Inbreeding

[Treegod]

I don't know how serious this is, so far I've not had any problems and not got near inbreeding as far as I know. But I think it will happen at some point.

I have three cockerels, Bamboo, Tetley and Raven. Bamboo is the father of Tetley, though Bamboo is not breeding so much now, he's kept well controlled by the other two.

One of the hens is Raven's daughter, and another is Tetley's. With the last two chicks they both have the same mother as Tetley (though both are from Raven). So potentially, as well as having a mother and daughter with him, he could also have half-sister/s.

We only have one space for all of them so can't really divide them up, and also we're attached to our cockerels and aren't considering getting rid of them and replacing them.

My plan so far has been to remove the cockerels and keep the hens that have been hatched. Replacement cockerels we'd like to buy in, but so far it looks like our cockerels are staying for a while. The advantage we do have is that they are all different breeds, and most of them aren't pure bred (only one I know is pure bred), so there's a contrast of hybrid vigour and possible inbreeding.

What problems can come from inbreeding? And is it evident in the first generation/s?

 

[Ridgerunner]

Inbreeding is not at all unusual in chickens. It is how the champion birds at the shows are developed. But you have to be aware that some things can happen whenever you breed two different chickens, whether they are related or not.

As you probably know or you would not have asked the question, chickens have a pair of each gene. They may both be the same or one may be dominant and the other recessive. The dominant ones are "expressed" and the recessives stay hidden. I think some may be co-dominant, with both expressed to some degree. Either the dominant or recessive genes may express good traits or bad traits if they are expressed. As long as the bad traits are on the recessive genes and there is a dominant gene to take charge, you will never see them. But if you breed two chickens that each have a recessive bad gene, whether they are related or not, some of the offspring will express that trait when the recessives pair up. If the recessive gens are good traits, those will also show up when the recessives pair up. Obviously, when you mate related birds, the chances of recessive genes pairing up increases.

Another thing that happens when you breed related chickens is that you lose genetic diversity. Genetic diversity allows them to thrive over a wider range of conditions. The less genetic diversity they have, the more specialized their environment has to be for them to thrive. Sort of the opposite of hybrid vigor.

Back to your question. What things do you look for when inbreeding? Generally, any traits you don't want. Some of these can be easy to spot, like physical deformities. Crossed beaks and crooked toes are two that are mentioned regularly. Bad body conformation, misshapen legs, anything you see that you don't want. Champion breeders consider too many points on the comb for some breeds to be a physical deformity. That depends on your criteria. Some harder ones to spot that can show up are poor fertility, poor egg laying, aggressiveness toward you or other chickens, susceptability to disease, reduced vigor, or certain behaviors. Any of these may show up in the first generation of breeding related chickens. If both parents they have the recessives, it can show up even if the parents are not related. A lot of the time, especially with behaviors, it is not one pair of genes but certain combinations of genes that cause the problem. The more generations you go, the more likely it is that something will show up. It is good practice to bring in some new blood every few generations to keep that genetic diversity up, but be aware you may be introducing undesirable traits to your flock when you do that. I think it is a risk that has to be taken and the benefits usually greatly outweigh the risks, but nothing we do is without risk of some sort.

In your situation, I'd suggest you do not allow any pullets that show traits you do not want to have chicks. Do not hatch their eggs. Cull the undesirable ones and keep the desirable ones. Before some people get upset, cull does not mean to kill. In this case, it means to select the ones you do not want to breed and do not hatch their eggs. How that is done is up to you.

When you do decide to bring in new blood through the roosters, you might consider getting hatching eggs from someone instead of bringing in a live rooster. If you already have roosters and bring in another grown rooster, it can get bloody. People do it successfully so it can be done, but I'd suggest raising your replacement rooster yourself. When a rooster is raised in the flock, it is usualy a lot less physical when he matures and moves into the breeding order. As you have probably seen, it can still be plenty physical but it is usually much worse if you introduce an outside rooster. And this way, you get to choose the one you want to keep out of several you have raised.

Good luck. Hope this helps.

 

[McSpin]

Inbreeding is greatly misunderstood. Inbreeding does not automatically cause inferior traits to show up. What it does, is increase homologous pairs of genes which causes recessive traits to express more readily. The animal has to contain the undesirable genes for the trait to show up. If it is not present in the line, it can not appear. If the recessive trait is in the line and is undesirable, you now have the opportunity to cull the trait from your stock, since inbreeding allowed it to appear. With the use of test crossing, you can choose breeders who do not contain the trait. Inbreeding does have a negative effect on the immune system, but only after quite awhile and once again, can be controlled with proper line-breeding.

Inbreeding becomes a problem when it's indiscriminate. Proper breeding is where you select for positive traits and know how to eliminate negative ones. Inbreeding can be a powerful tool to accomplish this.

 

[Treegod]

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Thanks for the info. Yes I did know about the genetics, and I know inbreeding doesn't necessarily mean unhealthy birds and hybrid vigour doesn't necessarily mean more healthy. My main concern was how much of a concern is it, but in general it seems

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That's the plan I have with introducing a new cockerel (and as you say it's better to integrate them at a young age). Sort of a genetic "top up". But it may be a few years that these cockerels are around, a few more generations to be bred from them. I may also need to bring in new hens at some point.

It's all about getting the right balance.

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My main concern is health problems, extreme deformity or abnormal behaviour. I'm certainly not looking for champion traits in my mix lol

Thanks again

 

[Treegod]

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Yes. That's what comes from human moralising

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Hmmm, in my flock it is difficult to avoid indiscriminate breeding, though I know what hen lays which egg (some of them) so I can select from there. Avoid too much intense inbreeding.

Thank you

 

[Treegod]

Got the first inbred chick today, it shares the same mother with its father. Looks pretty intelligent but one eye is smaller and a weird shape, and it's legs don't seem to be so strong. Most of the time it sits in one place, whereas the other chicks are more active and run around, though perhaps that's because it's still pretty young, and it did take longer than the others to hatch.

 

[D'Angelo N Va.]

You know, I am glad you asked this question and I am glad you all answered it. It has been on my mind for some time also. growing up we had chickens just running across the farm and they were all inbred....so I was getting concerned because I have my different types seperated and am breeding for pure stock.

 

[austinhart123]

i line breed my serama all the time, ofcours i pedegree breed so i know who the parents of each chicken are, but it is usually safe to inbreed as long as you outbeed every few generations, and watch to make sure you arent losing vigour

 

[Hurst]

I have inbred before and had no problems. But I did it for showing reasons. It worked out.

 

[Treegod]

Thanks for the replies. It's good to know it's not so much of an issue.