Hormonal caponizing?

[NatJ]

Yes, I understand that but at 3 months of age, most roosters (at least afaIk) are not yet crowing & mounting.
I am actually currently talking to a vet that is willing to caponize a rooster for me but in order to not blotch the surgery, the testes need to be developed further so they are more easily identifiable/removable. I should also mention that I am talking about a bantam breed in my case...

I have had bantams that were crowing and mounting by that age. I've had some do it by 8 weeks (not quite 2 months).

As a general rule of thumb, small chickens mature sooner than big chickens. So bantams often reach sexual maturity sooner than larger chickens. Of course there are exceptions, so I cannot be sure when YOUR cockerel will start doing these things. But I would not count on him waiting 3+ months.

 

[romea]

I have had bantams that were crowing and mounting by that age. I've had some do it by 8 weeks (not quite 2 months).

As a general rule of thumb, small chickens mature sooner than big chickens. So bantams often reach sexual maturity sooner than larger chickens. Of course there are exceptions, so I cannot be sure when YOUR cockerel will start doing these things. But I would not count on him waiting 3+ months.

Thank you for sharing this! You are confirming my suspicion that bantams mature earlier. Thankfully the vet I am talking to also came to the realization that the castration/caponization has to happen a whole lot earlier... So we are trying to get this done within the 6-8 weeks timeframe that aart mentioned...

 

[romea]

The thing is, because the testosterone has been present all along, the mischief is done. That is how it is in other farm animals.

From what I have read on here is that many still crow if you do it too late, and many still have aggression if they were before. Just a warning that it might not work.

Do come back here and report. Few people do it, originally it was done to keep the meat more tender, not about crowing.

Yes, I understand that the original intention was (mostly) for culinary reasons... The part that I find interesting is that, apparently, some capons develop 'motherly' (fatherly?) instincts, meaning: becoming not just tolerant of chicks but even protective, taking on their nurturing/raising.

I am in communication with a vet who is thankfully very responsive and open to venturing into unknown territory. (This surgery is not within the normal scope of even an "exotic(s)"/avian vet.)
It is considered an "invasive" surgery - which can mean as little as having to reach into the abdominal cavity, thus operating inside the body. While a spay is technically also "invasive" surgery, my understanding is that the avian testicles are very close to the kidneys etc., making this not an 'easy' operation.
With that said, after having done some research, she understands that the window is between 6-8 weeks and 'we' are trying to make that work. I will know more soon and keep you updated (if you are still interested).

 

[NaperLix]

It works.Not surgery,too dangerous.other choices.
No crowing,no chasing,no male behavior. Just a happy bachelor and his one friend he’s in love with,but never bothers.Except put his beak under her feathers to sleep at night.
Can stay in a happy home .
You have to be proactive by yourself.
Research is scarce. It’s there.

 

[NatJ]

I will know more soon and keep you updated (if you are still interested).

What ended up happening?

 

[romea]

What ended up happening?

It might be too early for this update but here goes…
Since I had hatched 10 roosters out of 18 (bantam) eggs, I solicited the help of an exotic vet to try and castrate/caponize the males. In order to do a practice run, I provided 2 post mortem birds.

During her first surgery, she realized that a post mortem is a whole lot different than a live castration, and also that some of her instruments where simply too large.
So she ordered a new set. However, once she received the last backordered instrument, the remaining birds where already 4 months old. In the meantime, the males had received an injection of Lupron (Leuprorelin - which suppresses testosterone production for about a month and has to be repeated).

During the second surgery, the attempt to caponize the bantams was abandoned after everyone who went into surgery (again) experienced hemorrhagic shock and had to be euthanized - even after the smaller set of instruments had been used.

The remaining rooster now has an implant (Deslorelin) which basically continues the testosterone suppression for a year (+/-).
And yes, he crows - so far only in the mornings. But I also tend to intervene, swaddle him and place him in a dark environment for a short while.
He is otherwise a ‘good boy’ and allows handling without much fuss.

Since he had the implant now for just over a month, it is too early to make a judgement call but, so far, my impression is that this (hormonal) approach is a ‘mixed bag’ and will, most likely, not provide the result I had hoped it would.

 

[NaperLix]

Estrogen progestin 2-3x week ,small amounts,work well.Start 3 months.Been done in some countries.Much safer,

 

[romea]

Estrogen progestin 2-3x week ,small amounts,work well.Start 3 months.Been done in some countries.Much safer,

That is probably not going to happen. I mentioned estrogen supplementation to my vet and her reply was that this "can have serious side effects like bone-marrow suppression leading to anemia".

 

[NatJ]

It might be too early for this update but here goes…
Since I had hatched 10 roosters out of 18 (bantam) eggs, I solicited the help of an exotic vet to try and castrate/caponize the males. In order to do a practice run, I provided 2 post mortem birds.

During her first surgery, she realized that a post mortem is a whole lot different than a live castration, and also that some of her instruments where simply too large.
So she ordered a new set. However, once she received the last backordered instrument, the remaining birds where already 4 months old. In the meantime, the males had received an injection of Lupron (Leuprorelin - which suppresses testosterone production for about a month and has to be repeated).

During the second surgery, the attempt to caponize the bantams was abandoned after everyone who went into surgery (again) experienced hemorrhagic shock and had to be euthanized - even after the smaller set of instruments had been used.

The remaining rooster now has an implant (Deslorelin) which basically continues the testosterone suppression for a year (+/-).
And yes, he crows - so far only in the mornings. But I also tend to intervene, swaddle him and place him in a dark environment for a short while.
He is otherwise a ‘good boy’ and allows handling without much fuss.

Since he had the implant now for just over a month, it is too early to make a judgement call but, so far, my impression is that this (hormonal) approach is a ‘mixed bag’ and will, most likely, not provide the result I had hoped it would.

Thank you for the detailed update! Even though it's not a happy outcome for most of the cockerels at least people can learn from this, rather than having to start from scratch figuring things out.