Jest Another Day in Pear-A-Dice - Higgins Rat Ranch Conservation Farm in Alberta

[CanuckBock]

I can just picture HyBlade going back to his empty dish hoping by magic some new morsel appeared. I had one pup that would sleep with his head in the bowl, in case food suddenly appeared.

Once I was kidding around and positioned some goody near the nose of a deep -in -sleep puppy, the nose twitched, and it woke with a bit of a start and gobbled it down. Then looked all over for the good food fairy that must have put it there. Hard to fall back asleep after that happens.

Diva...new title - Tormenter of Puppies!

Hey now...you got a "golden feather" but you have no golden feather title...you should request one, eh! Whole fun of having a GF is to be titled...I'd say knighted but I think that is more a commonwealth country thingy. Hee hee...Medusa won me my golden feather in the Cushion Comb contest and I get to turn off the BYC advertising that also gobbles up my data allowances on the internet service provider's plan. Yee ha, eh!

Yes, HyBlade lived up true to form being the only male ACDog here, he loved his food. Never to savour it because, well all those four girl dogs that hen pecked him, were out to steal his food from him <--his take on this but not really reality I suppose. Never matters what is real if you truly feel another way, eh. I miss his booming voice...miss his manly manners. Ah well, he'll never be completely gone so long as we think of them often with fondness.

Tara

 

[perchie.girl]

I just wonder how I got away with free feeding my dogs.... The Grey hound had to be taught to eat kibble... On the track they feed wet food with added water to keep them hydrated. He was three when I got him he had a blown hock but oh boy could he still run and loved it. He had an odd gait from it but never complained.

I kept a kibble bowl full of abut ten cups of kibble. He ate two or three and took two or three back to a private place to eat... usually his bed or his yard house...

Then i brought home Rosie. She was a pound puppy... About two years old and anxious to belong to my pack. At first she went to the food bar and was stunned and filled up... While the Greyhound watched. by the end of the week she was pretty much only eating a mouthfull at a time... Both of them stayed in very good weight... Not too fat not too lean.

I fed very good name brand food at the time... such as Iams or Nutra... If I had dogs now I would go to Blue Buffalo or something similar.

I would like to do this again... but I realize some breeds of dogs will not stop ...

deb

 

[perchie.girl]

Tara what is your feeding program for your adult dogs... Do you mix or make your own?

I am intrigued by the BARF diet as well.

I soo want another dog...

deb

 

[Wisher1000]

I took off work last Thursday and Friday. Thursday, I brushed and bathed my old dog, Docker. He always loved his baths, like no dog I've ever seen. He realized that even though he got wet, he also got scratched all over. He thoroughly enjoyed the grooming and I stretched it out to over an hour. He rubbed his head in the warm grass and laid in the sun to dry. Then, we went for a slow ride in the Ranger (four wheel ATV.) Once he was completely dry, I let him inside the house. I have let him in many times over the last 15 years, but he never really felt comfortable there. He paced a bit, and had a hard time walking on the hardwood floors. I called him to the area rug in the kitchen and we had a gourmet dog meal. I gave him Spam, Vienna Sausages, cheese, and some leftover ground beef. He was fine as long as he was eating like that, but as soon as it was gone he paced some more and was ready to go back out. I opened the door and he walked out, felt the heat, and turned around and pushed past me back inside. I put a blanket on the floor but he opted to lay on the hardwood. I let him stay all afternoon, with an occasional walk outside to keep the floors dry. Between the slick floor and his lack of muscle tone, I would have to help him get to his feet. Friday morning, I called the vet but couldn't get an appointment for him until 3:30. We spent the day together again, except for the time I spent digging a hole down by the creek. At 3:00, I backed the truck up to a hill and let the tailgate down so he could load up. He was happy to get in, and liked the old sheet that I put on the bed liner so it wouldn't be hot. The only thing he liked better than a bath, was a ride in the back of the truck. I rode back there with him and my son drove. I had to support him because his old legs couldn't keep him balanced with the turns, starts, and stops of the trip, but he kept his nose to the wind and his ears (and his tongue) flapped in the wind. People in cars, and especially truck drivers, would smile and wave at me and my old dog in the back of the truck. I don't know if they could see the occasional tear that slid down my cheek, but their smiles were oddly comforting. The doc came out to the truck and said that he looked good, I think he was surprised that Docker was not in bad shape. He was fully fleshed, maybe even borderline fat. His coat was thick and shiny, but his teeth were all but gone. He had worn the canines off to less than a half inch long and all the others were worn off even with his gums. He couldn't hear, and had developed a chronic cough from his enlarged heart. He struggled to lay down, and struggled even harder to get up. Lately, he had been staggering and sometimes he would stumble and fall. He panted constantly. About a week ago, he stopped wagging his tail when he greeted me. He would just come to me with a look that asked me to help. It was time. The vet gave him some anesthetic and he went to sleep. He then administered that pink liquid that stopped his heart. We buried him down by the creek where he loved to cool off in the water in the summers. I'll miss that old chicken killing dog.

