FERMENTED FEEDS...anyone using them?

Pics
Thank you so much Bee! I have been searching for a thread on "Road to recovery...." I have just started reading it and will continue reading the whole thread and most certainly learn lots!
I know I need to dust them I checked one of the sicker birds about an hour ago and not surprising she is covered with little reddish bugs. I am using the deep litter in the coop...pine shavings and DE but I'm not real keep on the dust from the DE so I probably didnt use enough....I like the idea of using ashes instead would that be better? I put a big tote in their run with ashed from our fireplace but they havent used it yet. they are pretty much hanging around under coop right now with some venturing out into run and to free range. I am going to dust all of them tonight and tomorrow to at least get rid of bugs. Not sure from what little inspection on the one if they have gleet...thank for the pics on that thread. their feet dont look like scaly mites but I definitely see paler combs on most of them especially the sicker ones.
It is upsetting that the guy I got them from sold them to me like this knowing I am inexperienced....he said I could bring them back for a refund but I really don't want to bring them back to that type of environment and neglect.
I'll stop the treats and continue with the acv in water and ff and dust them. Is their something additional to put some weight on them? What about mealworms?
I've read some of the other threads on deep litter and ff but not all of the threads....I am going to go read now...thanks bunches!

I've learned some things since that thread and I'll tell you that I never really eradicated the recurrence of those mites and lice with the wood ashes, though they did indeed help, they kept coming back to some of the birds. It wasn't until I used Pyrethrin powder on the Gnarly Bunch that I finally got relief from those parasites. The DE may help but I've read reports of many using it to no avail for this type of a problem...I've never used DE, so I'm not one to speak of it's effectiveness.

I wouldn't use any of the DE or Pyrethrin in the coop environment, just on the birds themselves and in the nest boxes, but you wouldn't want to kill any beneficial bugs in your deep litter...they may be the ones that can keep the population of parasites down for you given time.

If you are feeding FF, you won't need the ACV in the water at all, I've found...unless you just want it to keep your water more fresh. I wouldn't add anything in addition to put weight on them...I made that mistake, even just a little, and found myself with hugely fat birds in a short time. It's tempting to try and compensate for their poor care in another place but it isn't really good or healthy for them to gain weight quickly. Just let the healthy feeds, fresh soils and good husbandry heal them at a decent pace and you'll soon see the results.

Here's something you might try, though, just because I accidentally found it is a good immunity booster and will help if they have scale mites~even if they don't, it would still be good to try this to guard against getting them in their weakened state. Castor Oil. Very cheap, odorless, tasteless, colorless...but what a wonderful old timey solution for parasites and a conditioner for hair, feathers, and scales. I'll never be without it in my chicken husbandry now that I've found it...I rank it right up there beside the NuStock for versatility, for effectiveness and for still being all natural.

I read up on it one day just out of curiosity and realized I had stumbled on an old remedy that Grandma used to talk about for humans, but I felt could be used for chickens too. The GB were still having recurring scale mite issues because I had made my NuStock mix too, too thick and it couldn't penetrate under scales like it did when I was using the store bought original. Instead of making a new batch, I decided to use the castor oil on their legs.

What a quick turnaround and return to supple, healthy scales! Even quicker than with the use of the NS! While I had them in my hands, I went ahead and gave each a dropper full of the castor oil. The next day or so I noticed their combs were cherry red and they've stayed that way ever since! Don't worry that it will give them diarrhea...it didn't do that to my birds at all, nor to others' who have tried it on their flocks. One fella with confirmed worms in his flock reported the reddening of the combs as well and noticed worms being shed in the feces after the dose.

Just another little tidbit learned along the way that can help you work smarter and not harder. I know what you mean about getting sick birds from someone who should know better...I've had that happen to me in the past and I had to kill all of them...wasted my money but taught me a lesson about trusting people and being too nice, and also about not trusting my gut instincts. If the sale feels scary, it is scary and you should walk away...that's what I learned.

Please keep some pics of your flock and their progress...it sure is educational to others when people see you recovering a sick flock without the use of traditional poultry meds.
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This is SUCH a helpful thread! I've read through the whole thing once before, but it has been awhile so I apologize if this has been covered!

