FERMENTED FEEDS...anyone using them?

[kpgoldstar]

I did try to save her, but she died. It's very sad, my kids and I think of our birds as pets. Dottie was a sweet brahma who hung out with our little bantams. She was suppose to be a large bird but instead was always small.

I'm so sorry niqueie. I have a Dottie in my flock too. I replaced my last empty nester Chihuahua with chickens after we lost her. I feel your pain. It is never easy to lose an animal, no matter the species.

 

[pegm]

My hens are also starting to not eat the ff, they barely touched it today, and it was quite cold (well, relative to Azygous, not so cold), it was 26 this am, and snowed part of the day. I didn't want them to not have any feed so let them have some crumbles late in the afternoon so they would have some energy to keep warm. Don't know if that is the right thing to do, but I wanted them to have feed to eat for the night as we are supposed to get down to 25. I keep the ff in the house so it is not cold, but not really warm either. Maybe I will start a new batch, maybe something is off in the mix for them. It's about 85% crumbles, 15% scratch, plus barley and boss. Did give them some kale, chard, cut up yellow squash, tomatoes and a bit of left over cornbread. (not a bunch of this mind you, I wanted them to eat the ff). Hopefully they will eat some tomorrow. Because they have tapered off on it I have put ACV in their water also. They seem healthy and happy, my BO started laying a few days ago

and my hold out EE has started kinda squatting so she should be getting close to laying, so they are doing well, just not terribly interested in the ff.

 

[LindaB220]

I read somewhere that they need corn to give them heat in the evening. Maybe throw some down in the late afternoon and they will appreciate the ff in the morning Just a thought ....

 

[niqueie]

I'm so sorry niqueie. I have a Dottie in my flock too. I replaced my last empty nester Chihuahua with chickens after we lost her. I feel your pain. It is never easy to lose an animal, no matter the species.

Thank you everyone! I appreciate your thoughts. Luckily, we still have many birds. We will be more vigilant with watching out for aggressive birds. I have no problem taking an aggressive bird out of the flock, if I figure out it's just one of them. Thanks for your help.

 

[Beekissed]

They don't need corn to stay warm in the winter. I know that's a story that is often told on these forums but it's simply not true...I've seen no evidence of this in all my years and I've read no studies done to that effect either. Most formulated feeds have corn as the primary grain used, so the addition of even more corn isn't going to stoke the "fire" inside the bird like one would a wood stove. No more than it makes us hotter when we eat corn on the cob, so I wouldn't put much stock in the whole corn keeping them warm in the winter thingy no more than I would avoid feeding corn in the summer to avoid over heating the birds.

 

[ChickenCanoe]

I agree that corn shouldn't supplant a large portion of the feed since it is low in protein and other nutrients. Corn should only be fed in small amounts and not in place of a specially formulated feed which have all the necessary nutrients needed for healthy birds and good quality eggs.
However, chickens need the high energy content to keep warm in the worst of the winter weather, since their body reserves are quickly used up, particularly on cold winter nights. Increasing the birds calorie intake and thus provide them with more energy to keep themselves warm. Winter temps will increase feed consumption because of the hens’ increased need for energy to maintain body temperature. This is also due to the shorter days so the birds spend much less of their day eating and are idle on a cold roost.
Corn, milo, barley and wheat all have high carbohydrates to fiber ratios so do aide in providing the energy needed in cold weather.

Studies

From Utah State University "A chicken will stop eating once a certain quantity of energy has been consumed in a day. This will happen even if the bird has not ingested enough protein or vitamins. Therefore, the energy concentration needs to be in balance with the other nutrients in the diet."
http://extension.usu.edu/files/publications/publication/ag_poultry_2008-02pr.pdf

Church et al. (1989) determined the combustible energy, gross energy, utilization efficiency, assimilated energy, and metabolizable energy from seeds ...(based on studies of the consumption of Prairie Chickens in Minnesota during December, January and February)... rank them as follows.
~~Excellent -- millet, soybeans Good -- sunflowers, lespedeza Fair -- wheat, corn, sorghum (the soybeans were probably selected for the protein in the absence of insects)
http://www.npwrc.usgs.gov/resource//birds/sheyenne/winter.htm

http://www.wvu.edu/~agexten/poultry/pfs17.pdf

http://www.ag.ndsu.edu/pubs/ansci/beef/as1238.pdf

http://www.agriculture.com/livestock/poultry/feed/feeding-freerge-chickens-in-winter_292-ar28128

 

[Katt66]

I've been feeding my guys fermented feed for a while now. A mix of 1/3 crumbles, 1/3 BOSS, and 1/3 cracked corn mixed in a galvanized steel can. And as the weather is getting colder I have definitely noticed they are eating a good bit more. Like double what they had been eating. Throughout the summer I'd fill the bowl in the morning and in the evening there might be a bit left over. The past few days though I've been filling it in the morning and again after lunchtime. They've also got a hanging feeder of dry feed all the time. Seems like everybody's fat and happy and my Leghorn and the 2 Sebrights are giving me about a dozen eggs a week between the three of them so I guess I'm doing it right. I dunno.