 

[drumstick diva]

Beautiful way to say good bye but, also sad

He knew he was well loved and cared for.

 

[scottcaddy]

for Wisher and Docker, you did the right thing!

Scott

 

[CanuckBock]

Tara what is your feeding program for your adult dogs... Do you mix or make your own?

I am intrigued by the BARF diet as well.

I soo want another dog...

deb

Perchie...you made me laugh because I remember trying to get Stoggar to go on the free pour kibs. I had heard if you let the dog eat and had it there, they would eat till they were full and realize the gravy train was never leaving...HA! Stogs was a rescue...so I put out a huge supply of kibbles. And she ate, she ate, and ate and was round as a barrel and then kept eating some more. Rick and I began to worry she was gonna explode she gorged (did I mention she ATE?). After a week of this and me thinking she was going to jeopardize her health in some negative way, the free pour ended...and then we both laughed because while we had ended the free pour, the free pour did not quite end immedatley...she crapped, she crapped and crapped like we were housing an elephant (did I mention she CRAPPED?). I had never seen a dog crap so much. So that ended any thoughts of free-pour for Stoogies.

What do I feed...I use to feed Purina dog chow. Yup, nothing fancy and nothing too cheap. Then Purina changed the shape and formula (used by dog sledders during the Yukon gold rush to feed their dogs) and Stogs got ill off it, so we switched to Alpo. I think Purina makes that brand too. I don't switch kib brands, go with what seems to work and when we had the five dogs...it would go on sale and I'd buy ten bags. You can be sure people seeing me with that much figured Rick and I were eating it too. Ha ha ha...yummy...finally a simple BALANCED diet! Freedom from cooking them meals, eh!

I wrote an article on what happened when baby Makins was shipped here and I followed what the breeder in Oregon was feeding (some Costco brand dog food, too high in the protein department).

http://www.telusplanet.net/public/ranchrat/index.html:
Now do keep in mind...I have never fed any of the fancy smancy overly advertised and expensive for that, crapola dog foods...when a dog food brand overly advertises itself, I get highly suspicious. I remember the one famously well advertised dog food brand that was found to be putting melanine in their kibs...really, plastics? That and any brand of dog food sold out of a vet clinic for astronomical amounts of $$. In fact, many of us sensible dog breeders steer clear of ANY vet clinic that has a large selection of pet foods sold outta the front of their clinic. To many of us, it is a rip off. Sorta a tug on so "how much do you love your pet? Prove it by buying this $120 bag of dog kibs!" Yeh...nope! Now my fav good vet, his clinic does sell food out the front BUT I followed him when he moved to that clinic, so I had already established a good rapport with him.

Watch out for dog treats...the biscuits we buy are pails (now boxes...miss those pails, I use the form mixed bird feeds in the poultry pens) of Milkbone (nfi on all these brand names, eh) and use those because they are not high in protein and can be broken into pieces to feed like five faces if needed and carried around in a pocket (which I hopefully feed to dogs and not wash because I forgot it was in the pocket). Dog treats unlike dog FOOD have no real authorities watching out what is put in them. Certified dog food has to have certain criterion met whilst dog treats are like a free open anything goes thing. If your dog is too fat, it may not be the food you feed but the number of treats you give them over the day that is making them plump.

