Invisble Fencing

[sourland]

I'd ask the Invisible Fence company. I have found them to be very good to work with.

 

[bagendhens]

ive seen way too many dogs just walk and run right through them...
i saw a tiny jack russel terrier on a "stubborn dog" system on almost the highest setting bolt right through the fence...

our invisible fence rep when i worked in a pet store said they work in about 50% of cases...
they have a 40% return rate and a 10% unsatisified complaint rate, only about 50% of customers find they actually work to contain thier dogs big or small.

not to menton while theyll often escape no problem due to adrenalyn providing pain relife...they then often refuse to come home after the fact because they know itll hurt.

it also doesnt keep other animals or people out, so to me the risk just isnt worth it...
i might use an invisible fence sytem as a BACK UP to a good solid physical fence if i had a determined fence jumper/climber...but id NEVER use an invisible fence as a primay containment system...

 

[FireTigeris]

Quote:
THIS

If you do get a 'boundary sensitive' dog (my greyhound is) they can get mauled or killed by a feral pack/ coyote / cougar -whatever- when they get cornered instead of running.

A hot fence with a proper apron would work much better... (but is expensive)

I have seen people double invisible fence, the stubborn one on the property line the other one 10 feet inside, so there is double reason to not leave... The internal one also had a "corral style" fence that had phosphorescent paint on it (clear at day, lime green at night) so the dog had to JUMP that one (so it knew it was doing wrong) - they used the rechargeable batteries and had two collars for each fence so that the collar came off at night and the new one that was fully charged went on in the morn (one dog). They lived in GA but moved to WA - not sure how much they took with them.

 

[Jamie_Dog_Trainer]

Quote:
Given your situation, and my experience with training dogs to Invisible Fencing I would say this isn't going to work for you. First of all, the training for the shock type fencing is extensive and you work consistently and hard for about a month, and then some. It's not a one time introduction. If you want the fence to be effective the training takes a long time and dedication. Nearly everyone I have ever seen get any sort of fencing like this either had to hire a trainer or were dog trainers themselves. Everyone else I know? Well lets just say they spent up to $3,000 with NO results because their dog wasn't properly trained on the fence line.

Lets say you get this fencing, install it properly. Are you prepared to manage your dogs activities for about a month before ever letting your dog out on his own? Thats what it takes to make this work. And with such a large area of 20 acres you are looking at a LOT of work to get your dog generalized to all parameters of the fence. And since your dog already has the habit of going visiting, it will be harder for him to adjust to not being able to roam and he's going to either learn to respect the shock or run through it. I hope this helps you. I've trained dogs on invisible type fencing for a long time.

 

[dainerra]

I'll say "what Jamie said".

Also, many dogs, esp those who are chasing prey, will run right through the fence. An even bigger downside is that if the dog DOES leave the fence (for wharever resason) they are less inclined to come back home.

A dog in drive (excitement) might not even notice the shock. But a dog that has finished his business WILL associate a shock with coming back home.
IF doesn't keep other animals out or people from harassing your dog. You will have to train your dog to every inch of the IF. This is walking the ENTIRE peremiter of the fence at least once a day and teaching the dog to stop at the warning beep.


Please don't train my co-worker! They put the collar on the dog and turned it all the way to high. They then took the dogs favorite toy and threw it across the fence. th ey still find the story hilarious.

 

[centrarchid]

Quote:
Consider me not to be a novice at training animals and that I will invest time. I work property about 4 hours each day. If need be all birds will be confined and dog taken through entire training protocol before all parties released unsupervised. We have broken dogs from visiting in past so that is not considered to be a problem. I am well versed in training of fish and birds and generally they are slower at getting picture of what I want than a dog will be. The trials of baby steps and setbacks very well appreciated. I will still ask experts of training dogs to respect invisible fences. Dog must be able to roam property or more than dog will have to be dropped from plans. No fence I can afford will exclude predators, terrestrial or aerial. Humans are my concern, not that of dogs, to avoid legal concerns. Dogs to be people friendly at all times. For short-term I can setup electric fence for redundancy as it will be used to contain sheep and goats. Dog is young and some neighbors may be helping by shooting him with BB gun (I do not like this but does appear to be keeping him away from at least one residence). Presently he does respect fence line bordering on neighbors property. I can manage vegetation and existing fence line to help define perimeter of dog's roaming area.

Term prey drive is tossed around way too much and frequently out of context. Dog chasing another predator while growling is not in prey drive; thought processes are very different. Ultimately border associated with IF as demarked if need be will stimulate same response as physical barrier or territorial boundary.