I did run out finally after three months and refilled the can with just crumbles for the time being. We shall see how they do without the BOSS and cracked corn added in. I'm thinking it wasn't doing much anyway but giving them something to play with. What are everybody's thoughts? What exactly do you ferment?

 

[Beekissed]

I agree that corn shouldn't supplant a large portion of the feed since it is low in protein and other nutrients. Corn should only be fed in small amounts and not in place of a specially formulated feed which have all the necessary nutrients needed for healthy birds and good quality eggs.
However, chickens need the high energy content to keep warm in the worst of the winter weather, since their body reserves are quickly used up, particularly on cold winter nights. Increasing the birds calorie intake and thus provide them with more energy to keep themselves warm. Winter temps will increase feed consumption because of the hens’ increased need for energy to maintain body temperature. This is also due to the shorter days so the birds spend much less of their day eating and are idle on a cold roost.
Corn, milo, barley and wheat all have high carbohydrates to fiber ratios so do aide in providing the energy needed in cold weather.

Studies

From Utah State University "A chicken will stop eating once a certain quantity of energy has been consumed in a day. This will happen even if the bird has not ingested enough protein or vitamins. Therefore, the energy concentration needs to be in balance with the other nutrients in the diet."
http://extension.usu.edu/files/publications/publication/ag_poultry_2008-02pr.pdf

Church et al. (1989) determined the combustible energy, gross energy, utilization efficiency, assimilated energy, and metabolizable energy from seeds ...(based on studies of the consumption of Prairie Chickens in Minnesota during December, January and February)... rank them as follows.
~~Excellent -- millet, soybeans Good -- sunflowers, lespedeza Fair -- wheat, corn, sorghum (the soybeans were probably selected for the protein in the absence of insects)
http://www.npwrc.usgs.gov/resource//birds/sheyenne/winter.htm

http://www.wvu.edu/~agexten/poultry/pfs17.pdf

http://www.ag.ndsu.edu/pubs/ansci/beef/as1238.pdf

http://www.agriculture.com/livestock/poultry/feed/feeding-freerge-chickens-in-winter_292-ar28128

So...what you are saying is that corn has only a fair rating for producing this supposed energy and one should increase soy or millet instead? Then why aren't people lauding those sources of energy instead of always touting that giving corn for the winter will keep the chickens warm? Since most formulated poultry feed has a correct balance of protein, starch, and fiber for birds that lay all winter long in commercial egg batteries, would it be safe to assume that the regular bag of feed one feeds to layers would have the required amount of carbs to produce this heat source?

I'm thinking it does.

 

[Beekissed]

I've been feeding my guys fermented feed for a while now. A mix of 1/3 crumbles, 1/3 BOSS, and 1/3 cracked corn mixed in a galvanized steel can. And as the weather is getting colder I have definitely noticed they are eating a good bit more. Like double what they had been eating. Throughout the summer I'd fill the bowl in the morning and in the evening there might be a bit left over. The past few days though I've been filling it in the morning and again after lunchtime. They've also got a hanging feeder of dry feed all the time. Seems like everybody's fat and happy and my Leghorn and the 2 Sebrights are giving me about a dozen eggs a week between the three of them so I guess I'm doing it right. I dunno.

I did run out finally after three months and refilled the can with just crumbles for the time being. We shall see how they do without the BOSS and cracked corn added in. I'm thinking it wasn't doing much anyway but giving them something to play with. What are everybody's thoughts? What exactly do you ferment?

I ferment a mix of layer mash, barley and BOSS. My feed consumption goes up in the winter because my birds are not foraging on free range any longer and are more dependent upon grain based feeds for nutrition. I cut rations of layer mash in the winter due to low production and replace a large portion of it with barley, a cheaper grain, and some BOSS to add some fats...I've done that method for some years now, even when feeding dry. I don't offer free choice but only give one meal per day.

 

[ChickenCanoe]

So...what you are saying is that corn has only a fair rating for producing this supposed energy and one should increase soy or millet instead? Then why aren't people lauding those sources of energy instead of always touting that giving corn for the winter will keep the chickens warm? Since most formulated poultry feed has a correct balance of protein, starch, and fiber for birds that lay all winter long in commercial egg batteries, would it be safe to assume that the regular bag of feed one feeds to layers would have the required amount of carbs to produce this heat source?

I'm thinking it does.

No I'm not saying that. The soy in the study was obviously consumed to supplant the need for protein in the absence of insects.
It isn't a supposed energy source. Any poultry nutritionist understands the carbohydrate content of corn and it's ability to produce heat during digestion.
Commercial egg batteries aren't in houses that are -10 degrees Fahrenheit like some backyard flocks. They are in controlled environments so the layer ration is good year round.