We condition score the dogs, feel the backbone, hips, ribs. Keep them trim but also a bit of fat is good as the dog gets older as in Fixins's case, she was always very lean and active but we put a bit of fat on her ribs because if she did get ill, she needed a bit of a reserve on her is what we felt.

I remember one fiasco where Makins got kennel cough from going to a dog show. I had taken her in for the KC shot (nose drops I think it was?), and then six weeks later the booster...not realizing that some KCs only covered like FIVE of the KC viruses...she picked up a kind that was not covered...AGH! And that vet we were with at the time (and happily are no longer with!), tried to sell me on canned food from the clinic. I bought one can and it was like 15 or so years ago...for five dollars I bought what was basically a can of rice! Rice I coulda cooked up jest fine for my tummy compromised Makeys...so yeh. I am not an advocate of vet clinic pet foods, and I suspect will likely offend some persons but hey, you did ask, eh.

As far as the BARF diet, that was all the rage some 15 er so years ago in the dog breed I am in too. Had one person feed her two ACDs on a strict BARF diet (raw chicken wings, etc.) and her two dogs passed away at an early age (8 years) and of autoimmune diseases which brings to question...why should they have bothered. Not saying the bones and raw food caused the autoimmune early death but when two of them pass like that, you do have to go, "hmmm...."

My opinion, for that is what you are asking for, is no to a completely BARF diet. Studies have shown even us humans can benefit from raw a bit but cooked carrots make the good things in carrots much more useable, digestible, so my thoughts are what the heck is wrong with some cooked foods. Not against raw either, dogs love raw meat but they also love cooked warm dinners too.

While BARF is all about feeding uncooked raw and soft bones...let me touch on HARD bones....hard bones bust teeth on ACDs...baby puppies who will be changing out teeth, can have leg bones of cows to gnaw on...then when adult teeth come thru...NO BONES. Lots of toys made to allow them safe chewing but for anyone that has ever seen the muscles that attach the jaws and set of teeth to the face of a Cattle Dog--no hard bones. Makins sheared off a molar, slab fracture that we rushed her to Calgary vet to have sealed, not pulled. That is another error in judgement. Dogs like ACDs that have a tooth fail, no filling or sealing it...out it goes. Bill for sealing tooth was $1,500, then three month later, the tooth abscesses and we are back to a different vet to have it yanked out for another $500. I mention money because that usually makes people stand up and pay attention when in reality, to Rick and I, the one trip to have a tooth sealed is hard on the dog, another three months of pain and suffering further and then off to the vet again to be knocked out again to have the tooth pulled...THAT is what matters more to us than the money part but yeh, $2,000 and two vet trips, that does grab someone's attention more immediately than the sufferage of our good dogs while we try to get it figured out.

I use a basic dog kibble as my BASE for feeding. Any brand you trust not to be filled full of crap ingredients and for us, 21% protein means the diet is not overly rich. ACDs are extremely efficient at extracting nutrition from the foods they consume; blame the Dingo in the mix I guess. I add water to the kibs or soup broths/delicious gravies/pan drippings; some form of liquid to hydrate the meal. I prefer not to feed dry kibs by themselves as I figure a good liquid adds to the overall niceness of having a good meal. I add things like cooked eggs (not too many...funny that, vet was asked how many eggs are too many, once or twice a week, sorta like us and how eggs give us gas, eh!), anything we are having for dinner (spaghetti, stews, steak, potatoes, make ups special soup broths--dogs love that warming their kibs!, maybe not something spicy like too much chili...etc.). I also give the dogs greens...very important because when there is snow and ice on the ground, dogs can't snack on greens like fresh grass (and not always do they throw up or have worms when eating grasses...dogs eat greens). Romaine lettuce leaves are torn apart here like Hyenas eating Gazelle on the Serengeti--hee hee hee. I use frozen peas from the freezer to cool off a hot broth added to a dog dinner. It is ever so funny to watch a dog chase a pea around their stainless steel dog bowl...why yes, I am wickedly easily amused, eh.

