HERE is where we are going to talk about a sustainable meat bird flock

[CARS]

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You're right. Trying to avoid anything but the casual "I have had them". Don't even really want to know what they have to say about them. It's been said before too many times.

UNLESS, Jeff wants to get into his breeding program with them again. That is fine because it is not the norm.

 

[TimG]

Quote:
I have some personal experience in this area, but I could not post without also including some hearsay...

 

[lildinkem]

A good breeding program with most LF will leave the breeder but no choice to cull out what he/she do not need. that means meat. NOT gobbs of meat but something to eat. I choose Orps for the dual purpose aspect. Still knowing it is cheaper to go to the store and buy some frozen chicken. But at least I know what i am eating. No steriods, hormones, nothing but good ole bugs and grasses at least till winter hits, and then it is ofcourse just layena and chick starter with a little flock raiser thrown in there. Still better then store bought.

 

[sandspoultry]

To start with we raise

Buff Orpington
Dark Cornish
RIR
Speckled Sussex
Cuckoo Marans
Ameraucana
Black Copper Marans
Mottled Java
Chickens

Best egg layers - Buff Orpington and Cuckoo's in that order
Best tasting bird - Cuckoo Marans hands down
Most meat per bird - Dark Cornish
Biggest leg/thighs - Buff Orpington
Largest breast in size - RIR and Java

The others are mainly for egg sales and the culls go to the freezer

Turkeys

Bourbon Red
Royal Palm
Midget White
Beltsville White
White Holland
Standard Bronze

Biggest bird - Bronze followed by the White Holland
Best tasting -Midget White followed by the Bourbon
Best layer- Beltsville

Somebody made a comment before that a turkey is to big for a meal. Our kids are all off on their own so it's just me and my husband and we eat turkey all the time. We skin the bird and cut it up into 2 boneless skinless breast fillets, thighs and legs and wings. that's pretty much all the meat there is.

Ducks

Muscovy - they lay well, sit and hatch lots of ducklings, pretty much take care of themselves - what more can you ask for? once again we skin them and cut them up. Breast and the legs thighs are used to make duck sausage.

We have quail and pheasant - we sell very few because of the game bird laws in NC but we eat alot of them - very tasty

Buffalo quail anybody?

Sustainable yes, could we make living on them no. Do any of the meat bird raisers here make a living off the meat birds? Most years we at least break even and often make a few $. What makes the money? egg sales and the sale of chicks, ducklings, poults etc. The culls feed us very well and give a good variety. With proper breeding we would never have to buy any replacements in our lifetime. There is no right and wrong. on the other thread that got locked the one person raises a batch and then is done for the year - that has merits if that is your goal. I like poultry, we like breeding them, we spend hours just watching them. If we can improve them and save a rare breed, break even and fill the freezer that is my goal.

Sharon

 

[PaulaJoAnne]

Quote:
I have some personal experience in this area, but I could not post without also including some hearsay...

PM me please.

 

[CTChickenMom]

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When we made a commitment to avoid factory farmed meat at all costs, it made for more creative and extended use of our animals.

I would like to do this too. I'm so fed up with these mass produced products. With a huge turkey, I imagine that needs to be halved or quartered for freezing. Oh, and what size freezer would I need for 25 chickens and a half dozen turkeys?

 

[kassy68]

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Don't bonk... Im reading this and taking anything that sounds like a plan and putting it into my files.. (brain files) I ordered my first meat birds last spring , cornish cross'... I am doing it again this spring. I had NO problems with the breed after the first week.. lost a few from shipping. I took my in for butchering at 7.2 weeks and they averaged 5 lbs a bird... vitamins in the water for the first week and 24% feed as the hatchery suggested. I do want to try a few ranger birds this year as well.. My only problem is my outter muscle on the breast are more like turkey/stringy almost dry... otherwise they are perfect. I am not a big meat fan, so i am afraid to try the dual purpose breeds becuz I think they will get to stong in the chicken flavor..

This is good people keep it going.. Im curious on the jg's and brs...

Oh.. and let me add ,, Im limited on space also so I like the 7/8 week mark , in and out they are... 2-4 weeks in the garage and then down to the storage side of my coop...

 

[Brunty_Farms]

I'm simply sorting facts form opinions. No defense.... just looking out for the next guy. I will leave the pros and cons to the customers that eat them.... Everyone knows where you and I stand... been there done that no need to do it again.

