Feeding Question

[Enchanted1s]

So, we are very new to this and I have learned so much here at BYC! We learned that young chicks need a Starter / Grower feed and laying hens need a Layer feed (still not real clear on what the Rooster is supposed to eat. I read that you should put their feed at about the height of their back - so here's my dilemma. Outside, we have 1 Rooster, 1 Laying Hen and two Pullets - about 4 months old. HOW do I get the young ones to eat their Starter/Grower feed instead of the Layer feed? What about the rooster? Most of the feed containers I have seen don't have a way to have different heights ? I just finished reading about a 5gal bucket feeder with 3" street elbows - I bought the elbows and was planning on making them two of these feeders tomorrow - one for the Layer feed and one for the Hens.

THANKS

 

[oldhenlikesdogs]

Hens do not require a layer ration. Nothing special about it except the extra calcium. Chicks need a starter grower. Roosters live shorter lives eating layer in my experiences. So mine get either a non medicated starter grower if there are chicks in the flock or an All Flock ration with a separate bowl of oyster shells for the calcium needs. Simple.

 

[Cellomama2]

I've had a similar dilemma since I have hens and pullets. Please correct me if I'm wrong but I've read you use the starter/grower for all in the coop until the pullets can switch to layer and then have a container of oyster shell for the hen to pick at as she needs in the mean time. The pullets are supposed to leave the oyster shell alone. As far as the rooster I think he just eats whatever is around but I don't have one so don't know for sure. I do know that the pullets will go after the layer feed and have read that long term thats very bad for them. This is what I'm doing at the moment and haven't seen any ill affects so far. I also have a Little Giant Hanging Feeder that I formed a foil cover for and have it slightly raised on a step my husband made just so it keeps some of the leaves and dirt out. I have Silkies to ISA Browns size wise and no one seems to have issues with it so I don't know that the height is terribly important as long as everyone can reach it.

 

[Enchanted1s]

Thanks - but how do you get the pullets to eat the Starter / Grower and NOT the Layer? Actually, we are having an issue with the Rooster and Hen letting the Pullets eat all together, but I still have not found an effective way to ensure that everyone is getting what they need.

 

[oldhenlikesdogs]

That's why I said you shouldn't feed a layer, it isn't necessary. A good grower or an All Flock works well. Hens do not require a layer, that's a myth. They do require free access to oyster shells.

 

[rjohns39]

I would suggest feeding to the lowest common denominator. So if you have young ones on grower, feed everyone grower. I'll talk about the different feeds in a bit. Though it's true that heritage hens do best when we slow their growth and let them develop slower, they will almost always choose the higher protein feed for the kids. And sometimes our setups make it impractical to work toward the "perfect" (if there is such a thing) solution.

The issue with the rooster and layer is the excess calcium. Excess calcium will shorten his life, it's a question of how much over what period of time. Not all layers are formulated the same. I've seen layers with over 200 pounds per ton while others have 100 pounds per ton compared to a grower which has 20 pounds per ton.

What I've outlined below is just to give you an idea on the variety of feeds available.

You likely won't be able to find all the variations I'm showing you below in your local feed store and many manufactures and mills look to combine different growth stages. It's more economical to have less feed varieties. All of these are for heritage breeds, production breeds typically use three variants (starter, grower, layer/all flock). CX Meat birds generally only use one (broiler).

• Chick Starter 20-22% protein (used for first six weeks of life to give them a good start)
• Chick Grower 18-20% protein (used for the next six weeks or until point of lay)
• Pullet Developer 18-20% protein (increased vitamins designed for optimum reproductive health, fed the 3rd six weeks of life)
• Cockerel Developer 16-18% protein (increased vitamins designed for optimum reproductive health, fed the 3rd six weeks of life)
• Breeder holding/all flock 13-16% protein (used for birds not hatching eggs and cockerels not breeding)
• Layer ~16% protein and high calcium (used after start of lay to increase egg production)
• Breeder Layer 16-18% protein significantly increased vitamins (started 30 days before collecting eggs for incubation, used to maximize hatch rates).
• Finisher 16-18% protein (used for rapid weight gain and development of fat, 30-60 days prior to processing)

For all of these variants Grit and oyster shell are offered free choice. They were also developed assuming birds have daily access to fresh pasture.