The only painful dog that had an issue with basic kibs was Fixins, she developed an allergy to all grains. She did have major stomach surgery after Makins passed...we blame ourselves because we were all messed up in the head grieving and Fixins felt that and tore up a black ball to swallow some chunks that blocked her intestines...MAJOR surgery that left her never quite right...she should have died from that incident but came out injured and compromised...sigh! We near lost her mother and her...still beat ourselves up over that one. Oh well...

Fixins went on a brand of dog food that was a potato and salmon formula. Again, just used the kibs as a base and added chicken, beef, fish, pork (all cooked, I usually only ever fed beef raw and that was say a few scraps if I was trimming a steak to be cooked)...eggs (hard boiled, scrambled was good) and dairy as the dogs love cheese (cheese please!) but never alot of milk since they could get the runs if not use to that--ice cream...(NO chocolate)...Rick was guilty of giving the dogs a few licky licks of ice cream...usually on a wooden stick...such a bad man! All sorts of things go in our dog's food but based on a kibble we trust and some liquid to moisten and then whatever we are eating to it too. Cold carrots from the fridge are a fav of teething puppers too...remember you fed carrots to the pups as you will SEE it in their stools when you are scooping and might find that alarming. Hee hee... I am quite sure I am forgetting things but oh well...tis summer and that's what you get for asking an indepth question in summer when my brain left on holidays.

So there, let's end this conversation on the END product of feeding yer dog...you will know if your dog is eating OK when the stools they leave behind will disintegrate if you were to leave them to the elements. Ha ha ha...if the dog crap outlives the dang dog, makes you wonder what the heck they got in the formula...ha ha ha. We scoop poop here, both us and the dogs don't like slip sliding thru it and it makes an awful mess when Rick is doing yard work...hee hee. Amount of crap too is something you watch...how much of the diet is being used by the dog and how much is being expelled. Sure it is gonna stink but you'll figure it out as to what kinda good feeding you are doing by the ultimate END result. Also a good way to ensure no tape worms are inthe dogs...deworming regular (not as regular as you do down South where the cold don't kill some of the parasite loads) is good as is watching the hair coat condition and for bright eyes, good energy levels, wet noses...feeding the dog well and good should result in a healthy dog that looks good and has lots of healthy energy to burn.

I think you do what you do because it is easy and convenient for your life style on feeding anything. When bad results start happening, that is when you have to step up and investigate a better way. If you are feeding correctly, the end result is a healthy and happy creature.

Think that about covers it...not sure I haven't forgotten some aspect but that be that from moi.

Tara

 

[CanuckBock]

I guess a good way to look at how we feed is to look at the poultry here...

For the birds, we feed a base species specific only vegetable ration then add a 1/3 whole grain mix (whole heavy oats, whole hard red wheat - in winter we add cracked yellow non-dusty corn so they can generate heat).

Duck & Goose Grower pelleted
Turkey Finisher (no ampro) pelleted
Chicken Layer Diet ration dry mash

Granite Grit with crushed Oyster Shell on offer always

Fresh water

Greens - cases of human grade romaine lettuce in winter, alfalfa hay to nibble at, and weather permitting, time out on grassy lawns to chase bugs and nap in the sun or shade.


We figure it is the ADDITIVES to the basic rations that matters. Then the creatures may pick and choose what they as individuals require--cravings to be satisfied. When moulting, the whole oats are gobbled up moreso...makes excellent plumage. In winter, the corn is scoffed up because it helps them generate heat...chooks are pigs over corn, so chicken candy corn is always on demand in their fav foods.

Keep in mind for dogs...historically many a work herding Border Collie was fed a sole diet of oat gruel and functioned quite fine on a grain diet alone. I figure because dogs have shared our caves with us for so long, they have adapted to eat our table scraps though I will say a diet of table scraps for a dog is less than ideal. Why we use a base ration and build upon that.

Oh yeh, and on popcorn night, the dogs got fresh popped sans the butter (and I never add salt but Rick does) each in their own bowls (not fight night!). Big procession to the kitchen to watch the popping corns, then big procession back to the living room...everyone settled in their spot (dog bed) in the living room and bowls were divvied out. Movie night in the Higgins' household entailed twice as many dog bowls to wash...hee hee. I can only imagine what general society would say about a video link to that hilarity of our family endeavours--utter idiots I figure and yet, so normal to us.