I finally have some good buckets, and I am ready to start fermenting my birds' feed. I have mostly ducks, but do have 3 Buckeyes that have been added recently.

Normally I get a non-GMO grain feed but missed the last order and had to get something in the meantime. Semi-close to me I can get a different non-GMO feed, but it is very powdery because it is corn and soy free and has to have liquid added so they can eat it effectively. For the past week I've been taking a few scoops of the grain feed and progressively more scoops of the new feed, putting them in a bucket at the beginning of the day with non-chlorinated water, stirring really well, making sure there is 1 inch of water above the solid part, putting on an air-tight lid and letting it sit until night when we feed them. They have definitely been enjoying it, and we are getting more eggs. I am trying to decide if I want to stop getting their old feed completely and just feed them the new feed, but I definitely want to ferment it and am not sure if there would be a point to fermenting the new feed or if it would be a good idea. These are the first ingredients, before you get to the vitamins and such- Oats, wheat middlings, cheese meal, alfalfa meal, calcium carbonate, flax seed, canola seed, canola meal, lentils, fish meal, pork meat and bone meal, animal fat, blood meal. Because it is so powdery, when water is added the water turns a brown/green color which I'm assuming contains a lot of the vitamins and minerals so I don't think draining it off would be a good idea. My current idea is that I could mix up a bucket with the necessary amount of water head-room, close it with the airtight lid, and leave it for a day or two. Right now I have two buckets like that so I could let it sit for two days. Would that even be helpful with those ingredients?

I am not ready to start making/mixing my own feed. And I may just go ahead and keep getting their old feed which is mostly grain and would be simple enough to ferment. I can't get starter or grower from this place, so for now I still have to get some from the old place.

Thank you!
don't need an air tight lid only a towel over it with the lid just kind of laid on it on the side like so it can get air through the towel.
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That's HOW it works if it can get air.


OPPS I see where Bee told you that already.
 
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I've learned some things since that thread and I'll tell you that I never really eradicated the recurrence of those mites and lice with the wood ashes, though they did indeed help, they kept coming back to some of the birds. It wasn't until I used Pyrethrin powder on the Gnarly Bunch that I finally got relief from those parasites. The DE may help but I've read reports of many using it to no avail for this type of a problem...I've never used DE, so I'm not one to speak of it's effectiveness.

I wouldn't use any of the DE or Pyrethrin in the coop environment, just on the birds themselves and in the nest boxes, but you wouldn't want to kill any beneficial bugs in your deep litter...they may be the ones that can keep the population of parasites down for you given time.

If you are feeding FF, you won't need the ACV in the water at all, I've found...unless you just want it to keep your water more fresh. I wouldn't add anything in addition to put weight on them...I made that mistake, even just a little, and found myself with hugely fat birds in a short time. It's tempting to try and compensate for their poor care in another place but it isn't really good or healthy for them to gain weight quickly. Just let the healthy feeds, fresh soils and good husbandry heal them at a decent pace and you'll soon see the results.

Here's something you might try, though, just because I accidentally found it is a good immunity booster and will help if they have scale mites~even if they don't, it would still be good to try this to guard against getting them in their weakened state. Castor Oil. Very cheap, odorless, tasteless, colorless...but what a wonderful old timey solution for parasites and a conditioner for hair, feathers, and scales. I'll never be without it in my chicken husbandry now that I've found it...I rank it right up there beside the NuStock for versatility, for effectiveness and for still being all natural.

I read up on it one day just out of curiosity and realized I had stumbled on an old remedy that Grandma used to talk about for humans, but I felt could be used for chickens too. The GB were still having recurring scale mite issues because I had made my NuStock mix too, too thick and it couldn't penetrate under scales like it did when I was using the store bought original. Instead of making a new batch, I decided to use the castor oil on their legs.

What a quick turnaround and return to supple, healthy scales! Even quicker than with the use of the NS! While I had them in my hands, I went ahead and gave each a dropper full of the castor oil. The next day or so I noticed their combs were cherry red and they've stayed that way ever since! Don't worry that it will give them diarrhea...it didn't do that to my birds at all, nor to others' who have tried it on their flocks. One fella with confirmed worms in his flock reported the reddening of the combs as well and noticed worms being shed in the feces after the dose.