If I have to become and expert dog trainer to achieve goal, then so be it.

I am answering multiple post in this so sorry for appearing "disjunctive".


Quote:
Proper kick in face to ensures I give this ample consideration.

 

[Jamie_Dog_Trainer]

Quote:
Consider me not to be a novice at training animals and that I will invest time. I work property about 4 hours each day. If need be all birds will be confined and dog taken through entire training protocol before all parties released unsupervised. We have broken dogs from visiting in past so that is not considered to be a problem. I am well versed in training of fish and birds and generally they are slower at getting picture of what I want than a dog will be. The trials of baby steps and setbacks very well appreciated. I will still ask experts of training dogs to respect invisible fences. Dog must be able to roam property or more than dog will have to be dropped from plans. No fence I can afford will exclude predators, terrestrial or aerial. Humans are my concern, not that of dogs, to avoid legal concerns. Dogs to be people friendly at all times. For short-term I can setup electric fence for redundancy as it will be used to contain sheep and goats. Dog is young and some neighbors may be helping by shooting him with BB gun (I do not like this but does appear to be keeping him away from at least one residence). Presently he does respect fence line bordering on neighbors property. I can manage vegetation and existing fence line to help define perimeter of dog's roaming area.

Term prey drive is tossed around way too much and frequently out of context. Dog chasing another predator while growling is not in prey drive; thought processes are very different. Ultimately border associated with IF as demarked if need be will stimulate same response as physical barrier or territorial boundary.

If I have to become and expert dog trainer to achieve goal, then so be it.

I am answering multiple post in this so sorry for appearing "disjunctive".


Quote:
Proper kick in face to ensures I give this ample consideration.

Sounds like you've got this all thought out then. Just remember that when training a dog cannot take a 4 hour period of time that the actual instruction is going on, and will start to make a lot of mistakes about 30 minutes into the training session, especially if this is a new thing. So if you have your dog out with you all four hours, give the dog a two hour break from the fence training and do another session before leaving the area -- this ensures the dog has ample time to let the lesson sink in without causing unwanted stress. A stressed dog will react not think through a problem. Make sure you have your dog on leash too, as not to set up him up for failure when learning something brand new.

Good luck.

 

[centrarchid]

Training bouts can be kept short, 30 minutes or less.

 

[Jamie_Dog_Trainer]

Quote:
I agree that prey drive is spoken too often when talking about a dog chasing a predator off. It really depends on the dog though, a GSP is a prey driven dog, primarily that is how he will work. An LGD, on the other hand, does not work primarily in prey drive, so the chase is of different intent. Your GSP may well chase rabbits, or other small animals off your property as well as chase a coyote. Will the "drive" be different? I really don't know the answer, thats up to the individual dog. I had a German Shepherd that was very good at chasing (and sometimes taking down) stray dogs and coyotes on our property. He was a very prey driven dog, but certianly wasn't in prey while working another dog or coyote -- he was being territorial. He could care less that the coyotes were after our chickens -- he'd kill them too (in prey drive

). But seeing a strage canid on our property made him crazy.

 

[centrarchid]

Quote:
I agree that prey drive is spoken too often when talking about a dog chasing a predator off. It really depends on the dog though, a GSP is a prey driven dog, primarily that is how he will work. An LGD, on the other hand, does not work primarily in prey drive, so the chase is of different intent. Your GSP may well chase rabbits, or other small animals off your property as well as chase a coyote. Will the "drive" be different? I really don't know the answer, thats up to the individual dog. I had a German Shepherd that was very good at chasing (and sometimes taking down) stray dogs and coyotes on our property. He was a very prey driven dog, but certianly wasn't in prey while working another dog or coyote -- he was being territorial. He could care less that the coyotes were after our chickens -- he'd kill them too (in prey drive

). But seeing a strage canid on our property made him crazy.

My GSP clearly operates in territorial mode in respect to other canids. Rabbits, squirrels and mourning doves promote the "prey driven" pursuit which is very easy to distinguish from former based on vocalizations alone. Posture and activities following chase also different. In respect to livestock (poultry), he runs about but does not target the chickens. He will as of this morning chase a Coopers hawk and mourning dove through flock of chickens, former in response to alarm produced by chickens. Hawk flying at chicken-eye level through flock but not going after chickens (using chickens as cover when going after songbirds). Scoob chased hawk past where I want him to go as well.