Is it moral to eat meat? ***Constructive Discussion ONLY***

[NoelTate]

I think morality is a personal issue. What is immoral for one person may not be immoral for others. Personally, I believe killing any animal that has a self-awareness is immoral. I try to take into consideration the intelligence of the animal and how "high" of a lifeform it is. An animal that has intelligence and an obvious self-awareness should not be killed and consumed. To me, that is immoral. I do, however, eat fish and other seafood because I believe they do not have the same intelligence and self-awareness that higher order animals have. If animals are going to be raised for meat, I do believe we have a moral perogative to raise them in the most humane, comfortable, healthy way possible and to kill them as quickly, painlessly, and fearlessly as possible and to use every single part of the animal. I strongly believe that it is immoral and absolutely inhuman to enjoy killing something. Pleasure should never come from taking a life.
As for the Biblical issue...there is an entire school of thought that believes it is immoral to eat meat and that the entire Adam and Eve eating meat was a one time pass due to a temporary drought. There is a Bible diet that supposedly leads to a healthier, longer life, and it does not include meat at all. Interesting theory.

 

[Corey NC]

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My mom is apart of the program. It has done wonders for her and her MS.

http://www.hacres.com/home/home.asp

 

[chickenannie]

I think people compartmentalize meat-eating from other parts of their lives, especially those with no exposure to farms/farming, cycles of life/death, gardening. We love our pets and pamper them dearly, but then munch on fried chicken without a thought. Vegetarians swear against meat but eat eggs as if they were not animals (eggs ARE baby chickens just 21 days short.)

Raising chickens and working with a grassfed, humane-treatment, sustainable small farm, I've had to "face" up to where my meat comes from -- a living breathing sentient being. It's just weird when I think about it too much. It makes me uncomfortable, I admit. I agree with other posts that it is a reality we have the luxury of denying because it is so hidden from us.

I think it is GOOD to face the reality because I definitely respect meat 100 times more now that I know how it is raised and exactly how much work, feed, labor, and time went into it. I now know a lot about the life of happy, well-raised pigs, lambs, cattle, and chickens -- information I will take with me from now on. I remember having whole-hearted discussions about vegetarianism back before I knew anything about raising animals -- I guess my information came from reading, but now it comes from experience.

I would encourage vegetarians and meat-eaters alike to have real farm experiences, of one type or another.

I educate others about sustainable farming and notice that people have this insatiable desire to know what Farming is about. They want to spend time visiting the farm, bringing their kids. It seems we've all become disconnected from the blood, guts, poop, and dirt that are REAL experiences. People seem to fear dirt and germs more and more. Do they know vegetables are grown in manure mixed with dirt? Any gardener knows that gorgeous salad of tomatoes and lettuces had mud and bugs on it just before being washed. We have to become comfortable with nature again.

BYC people are awesome in that we are raising chickens and *accidentally* finding out where our food comes from.

 

[Cassandra]

I was a vegetarian for a couple of years in my early twenties. No particular reason. Just wanted to do it at the time. All the rest of my life, I've eaten meat. I really like it.

I think sometimes people forget what the food chain is. It's a circle and we are only on the top of it in pictures when we draw ourselves there.

We are IN the food chain, too--I mean on the getting eaten part! I don't mean getting eaten by wild animals (lions & tigers & bears, oh my!) Though that does still happen. I mean, we return to dust, as it were, with the help of worms and microbes and things. And that dust fertilizes the ground and grass grows over us and deer eat the grass and man eats the deer, and on and on...

Keeping with the example of deer, I have many friends who hunt. They study and practice good stewardship of their land by killing just enough deer to feed their families. They will only kill a certain gender of a certain age at certain times of the year. Our game commission supports this, too, with seasons and bag limits and such. If there were no human predators of deer in our area, the deer population would soon grow itself into starvation. Nature will generally maintain its balance one way or the other. That does not mean I think that everyone SHOULD eat meat. But everyone is doing their part, whatever they decide to eat.

Another reason I wholeheartedly believe eating meat is perfectly fine is that one of the reasons humans are adaptable is that they can survive by eating a wide variety of things. I repeated a joke I had heard in a chat room one time: "If we're not supposed to eat animals, why are they made out of meat?" (If this offends you, I think you are taking it out of context.) There was a person in the chat who was very offended by the comment. She said something along the lines of "How can you say that? Eating cows or pigs or chickens is no different from eating dogs or cats!"