Just another little tidbit learned along the way that can help you work smarter and not harder. I know what you mean about getting sick birds from someone who should know better...I've had that happen to me in the past and I had to kill all of them...wasted my money but taught me a lesson about trusting people and being too nice, and also about not trusting my gut instincts. If the sale feels scary, it is scary and you should walk away...that's what I learned.

Please keep some pics of your flock and their progress...it sure is educational to others when people see you recovering a sick flock without the use of traditional poultry meds.
thumbsup.gif
Thanks again I will use the powder instead and get some castor oil. I use to have some in the house long ago and forgot about it's many benefits. I took some pics and made an album , here is the link
https://www.backyardchickens.com/g/...sick-infested-underweight-and-probably-anemic

I checked on them tonight and the sickest one is really looking bad...I will be surprised if she makes it through the night. .
Sad she is one of the friendliest of the six.
I am more mad at myself for ignoring the red flags with the guy I got them from . I may decide to take them all back and start over with healthy birds. I keep fluctuating,
I have learned from my first experience many many things....
 
anyone throw veggies into your slop? we have green beans, crook neck squash, cuccumbers, and zuccini
no I just toss that sort of thing out there to them. I've read not to feed them beans unless they were cooked but then I've also read other stuff that wasn't true to so who knows. But I have cooked my green beans b 4 giving to them. Mine love the zucchini raw.
 
Thanks again I will use the powder instead and get some castor oil. I use to have some in the house long ago and forgot about it's many benefits. I took some pics and made an album , here is the link
https://www.backyardchickens.com/g/...sick-infested-underweight-and-probably-anemic

I checked on them tonight and the sickest one is really looking bad...I will be surprised if she makes it through the night. .
Sad she is one of the friendliest of the six.
I am more mad at myself for ignoring the red flags with the guy I got them from . I may decide to take them all back and start over with healthy birds. I keep fluctuating,
I have learned from my first experience many many things....
Oh man I sure hope they make it! Don't know what you're battling here with the sick birds but IF it is some of the things they can get, even if you brought in non sick birds depending on IF whatever it is your birds have, you could give it to the new ones. What makes you think they're sick? What are their symptoms?
 
Oh man I sure hope they make it! Don't know what you're battling here with the sick birds but IF it is some of the things they can get, even if you brought in non sick birds depending on IF whatever it is your birds have, you could give it to the new ones. What makes you think they're sick? What are their symptoms? 

Well I was wondering about how to prepare for the new birds...any suggestions? I have talked to 2 different breeders that have young Light Brahmas close by and will go look at them next weekend....I will thoroughly inspect the birds and ask lots of questions this time! I also am waiting on 12 lavender orpingtons to hatch around the Sept 20th....so it's hyper important to get rid of whatever disease it is.

Symptoms are lethargy, closed eyes, sneezing and or coughing not sure what some of the sounds are since these are my first chickens....diarea sometimes but normal in color from looking at poop pics here. First day there was just the one BR showing signs, she has gotten worse each day making sounds like trouble breathing....last night she went into coop by herself and layed with face in corner..2 of the others were showing signs as well..I just don't know what more to do... I really dont want to just pump antibiotics in my birds everytime they get sick.
One of the many red flags I ignored or didnt see when I picked them up was first thing out of the guys mouth was "He just noticed his birds have a bit of a cold...just like people get...and to just put some electrolites in water" well okay being new and excited about my first chickens I said great! I didn't have a say in which one or have the opportunity to check them before he caught them and stuck them in the cage I brought. I want very much to be able to rehab them but I also don't want to have to deal with someone elses mis-management and care....and I paid 15$ each which isn't much but I was expecting healthy birds. I certainly will strive to never let my next birds get in this kind of condition. Not sure how long to wait if I do return them.
I'm going now to go check on them. Thanks everyone there is so much more to learn and so thrilled to have this forum to come to.

