getting desperate - externa parasites - nothing works

[BennieAnTheJets]

if you know something that may help, please chime in!

our birds are kicking and scratching and shaking their tails and heads as if they were constantly bitten by something very irritating when they roost at night, even though I think I have seen them do some of this while on free range, too

it is definitely not normal cleaning and shaking - I know these birds - feel terrible when walking by the coop at night to hear them all kicking and stomping in discomfort in there

What I have done so far:

1) strip coop and apply DE to coop, birds, dust bathing areas outside

2) treated with ivermectin pour on - once, then repeated after 10 days

3) got Elector PSP and stripped coop and sprayed everything including the ceiling, and the birds

I thought it got a little better after the ivermectin, but not much

Their feathers are starting to look moth eaten and they are too thin

please help if you can

I do want to relieve this stress of parasites on them ASAP, but I don't want liver damage from too much treatment - what would you do???

Thanks! Bennie

 

[Clucking_Crazy]

Oh no, your poor chickens!

I'm brand new at this, but hopefully you get some good advice soon! Hang in there!

 

[chickengirl778]

I've heard good things about Elector PSP, I'm surprised it didn't work!
Perhaps another application?

 

[SurferchickinSB]

if you know something that may help, please chime in!

our birds are kicking and scratching and shaking their tails and heads as if they were constantly bitten by something very irritating when they roost at night, even though I think I have seen them do some of this while on free range, too

it is definitely not normal cleaning and shaking - I know these birds - feel terrible when walking by the coop at night to hear them all kicking and stomping in discomfort in there

What I have done so far:

1) strip coop and apply DE to coop, birds, dust bathing areas outside

2) treated with ivermectin pour on - once, then repeated after 10 days

3) got Elector PSP and stripped coop and sprayed everything including the ceiling, and the birds

I thought it got a little better after the ivermectin, but not much

Their feathers are starting to look moth eaten and they are too thin

please help if you can

I do want to relieve this stress of parasites on them ASAP, but I don't want liver damage from too much treatment - what would you do???

Thanks! Bennie

Oh, sad, the elector psp didn’t work?

 

[Folly's place]

So, what parasite are you treating? Mites and lice are big enough to see on the birds, especially at night, with a flashlight. If there's nothing to be found, maybe it's gnats or some small biting flies during the day, so can't be managed by treating for parasites right on the birds.
De is ineffective, not worth the effort.
Ivermectin kills many internal and external parasites, if given to each bird at the correct dose. It's off limits for poultry, though, so really shouldn't be used at all, much less when there's not an obvious reason for using it and nothing else.
Spinosad works fine for mites and lice.
Free ranging birds do get re-exposed to mites or lice often, so reinfections happen, and need to be managed all over again. But, only when a parasite is found!
Make sure that their diet is good, and that there's plenty of fresh water available, especially during this miserable hot weather. I've had to treat for mites this spring three times so far! I use permethrin spray, which works very well. But those wild birds are re-infecting my flock. We've also had bunches of little gnats, biting the birds, and me, out there in the coop. Not nice!
Mary

 

[SavKel&RynKel]

How big are the birds? And How much ivermectin have you treated with?

 

[BennieAnTheJets]

Thank you so much for all your posts!

To answer some questions: we had feather mites in 2014 and they are the devil to get rid of. Did go to a vet and they worked with me to get the right dose for off-label use on the birds (they are all Guinea Fowl, by the way ). I even have a carrier and a scale that I use to get a weight on each bird, but have given up on that as the dose difference is so small it is almost not worth it to tune it to each individual bird.

This book has excellent dosing information on many chemicals, if you would like to have a good reference source:
https://www.amazon.com/Exotic-Anima...34656&sr=8-1&keywords=exotic+animal+formulary
I have the fourth edition and have used it many times to confirm that stuff is probably safe for my birds. This is what the vet used, too.

Our birds are about 1.5 to 2.5 lb and they are adults. The dose depends on the concentration of your product - everyone needs to calculate it based on dose recommendation for their problem and the concentration of the chemical in the product they buy.

I used ivomec (ivermectin) pour-on for cattle and it turned out to be about 0.11 cc per bird or about 5 drops for the brand of ivermectin I bought - this was for a 0.2 mg/kg of body weight dose and a 5 mg/mL concentration of the product - note that the formulary (book) says PO, SC, or IM (orally, subcutaneously, or intermuscularly) so this is just a guess for pour-on products but it was the best guess I could come up with (and the vet, too) - please do your own math or let a vet help you! Overtreating is toxic to our birds and undertreating creates resistant bugs. Not good.

The ivermectin, I was told, kills everything inside and out, except gapeworm and maybe one other worm I forgot - so it was the only thing that reached the feather mites that live inside the quill. I had to do three applications (10 days apart each) back then. Maybe I should try that again, but I am afraid of poisoning them. Had one liver damage report on a necropsy already and it may have been from the drugs/poisons.

I don't see any critters on the birds or the roosting bars, even with tape capture and a microscope. Very frustrating as I agree it would be best to find out what it is **before** treating and then only treat with what actually works.

Yeah - the Elector PSP was promising - I even had a nice conversation with the company vet who answered all my questions on the phone - but it seems to have little effect on our problem - I am puzzled, too.

I dump the water out every day and give fresh and they have Kalmbach organic layer pellets and free ranging (grasses and bugs). It could be that there are grain mites in the feed - had them before - I will check under the microscope again tomorrow. I know they don't bite the birds, but they may tickle. And we may have feather mites on top of that to make them look bad.

We did have an outbreak of tiny flies (not gnats, I think, as they are chubbier than our thin little flies) but they never bit me and are gone after the Elector PSP application, I think.

 

[BennieAnTheJets]

Folly's place,

do you use the permethrin on the birds or on the coop? Please let me know.

I have two pyrethrins products that I never used because I think they are neurotoxins and I am still not sure about toxicity for the birds, me, and our environment. A vet recommended that for a previous problem but it was not one of my trusted vets. I bought it and then used something else.

Have you ever used pyrethrins?

Thanks, Bennie

 

[17 chickens]

I have had a battle with the mites this year as we had a very wet winter. I was out of my mind trying to battle them, I dusted and dusted the coop, birds and runs. I scrubbed and cleaned everything, brought in new sand for runs still had them..... yuck! Then I got out the bleach and soap and was going in for the battle, With pressure washer in hand this was war!
I removed everything from coop, Squirted Dawn dish soap over everything and started the power washer. I knew soap would stick to them and smother them so I was that crazy chicken lady soak and wet battling bugs!Every thing got a good washing then I hooked up my attachment to the washer and started the bleach spraying. I hit every little spot you could imagine!
I did this for 3 weeks straight and now the bugs are gone!
I went so far as to spray soapy water on the run to make sure they didn't come back! Hope this helps

 

[BennieAnTheJets]

wow, 17 chickens, that is dedication!
your flock is lucky to have you look out for them!

what did you use to dust? did it work at all?

I don't have a power washer but the dawn dish soap sounds good - I could use a bucket and a sponge