but it usually wasn't fatal.

Gosh, I miss them, they were my first love of poultry. Sadly, I think they're all gone now, but, I'm telling you what, for all of their mongrel-ness they're unmistakeable, and if I ever visit an old NH farm with a old-fashioned flock of bantams, I'll be filling my hat with eggs!

 

[vnsseed]

Quote:
Ditto on what they said. I am very interested in this as well. We are breeding Dominiques and Speckled Sussex, mainly for dual purpose/utilitarian reasons, as well as temperment (as our birds will be interacting with the public in museum environments) but also looking to try and hold to the Standard. We are also working on a cross breeding project where we are trying to bring back the look and use of the "Dunghill Fowl" (thru zooarchaeology and research) so prevelant on New England farms in the 18th and 19th century. We have a couple of museums on board with our project as well. I'll be keeping an eye on this thread and look forward to good conversation.

Aahh! Two worth breeds, but the Dunghill fowl......an interesting idea.

Here's my idea about Dunghill fowl in New England. I don't actually think they were ever a breed in the APA-sense of the word. I believe they were what was referred to when I was a kid as bantams. Bantams had nothing to do with ABA birds and were certainly not the size of a robin. When I was a kid in rural NH, you had bantams, which were quasi-feral fowl based in Old English Games with untold amounts of utility fowl crossed in without any rime or reason. Saladin, check me up on this, but I believe cockers refer to them as something like "mean games" (??).

When I was a kid there were bantams all over the place. As a boy we had 100 at least that slept in the bull pines surrounding the house. There were so many of them we never knew when one disappeared, but she turned up one day with a dozen chicks in tow. Bantams were great, you'd find bantam nests in every hay stack or loft, under wood piles, stumps, what have you. The cocks would fight like the dickens, but it usually wasn't fatal.

Gosh, I miss them, they were my first love of poultry. Sadly, I think they're all gone now, but, I'm telling you what, for all of their mongrel-ness they're unmistakeable, and if I ever visit an old NH farm with a old-fashioned flock of bantams, I'll be filling my hat with eggs!

They certainly aren't a breed based on any APA Standard... we are using primary source doc from the 17th-19th century, paintings (mainly Dutch 18th c paintings from NY State), and zooarcheaology reports to achieve the look of the dunghill fowl. If you look at probate inventories from the 18th century you will find mention of dunghill fowl, basically cross bred mutt birds, however they were cross bred from certain breeds by location...i.e. a dunghill in Albany, NY would look different from a dunghill in Portsmouth, NH based on the breeds that were imported from the "old country". We are focusing mainly on Boston dunghills, however in order to achieve the total look we will need to add Red Dorkings to our breeding program (in the opinion of my genetics expert...aka my wife

). The problem is that we made a commitment to ourselves that any breed we used for this dunghill project would also be a breed that we carried on, and at the moment we don't have a enough breeding pens to properly breed Dorkings. So we will wait. We also have some paintings and period descriptions of what we believe to be a single comb Dominique, so we have a couple of them (at this point by accident... apparently one of my hens is throwing single comb chicks, we have it narrowed down to 3 of them) we are working with for museums so they can have a representation of this. We are still working towards breeding the Dom's, as well as the Speckled Sussex, to the SOP and have acquired some show quality birds and are working with an experienced breeder/exhibitor of Dominiques in western NH.