 

[ChickenCanoe]

Excellent advice from all, especially the last post from rjohns39.
I might also add that mature roosters do quite well on a 13% protein feed and 1% calcium. Problem is, it isn't really available and is expensive if it is. The good thing is that you have fewer birds to feed with it. Purina makes a 12.5% game bird maintenance feed that I sometimes use.
It isn't fool proof but you can elevate the roosters' feed so the others can't access it and have hen/pullet feeders with small openings the rooster can't get his head into.
Not all breeds/lines of birds are as susceptible to excess calcium as others but why take the chance.
About 1% calcium is adequate for all birds not actively building egg shells. But to complicate matters, a mixed flock of various ages and breeds where one bird may lay an egg every week or two and doesn't need more calcium if any. Then having other birds in the same flock laying 6 or 7 eggs a week, the approximately 4% calcium layer may not be enough.

Most feed recipes were formulated based on what commercial chickens need. That's what we have to work with. Commercial layer flocks all hatch and come into lay at the same time, are kept in blackout housing on a strict lighting regimen, are kept for laying for about 18 months and then become Campbell's soup. With hundreds of thousands of hens, they can't and don't care about a few birds that fall through the cracks and either get urolithiasis or rickets.
I'm not really mad about that. When the bulk of the human population is of the urban variety, someone has to feed them. And they do so as cheaply as possible so people can go to Wally World to buy eggs for $1.50 a dozen eggs.

 

[Enchanted1s]

Thank you all so much! I re-read your post @oldhenlikesdogs - I see what you are saying now. Remove the Layer feed until the little ones grow up! I can do that! I will have to get some Oyster shells for Tootie. We have only one hen that is laying. She gives us one egg almost every day We have two pullets that are about 8 weeks and three babies that hatched Monday, 27 Nov. I just finished making two of the 5 gal bucket feeders with 3" street elbows (found the info here!). I was planning to put Layer in one and Grower in the other, but I will just put out the Grower and look for Oyster Shells.

How long will the Layer Crumble keep? Funds are beyond tight and really don't want to waste it. Thank you all!!

 

[rjohns39]

Thank you all so much! I re-read your post @oldhenlikesdogs - I see what you are saying now. Remove the Layer feed until the little ones grow up! I can do that! I will have to get some Oyster shells for Tootie. We have only one hen that is laying. She gives us one egg almost every day We have two pullets that are about 8 weeks and three babies that hatched Monday, 27 Nov. I just finished making two of the 5 gal bucket feeders with 3" street elbows (found the info here!). I was planning to put Layer in one and Grower in the other, but I will just put out the Grower and look for Oyster Shells.

How long will the Layer Crumble keep? Funds are beyond tight and really don't want to waste it. Thank you all!!

Now you're asking really hard questions. It really depends on the ingredients, how old they were when milled, etc. Mine (custom blend) can last 4-6 months in an airtight container that's cool and dark. Many others less than two months.

 

[ChickenCanoe]

Thank you all so much! I re-read your post @oldhenlikesdogs - I see what you are saying now. Remove the Layer feed until the little ones grow up! I can do that! I will have to get some Oyster shells for Tootie. We have only one hen that is laying. She gives us one egg almost every day We have two pullets that are about 8 weeks and three babies that hatched Monday, 27 Nov. I just finished making two of the 5 gal bucket feeders with 3" street elbows (found the info here!). I was planning to put Layer in one and Grower in the other, but I will just put out the Grower and look for Oyster Shells.

How long will the Layer Crumble keep? Funds are beyond tight and really don't want to waste it. Thank you all!!

Refrigerate the feed and it will keep much longer.
8 weeks is WAAAY too young to be on layer feed. Hopefully the baby chicks haven't had any more than a day or two.
Two feeders won't help because you won't be able to make the birds to eat from the right container.