I am kinda cynical on these prepared dog foods that tout fresh ingredients and cost an arm and a leg for that concept (kinda like ice cream you buy that is say "blueberry"...buy a small 'tainer of real booberries and stir that in...or yogurt with a tiny dash of "fruit" on the bottom! No comparison to ADDING ingredients you have inspected for quality). I can put our own chicken, lamb, rice, beef, fish, pork, veg, dairy and eggs (oh the good eggers) in to a base ration for dawgs and pump that WAY outta the ball park compared to some high priced bag of supposed pristine best kibble.

Now I won't skip the base ration because I am not willing to become a chemist in the kitchen to try and formulate that special PILL that is complete as a dietary perfected recipe. I harvest the precompiled kibs and supplement it with good eats to boost its quality ourselves...because I know if I slice a hotdog into dinner, whilst it might be lips and buttholes, the actual "chicken" I add is not jest mock chicken lips...hee hee.

Coffee break is over...gotta fly.

Tara

 

[perchie.girl]

Thank you Tara... I am going to rethink my feed some now.

I fed Purina for years were talking 40... Mom still feeds it. I got to reading lables and listening to the vet and getting that all twirled up in my head. This was before the internet.

I still buy Purina chicken feed and If I were to feed the horse and goats grain at all It probably would be a Purina product.

I switched to NutraMax for my dogs because corn was a little further down on their list of ingredients. and it was a decent price not as cheap as Purina but it was a good price for me. Because I free fed I didn't add anything to their kibble bowl. But I did buy cheap cans of canned food.... Pedigree was the one I used... The greyhound got more because he was bigger... almost seventy pounds. Rosie got a Rosie sized portion.

Neither dog got fed at the table... So begging was discouraged and I used the "no dogs" and suggested them to go lay down. they did but kept an eye out for when we got up so they could hoover up any crumbs on the floor....

And of course any prewashing was dog jobs...

I have never had more than two dogs at one time... I could not imagine the discipline required to keep more and have good citizenship. I am hoping to change that in the future. I am going to have to have at least three dogs to take up the job that Rosie left....

deb

 

[CanuckBock]

Rick is the one that hand feeds the dogs in situations I would avoid at all costs...personally, I hate that--hand feeding dogs past treat rewards for performing some silly antics or such...it causes lots of issues that I really don't figure needs to happen, eh? But (and a rather big one I have!), the dogs are HIS too and if he wants to feed the dogs, we have to somehow manage it as best able.

I plan (yeh, plans of mice and men, eh), I plan on having the girl pups go spend some down time in their ex-pen areas when I go about serving dinner for us humans and have plans this round to make dog feeding time at LUNCH time and see how that goes. Use to feed twice a day and figure we may change that because we can start fresh. I found when we fed dogs in the morning, Makins would get SO excited that the smallest of sounds or the earliest of wisps of sunlight (day time...is it light out...is it FOOD TIME??), she would make a stir that would wake Rick up because I made breakfast for the dogs the evening prior and had them dog bowls all stacked waiting for Rick to dish out. I don't want him getting up any earlier than he already does...like two a.m....drives me to distraction as he gets so little sleep and I keep telling him, "tiredness leads to illness because you are compromising yourself." Read a good thing in the Chicken Health Book, stress is defined as anything that compromises your ability to fight off illness (some such wording).

As young pups, sure gonna do two meals, it is better, but work down to lunch time if dog food time. I am not sure how that will go, but heck, give it a whirl and see. I do know by the time I feed us humans...I am utterly exhausted and want to call the day done...done like dinner means Zzzzzzzzzzz time...or at best, flop on chair and rest time.

Your hoover reference makes me laugh because we use to call Makins "Hoovey"....you could almost hear the hum she'd make but it was more like "Ummm...this is SO good!"

"OK DOGS....clean up, aisle nine!"

​

One night we were so tired...Rick's fingers let go and it was an awesome dinner...steak and potatoes, some veg too...the dogs standing around ate GREAT that night...I cut my dinner in half with him that night and we humans got by. I just cringe thinking..."yeh, your hand lets go and the dogs FEAST!" Cripers.