Currently I'm attempting to breed hybrid hens over a buckeye rooster. I think if you want to be successful in your breeding program you need to get good quality birds. It really depends on your needs. For me... I think it's pointless (my opinion) to raise or attempt to raise anything but the best when it comes to meat qualities. If you want to get anywhere you have to step outside the box... for instance start with genetics that already have what you want. For me, I like white meat so a wide and long breasted bird is my kinda bird. From a selling standpoint... 90% of customers want the breast meat so it only makes sense for me. If your really wanting to take it to the next level and make it worth your while... get some freedom rangers or a couple of hybrid cornish and incorporate them in your breeding program. You will be light years ahead of the person trying to cross 4 types of DP breeds together. Sure you will get good results with 4 different breeds but it's going to take 4-6 years MINIMUM before you get somewhat decent results. What most of you are trying to do.... people have already done it. Especially with the colored broilers.

Best qualities are priority. FCR's are huge... don't forget about foraging ability.... find a good DP that fits your surroundings.

Things you need to strive for first...

1) Body type (cornish of any kind are a great start) However the hybrids are the best start. They may not be your thing, but their offspring that they produce when crossed with a standard DP will be very close to what most are looking for.

2) Meat to bone ratio.... again... hybrids are best. You can't find a better start on meat to bone ratio.

3) Pick breeds that suit your taste... For example I like breast meat... I wouldn't choose Giants or Brahmas if I was looking for a lot of breast meat. Stick to the Standard Cornish, Buckeye, and even good Delawares if your looking for breast meat. (if your using hatchery stock... you can forget it.... )

After you get these three traits then you can shoot for these...

1) Personality
2) Foraging Ability
3) color

Forget about disease resistance... by using two and sometimes three crosses... these birds will be healthier and more disease resistant compared to any pure breed that your used to. Too many pure breed lines have been so far inbred that their immunity is just horrible.


Have fun... if you don't have fun... your going to give up before the second or third generation. It takes time... it takes money... and it takes chicken smarts... If you truly want a meat bird, incorporate some kind of hybrid into your program. If you don't your going to have nothing more than a bunch of mutts. UNLESS you get your hands on some awesome stock.... either it be buckeyes or standard cornish... it's very hard to do but it is possible.


Here is a pic of the foundation stock that we have going... Look at the body structure of the buckeye rooster (he is still young in this pic) Not many buckeye lines have block builds to them. Most have the standard DP look to them. This is a result of about 7 years of breeding for a broiler body type.

 

[cubalaya]

crossing dark cornish with rocks, ri reds, and jersey giants would make for a good meat bird but not as good a layer in my opinion. crossing cubalaya (which lay good and have prime white meat) with rocks, ri reds, and jersey giants would make a good sustainable flock of egg layers that taste great and have large breasts, although they would grow slow about 20 weeks to butcher. let me see how these turn out, got the incubator full of them.

 

[Brunty_Farms]

Do any of the meat bird raisers here make a living off the meat birds?

Yes, I haven't worked since November last year. There isn't much business roofing in the winter time... and I told myself if the chickens supported me through the winter than yes... I would quit. It proved me wrong... I did great this winter so I'm looking at wrapping up real work this spring... gotta give my boss enough time for a replacement.

For chicken... biggest sales are broiler chickens followed by egg sales. We just added ducks ( can't wait to get my muscovies) I have every breed practically but them. I would like to use the eggs and meat for the ducks.... Getting lambs in May (Katahdins) from a guy in Iowa.... Already have pigs, cross between Hampshire and duroc... Beef will be sometime this summer...

Biggest on farm sales would be the turkey's hands down....

If you want to make a living start with the commercial breeds first. You can always add heritage and have both.... but over the years I've learned that the commercial breeds makes the most money. I'm marketing the heritage breeds for the first time this year so we will see what kind of transition I get from my customers... some only want heritage... others don't want to pay the money for them.

If your not getting at least $5-6 / pound for heritage chickens and $7.00 / pound for heritage turkey's your going to end up just breaking even or losing money. The amount of time and effort is also huge with heritage... especially if your maintaing breeder flocks. Which is why... a higher price is mandatory in order to make a living.

Sustainability (this fits into the title to this thread) is defined by who is raising the flock and what they are raising them for. A smaller farmer producing chickens for themselves can be sustainable with DP breeds. However a business can only be sustainable if it's making money... and hybrids make you money.

Buster... before you chime in.... even NH farm uses hybrids.... those Poulet Rouge whatever chickens are hybrids. They are a cross between two lines of chickens developed by Hubbard... Even if they decide to breed their own from these hybrids... they still are using hybrid blood to start their own meat line.​