I agreed with her. It is very much the same. However, while it is culturally repulsive for most of us to think of eating cats or dogs, there are some cultures where it's commonly done. And really, do I have a right to go tell someone they shouldn't be doing that? Like, "Sorry, sir. You'll have to feed your kids some roots and berries or something. Because this dog eating is just out of the question." I don't think anyone has a right to do that.

I also agree with all of you that most commercial processing of meat is just... atrocious. I do what I can to avoid supporting it. That's why I'm here. But, if it came to a choice of feeding my children or sparing an animal a lifetime of hardship, I believe I would feed my kids every time.

Cassandra

 

[Hangin Wit My Peeps]

People like us, the small producers who care, are the ones who ought be raising meat. I should feel guilt over every piece of meat I ate up until this point.

VERY good point! I feel the chickens that are used for meat are getting a MUCH better life then if they were in a factory. They are cared for properly and loved. If it were not for people like those in BYC who raise their own meat and for those farmers who sell their meat I would become a vegan too!​

 

[greyfields]

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[redhead83402]

Just my 2c ~ so many folks have already put it so succinctly ~ we eat of very little meat, ( more as a flavoring than anything) , & with thanksgiving when we do. We hardly ever eat meat in the summer, usually only in the winter, because it warms the body. These are our own religious beliefs.

I do feel it is moral to waste that which is given, whether animal or plant, or any other material, either. One of the more deplorable American traits, ( In my own humble opinion) is a lack of willingness to use something to it's fullest. We seem to be a ~trash it~ society. I don't hold with that, and feel that ~ *use it up, wear it out, fix it up, or do without* ~ is a better way to be.

I don't think it's wrong to be vegetarian, nor do I feel it is wrong to eat meat. What would be wrong is forcing others to do something they don't feel comfortable with. Each person should have the agency to choose for themselves whether or not they eat meat or do not eat meat.

My husband is not vegetarian at all ~ he jokes thusly " What do you call a vegetarian?..... food" That is not meant to offend anyone ~ he just likes to eat meat, and thinks he's funny. :-D

I will say this ~ once I saw how horrifically animals were treated on those huge farms, I could not bring myself to purchase or eat chicken, pig, or cow in any way, shape or form, that I did not know where it came from. I could not knowingly bring myself to be a part of that. That is why we started raising chickens, so that we could get eggs ( that is our main source of protien, along with beans). But we are buying a pig locally, to put in the freezer, and feel good about that. And we buy a whole turkey for Thanksgiving, and use it up all the way, with soups and stews after.

I don't judge those who don't eat meat, nor do I judge those who do eat meat; I do, however, look a little scornfully on those who waste, or over-gluttonize, whether it's meat, or otherwise. (which makes me a hypocrite, since I am a dedicated fabriholic and bead collector.) That's just me being dead honest. It's not my place to make that judgement, and yet I sometimes do.

And, I also still love a good gourmet burger or steak about once a year. I get sick from eating it, since we hardly ever do, but, like a true addict, do it anyway, because I remember the taste as being so good. That's probably more morally wrong than anything ~ I go against my own health and knowledge, and eat it once in a great while anyway.
~Red

 

[greyfields]

Let me applaud everyone here for the civilized conversation.

Also, there is certainly more than one vegan on these boards.

 

[kstaven]

I guess I will jump in here. I was born and raised in a farm environment, so slaughtering animals was just part of life. As a youngster I honestly believed all animals where treated like the ones I had grown up seeing.

My eye opening came from getting a job in a slaughterhouse. I really couldn't believe how cruel many of the people that worked there where. I quite and got a job at another and it was no different, and in some ways worse. That had the effect of turning me into a hard core Vegan. I spent almost two years as one of those folks even other vegans avoid.

What turned me back to eating meat, dairy and eggs? In two words, "my health". While many may thrive as a vegan, I did not.

Since that point I have never been able to look at a steak or chicken in a store without reliving what I experienced. We raise all our own meat animals and know exactly how they were raised and what it was fed.

Personally I feel every child should be exposed to the farm environment, that of the large bulk food producers, vegetarian and vegan environments, and then allowed to make their own decisions from there. At least then, they could make a more informed decision based on experience, rather than being influenced by the sensationalism in the media. Meat or no meat ... that is the right of the individual to chose and a decision we should all respect.

 

[greyfields]

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Intruiging statement... can something be truly ethical to one person but not another?

I think so.

But, that would be a point of dispute amongst many.