Edit: will post something on the OT about symptoms and see what suggestions I get..
 
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Well I was wondering about how to prepare for the new birds...any suggestions? I have talked to 2 different breeders that have young Light Brahmas close by and will go look at them next weekend....I will thoroughly inspect the birds and ask lots of questions this time! I also am waiting on 12 lavender orpingtons to hatch around the Sept 20th....so it's hyper important to get rid of whatever disease it is.

Symptoms are lethargy, closed eyes, sneezing and or coughing not sure what some of the sounds are since these are my first chickens....diarea sometimes but normal in color from looking at poop pics here. First day there was just the one BR showing signs, she has gotten worse each day making sounds like trouble breathing....last night she went into coop by herself and layed with face in corner..2 of the others were showing signs as well..I just don't know what more to do... I really dont want to just pump antibiotics in my birds everytime they get sick.
One of the many red flags I ignored or didnt see when I picked them up was first thing out of the guys mouth was "He just noticed his birds have a bit of a cold...just like people get...and to just put some electrolites in water" well okay being new and excited about my first chickens I said great! I didn't have a say in which one or have the opportunity to check them before he caught them and stuck them in the cage I brought. I want very much to be able to rehab them but I also don't want to have to deal with someone elses mis-management and care....and I paid 15$ each which isn't much but I was expecting healthy birds. I certainly will strive to never let my next birds get in this kind of condition. Not sure how long to wait if I do return them.
I'm going now to go check on them. Thanks everyone there is so much more to learn and so thrilled to have this forum to come to.

Edit: will post something on the OT about symptoms and see what suggestions I get..

Sorry to hear you're having this experience. Being very new to this I really can't offer too much solid advice. You may wish to be very cautious about bringing new birds into the mix, do a search on quarantine or biosecurity. Even if all the birds passed in this group, you may want to wait awhile before you put new birds into this coop & run. Just my two cents, I wouldn't want you to have a similar experience with new birds. I'm sure others can better advice on this.
 
Sorry to tell you this....when the FF smells like rancid vomit is when it is most filled with the beneficial microbes that is one of the goals of feeding the FF. ...
You've been throwing out the best stuff and feeding your chickens only slightly fermented feeds..which is fine, but it won't hurt to let it ferment further and feed that as well.
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The most recent batch of FF lasted ~ 5 weeks before I mis-estimated how much my growing chicks would eat in a day, and had very little "starter" left in the bucket. (Usually I leave two inches of glop in the bottom of the bucket to stir in with the fresh powdery feed and well water.) Most of the time it smells like sourdough starter, or rising bread dough made with non-wheat flours. My feed does have fish meal in it, which probably adds to the nastiness when it is "off" and my husband gags every time I bring the bucket out from under the sink (even on the good days), but he is a sensitive little hot-house flower when it comes to smells
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In my previous career, I learned I had a relatively strong stomach when I helped work on decomposing bodies in the local morgue. I don't say that to brag on myself, just to let you know that if I thought the smell was intolerable at arm's length, it was really bad.

Regarding castor oil as a wormer, do you think one eyedropper is an okay dose for a juvenile chicken, or should I decrease the dose for a smaller bird? I accidentally bought castor oil when I had cod liver oil on the brain, but will keep the castor oil now that I have a good use for it. I don't mind worming my flock if they actually need it, but don't want to eat those chemicals in my meat, and don't want to worm on a schedule, without regard to the bird's parasite status. That's how we got drench-resistant worms in the USA sheep and goat flocks. And how we got multi-drug resistant pathogens in the humans, but don't get me started on THAT topic!

Thanks for the reminder about NuStock. I have the tea tree oil and powdered sulfur at home, but I still need to render some lard, weigh the active ingredients, and mix the whole thing together.
 
Beekissed - where can I find the recipe for NuStock - or what is your recipe for it? I would have to order it over the border (if they do that), and making it seems like it might be much simpler considering I likely have most of the ingredients at home!

KaFox - keep us posted on your birds. I hope at least some of them pull through. Nothing like good food and water to help them. Are you able to let them free range at all? They may be able to help themselves a bit that way too.
 

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