Hatchery/farm store vs breeder

[21hens-incharge]

WOW! That video was an eye-opener. I know Easter Eggers are mutts with no SOP. But (uhoh I know I'll ruffle some feathers here especially since the name of the hatchery was shown) those LOOKED like mutts. My EEs came from a farm store (local, not TSC). I Don't know who their hatchery is but in spite of the fact that I said one of my birds was homely.....the homely one is a beauty queen compared to those. Shocked. Thank you for the video. Third pic looks like a clone of her. So only one pic
Last picture is the one I say is homely.View attachment 1899347 View attachment 1899348 View attachment 1899352 View attachment 1899354 View attachment 1899355

I like her unique dark "hair".
All your birds are pretty.

 

[Xerocles]

I kinda think the one you're calling homely is cool looking

Well Chrissy. If the neck feathers ( yes I'm a newbie, what are those neck feathers called?) Were all black and all the way around, she'd be more attractive. But yeah, she's still not Coyote Ugly (can you say Coyote Ugly abouy a chicken?)

 

[Egghead_Jr]

My birds are all from a hatchery. Yet BYC printed my photo of 3 of them in their calendar so I'd argue with the idea that hatchery birds are not attractive. If I sell chicks from them, tho, I do not call myself a breeder, I'd tell people they are hatchery stock. But I wonder if others would do the same. I would expect a good breeder to be showing their birds and have winning lines.

It's that kind of thinking that's perpetuated- standard bred birds are expensive or unobtainable or only for bringing to shows. I keep attempting to say quality birds are not all show quality. Standard bred is just that, a line of birds that is bred towards the standard of that breed. There are many breeders that don't show birds at all. The lack of being a winning line does not take away the quality of the birds. 1 in 1000 standard bred birds are show quality. A line of bird can not be called show quality nor does a breeder who does not show automatically not have show quality birds. The term show quality, to me, means ability to compete at a regional level of competition and up. It's a rare bird that conforms that closely to the standard of perfection and is not duplicated by simply hatching it's eggs.

I'll go on to say the meat forum here is full of people attempting to breed a sustainable meat bird. They are putting in much effort but are flawed by starting with hatchery stock. Sub sized, thin in width birds are used and worked hard over generations with fair gain but they should have started with breeder stock. There are many advantages in their use beyond beauty. Longevity and temper are but two more.
I've never heard of a breeder stock cockerel flocking a human.

It's a shame people are put off by breeder stock due to the misconception they are only for people that want to show. They are so much more.

 

[mrskenmore]

What an interesting thread!

I have kept chickens for 5 plus years. Purchasing from a feed store and middle man which I later recognized was hatchery stock. After receiving a he when I paid for a she and losing a sex link to a genetic egg laying disorder in year two I did a copious amount of research for where I was to get my third additions to the flock. I even drove 12 hours to go to the Ohio National Poultry show. I think many people have contributed to this thread eloquently. Here are my two cents.. There are breeders and there are SOP breeders. Many people purchase hatchery stock from well... hatcheries and reproduce their chickens. They need to be upfront and is not always the case. How do you know what you are buying? SOP breeders you typically know what you are getting as they have a lot to lose if their reputation is tarnished. Not all SOP breeders are the same, some cull.. some keep them for other farm chores and some sell off the less than perfect stock. One thing to note when working with SOP breeders is that in my opinion they are doing it to keep the genetic line alive. They may not sell to you if you won’t breed fearing the end of the line so to speak. They often have high minimums, shipping restrictions and want to sell you pairs or trios- which is fine only if your town allows you to have a male. I was not that fortunate and though I desperately wanted a healthy heritage bird and support poultry lineage, my backyard chicken hobby confinements did not lead me down that path. So what was I to do? I researched for 8 month who was the best hatchery as not all hatcheries are created equal. I picked hatchery over middleman to eliminate any unforeseen health issues that could arise from the chicks not being kept in the cleanest environment. In the end I went with 4 pullets from Meyer Hatchery. (tied with Cackle but Meyer was closer, had more breed selection and assured me they dont throw in filler roos for warmth) I was very pleased with the experience. All four made the journey safe and sound and were happy to see me upon arrival. I lost my buff orp on day 2 for failure to thrive. This typically is a step you get to avoid by going to the middleman. I really wanted 4 and was devastated I lost my only buff so I drove to my middleman I used in the past and he gave me a single buff chick same age to supplement the flock. After that all was good- I have 4 sixteen week pullets that are healthy and happy and friendly....and ready to lay soon! Do I wish things were different? sure- but am I happy with my hatchery pets? yes. Will I try again for heritage breeds in the future should my flock be able to expand beyond my current 7? heck YEAH! I am enclosing a pic of my hatchery partridge rock pullet Olivia Jade who couldn’t be sweeter as well as an interesting article from the chicken chick comparing places to buy chicks/chickens. Best of luck to you @Xerocles to your flock- I keep easter eggers too and enjoy them very much! Yours are beautiful! Oh and if we could create a breeder list for breeders that would sell their heritage or less than perfect heritage (I am interested in healthy birds and friendly docile ones) that would be amazing!

hope my two cents helped!

https://the-chicken-chick.com/buying-chickens-to-start-laying-flock/

 

[Egghead_Jr]

https://www.backyardchickens.com/th...anada-uk-and-usa-new-n-p-i-p-breeders.246596/

https://www.backyardchickens.com/threads/byc-breeders-directory.1129376/

Both of these breeders directories were a work in progress. Not sure if the second one is still updated and is ofcourse not a complete list of breeders here at BYC.