​

Most of the dogs here are food motivated totally. Makins being our first ACD, she'd act all tough and stubborn and then out would come the baked liver and she'd near go giddy, standing on her head. "Not so tough now are you girl?" "Please, please, what do you want from me!"

It's finding that weakness, the Achilles' heel in your dogs. For Fixins, in her younger days, it was tossing the toy...she'd do anything to be able to play...later on, it went on to adding food too.

​

My son was ever so grateful towards the dogs...I got to sew up dog costumes and the dogs would practically run each other over to get dressed up...slobber on the go just thinking..."We humour her, wear the idiot outfits, do the silly skits (hey diddle, diddle), and we EAT GOOD! Num num..."

You know, I never thought a pack of five was any worse than one. Sure one on one, like having kids is easier to focus on the one that needs attention. You had a singleton yourself Deb...wasn't it fine to come home and see the lamp broke and KNOW that the kid did it and not have to figure which one? Course there was a few times Alexander tried, tried to say Makins broke it but then the retort was, "Then why did you let the DOG break the lamp?" He could never wig outta the responsibility to tow the line, eh. We left him in charge...

You do have to have eyes in the back of your head with several dogs to make sure it is all fair and above board. There were a few times someone screamed and because there were too many bodies in the way, you could not pin point who did the naughty deed unless you found a hairy mouth with furred evidence still in place, but catching them right in the act or not...it clued you in there was something up bubbling on the surface and you watched all the more harder to catch the infraction and get it settled out. I was pretty stern about no horse play, lots of fun but things like a cheap shot at another dog, that really got a finger wagging over and a stern NOT ALLOWED talking to. And like kids, the pack of dogs would push it and you had to say, when was enough. When too much fun goes down, next thing is the crying. Emotional extremes you gotta figure to keep on top of but one or five, you still gotta have that crystal ball in place to make sure it stayed fun.

I like brace chains...I just went thru my show dog bag and admired my one chain and one nylon brace chain. I have a leather one or two also, lovely pieces of equipment for multi dog owners. It is rather grand to have one leash with two dogs attached which can give you a free hand if needed. Two leashes tend to get tangled up, usually with you in the middle of the knot...that's always interesting, half strangled sputtering, "HEEL, Heel I say!" <drag drag drag>>

I showed HyBlade (red male) and Makins (blue female) in conformation brace and got all this flack over it from other exhibitors and handlers because they kept saying the dogs were suppose to be "identical" and yeh, I knew others that showed a mother/daughter brace. I just shrugged and replied, so Makins is HyBlade's shadow, mirror images but shadows. I did it because it was challenging not because we had a hope in heck of winning...it was WAY more challenging than many knew. Makins might have been smaller but she was all girl dog (that "B" word we are not allowed to say here!). HyBlade was all male until she shot him that look and then he was a blithering idiot because he knew his butt was grass and she was gonna make him pay like no tomorrow. I could have never even considered Fixins and HyBlade, both of them being reds. Fixins would have jumped on him and killed him AND me the moment I brought out the brace chain..."That's SO NOT happening!" She was pretty good with her Mom tho...Makins was Mom and she always respected that. Sorta like hitching up dogs (horses, sheeps) in draft...you know where their best place is and who they will tolerate or work well beside, behind, in front of. Lots of wrecks happen if the dynamics in hierarchy change and you weren't apprised of the matter.

I know you can picture the three of us (Makins, HB, and I) doing the conformation run silly around the show ring...me thinking the whole time..."Keep it together...keep it together...HyBlade don't give her a bad time...Makins, keep your teeth to yourself...keep it together!" Talk about a white knuckle ride because at any moment, Makins could be on top of HyBlade ripping his throat out while he screamed like a school girl about how mean the girls were to him...lovely PR for the breed, eh??

About the only other group that kinda gets the herding one is the Terrier people...they do alot of laughing....dogs like theirs are WAY too smart too. Only thing other dog breeds don't seem to get in the ACDs is the need to bite each other during play time...oh what fun...bite bite bite...lots, even some German Shepherds would begin to play and get bit and back out..."What was that for?"

HB & Styra​

ACDs are like "HUH...doncha wanna play?" (big toothy grins)

Tara