 

[cmom]

I have nothing against hatchery birds. I have had some in the past. I just love my birds so much and work with them because even if I didn't show them I just love them. I do get enjoyment when they place well at a show and not all judges will see the same bird the same way. It give me pride that I'm doing my best and if I can give someone else a start that also gives me good feelings. I have had some young people buy some birds and show them and do very well. Here is one of my RIR's a young girl showed.

Many years ago I also raised Buff Orpingtons.

 

[333113]

Thank you for the links. I had lost track of them!

Anyone looking for the current NPIP list can find it on the NPIP website here:
http://www.poultryimprovement.org/
Select the "NPIP Participants by State" link in the green box at the upper right, then scroll down to the bottom of the page to select the state from the map. (A bit clunky, in my opinion.) Each state downloads as a PDF. You will find me in the Missouri PDF.
The chickens are listed by their NPIP designator, so you will also need the stock code "decoder" key, listed on the main page, which thankfully comes sorted alphabetically by breed name and numerically by code.

This is updated pretty often. You will notice all the hatcheries and big meat/egg producers are also listed. The AI test status is also listed.

https://www.backyardchickens.com/th...anada-uk-and-usa-new-n-p-i-p-breeders.246596/

https://www.backyardchickens.com/threads/byc-breeders-directory.1129376/

Both of these breeders directories were a work in progress. Not sure if the second one is still updated and is ofcourse not a complete list of breeders here at BYC.

 

[333113]

The suggestion that breeders should prorate their prices based on the show quality of their stock is very practical. Dave Holderread does that for their stock:
https://holderreadfarm.com/adult_birds_price_list_page/adult_birds_price_list.htm
I shamelessly borrowed that pricing for my birds. I know that not everyone wants to show. In my opinion, the prices for good type birds with the sort of features that would get them disqualified or downgraded in a show, like a sprigged comb, double spurs, or a feather with the wrong color, should be comparable to the average hatchery bird. We should be sharing heritage chickens, not culling them.

What an interesting thread!

I have kept chickens for 5 plus years. Purchasing from a feed store and middle man which I later recognized was hatchery stock. After receiving a he when I paid for a she and losing a sex link to a genetic egg laying disorder in year two I did a copious amount of research for where I was to get my third additions to the flock. I even drove 12 hours to go to the Ohio National Poultry show. I think many people have contributed to this thread eloquently. Here are my two cents.. There are breeders and there are SOP breeders. Many people purchase hatchery stock from well... hatcheries and reproduce their chickens. They need to be upfront and is not always the case. How do you know what you are buying? SOP breeders you typically know what you are getting as they have a lot to lose if their reputation is tarnished. Not all SOP breeders are the same, some cull.. some keep them for other farm chores and some sell off the less than perfect stock. One thing to note when working with SOP breeders is that in my opinion they are doing it to keep the genetic line alive. They may not sell to you if you won’t breed fearing the end of the line so to speak. They often have high minimums, shipping restrictions and want to sell you pairs or trios- which is fine only if your town allows you to have a male. I was not that fortunate and though I desperately wanted a healthy heritage bird and support poultry lineage, my backyard chicken hobby confinements did not lead me down that path. So what was I to do? I researched for 8 month who was the best hatchery as not all hatcheries are created equal. I picked hatchery over middleman to eliminate any unforeseen health issues that could arise from the chicks not being kept in the cleanest environment. In the end I went with 4 pullets from Meyer Hatchery. (tied with Cackle but Meyer was closer, had more breed selection and assured me they dont throw in filler roos for warmth) I was very pleased with the experience. All four made the journey safe and sound and were happy to see me upon arrival. I lost my buff orp on day 2 for failure to thrive. This typically is a step you get to avoid by going to the middleman. I really wanted 4 and was devastated I lost my only buff so I drove to my middleman I used in the past and he gave me a single buff chick same age to supplement the flock. After that all was good- I have 4 sixteen week pullets that are healthy and happy and friendly....and ready to lay soon! Do I wish things were different? sure- but am I happy with my hatchery pets? yes. Will I try again for heritage breeds in the future should my flock be able to expand beyond my current 7? heck YEAH! I am enclosing a pic of my hatchery partridge rock pullet Olivia Jade who couldn’t be sweeter as well as an interesting article from the chicken chick comparing places to buy chicks/chickens. Best of luck to you @Xerocles to your flock- I keep easter eggers too and enjoy them very much! Yours are beautiful! Oh and if we could create a breeder list for breeders that would sell their heritage or less than perfect heritage (I am interested in healthy birds and friendly docile ones) that would be amazing!

hope my two cents helped!

https://the-chicken-chick.com/buying-chickens-to-start-laying-flock/

View attachment 1899446

 

[cmom]

My birds are all from a hatchery. Yet BYC printed my photo of 3 of them in their calendar so I'd argue with the idea that hatchery birds are not attractive. If I sell chicks from them, tho, I do not call myself a breeder, I'd tell people they are hatchery stock. But I wonder if others would do the same. I would expect a good breeder to be showing their birds and have winning lines.

There are absolutely some beautiful hatchery birds...
If it were that easy to always win, but most of my birds have placed well. I have had some duds too.

 

[cmom]

Thank you for the links. I had lost track of them!

Anyone looking for the current NPIP list can find it on the NPIP website here:
http://www.poultryimprovement.org/
Select the "NPIP Participants by State" link in the green box at the upper right, then scroll down to the bottom of the page to select the state from the map. (A bit clunky, in my opinion.) Each state downloads as a PDF. You will find me in the Missouri PDF.
The chickens are listed by their NPIP designator, so you will also need the stock code "decoder" key, listed on the main page, which thankfully comes sorted alphabetically by breed name and numerically by code.

This is updated pretty often. You will notice all the hatcheries and big meat/egg producers are also listed. The AI test status is also listed.

I'm in Florida under Independent Flocks under Hilltop Farm.