Just curious who else is living super frugal

[perchie.girl]

I had a rescued greyhound and they are sensitive to barbituates... Like deadly to them. So when I had him neutered they had to use a different kind of anesthesia.

breed of dog and their sensitivities is very important to know. We humans bred them this way so we are responsible to be up on what they need.

I use ivermectin paste for the horse and the goats. oral... My goats mugged me for their dose after they tasted it.....

I went to a reputable goat site for dosage information AND went to several others to confirm before I dosed my goats. With horses its pretty forgiving and hard to over dose. My girl gets TWO whole tubes... for 2000 lb horse thats just a little over dosed.

Ivermectin is also absorbed through the skin as in the pour on for cattle. if you cant give it by injection I suspect the pour on would work. DO not take my speculation as word.... please

We are talking drops not actually pouring a bottle on your animal. Thats how the heart guard or heart worm drops work.

So... dosage is very very important. If you dont know go the vet route.

I wouldnt even dose with herbals till I understood their effects, the strength required, and their interactions with anything else. and if someone just said use X amount in Y manner I would thank them for their info and confirm with at least three others to be certain.

I have seen too much info passed around as being gospel Not just here but Internet wide. Be proactive and verify verify verify.

deb

 

[OnlyOrps]

I had a rescued greyhound and they are sensitive to barbituates...  Like deadly to them.  So when I had him neutered they had to use a different kind of anesthesia.

breed of dog and their sensitivities is very important to know.  We humans bred them this way so we are responsible to be up on what they need.

I use ivermectin paste for the horse and the goats.  oral...  My goats mugged me for their dose after they tasted it.....   I went to a reputable goat site for dosage information AND went to several others to confirm before I dosed my goats.  With horses its pretty forgiving and hard to over dose.  My girl gets TWO whole tubes...  for 2000 lb horse thats just a little over dosed.

Ivermectin is also absorbed through the skin as in the pour on for cattle.  if you cant give it by injection I suspect the pour on would work.    DO not take my speculation as word.... please

We are talking drops not actually pouring a bottle on your animal.  Thats how the heart guard or heart worm drops work.

So... dosage is very very important.  If you dont know go the vet route.

I wouldnt even dose with herbals till I understood their effects, the strength required, and their interactions with anything else.  and if someone just said use X amount in Y manner I would thank them for their info and confirm with at least three others to be certain.

I have seen too much info passed around as being gospel  Not just here but Internet wide.  Be proactive and verify verify verify.

deb

Great advice! With every new species of animal I have raised I first researched the species and breed for years and always always found at least three opinions to cross reference and never exercised the advice without finding at least two who agreed and had a good reputation.

 

[perchie.girl]

Quote:
even breed to breed of the same species... I personally have seen ivermectin work on mange... Two doses a week a part...
deb

 

[lazy gardener]

I agree. We can get the 3 year for dogs if they gad the one year peior. But cats. Ugh. They need and annual, and if they are not utd on that, then no flea meds.

My cat had the 3 year rabies vaccine last summer.

 

[Arielle]

Quote: Yes yellow. It apparently kills the adults--- do some research and see what you think. I only use this in my house, where I dont want bugs and dont use DE as it kills the good and the bad.

Currently storing up wood ashes to use inthe coops for the hens to have a bath.

I find it hard to find natural flea and bug controls as use of them to reduce problem bugs can be harmful to the good ones too. I think treatment is a matter of timing, and prevention.Are some hens more bothered by mites etc--. As Bee was saying, perhaps they should have a greater priority when selecting breeding stock.

Quote: I had one dog that also went thru treatment. Very expensive.

I've had intact dogs my entire life. Never had an oops litter. My intact dogs were always easier to train and handle than the spayed and neutered rescued I took in to foster. I trained for other people as well. Every neurotic mess I've encountered has been altered. I have been told by reputable sources such as veterinarians that testosterone and estrogen aid in the calming process and so altered dogs are often times more hyper and irrational. I always laugh when people alter a dog to calm it down or fix aggression issues. I've had up to 7 in tact males from 7 pound little breeds to 207 pound giant breeds and never an aggression issue. They aren't neutered in wild dog packs so why can't we expect our domestic packs to live in harmony? It's easy to know your dog's behavior and breeding schedule, separate while in heat and control litters so you aren't over breeding. I'm so glad I have a vet who supports responsible breeding and ownership and doesn't peddle those spay and neuter myths.

As I said, observing many rottie males, UN NEUTERED males, sitting ringside waiting their turn was an eyeopener. These nasty ferocious dogs were sitting, and minding their own business for the most part. Show dogs cannot be neutered. Once they fixed, they cannot be shown at these kinds of shows ( though I think a couple classes are an exception.)

 

[gevshiba]

I have a lab and great pyrenees. They have already been wormed with paste. The vet was supportive of me using it as the Pyr pup came to me with mange and needed drastic treatment. The rewards far out weigh the risk. I bred BCs for 7 yrs and wormed them with ivermectin paste. I knew the risks but everyone I bought my dogs from used the paste also. I have yet to have a dog react to any form of ivermectin and use it with great success. Just wormed the Pyr and lab with horse paste last week. So that's why I inquired which type to use. It's all effective and safe for the dogs I currently own.

I worked at a vet clinic and saw a dog die from paste wormer. But, as I said, I'm no vet, so if you and your vet are ok with it, who am I to argue?

 

[Chickerdoodle13]

A few things I saw briefly that caused me concern so I just wanted to make mention.

Please dont use dog products on cats, especially for flea/tick/heart worm. Some are very toxic to cats and others, even if safe for cats, can cause severe Nervous system signs if overdosed. It is very, very hard to dose dog products for cats, even of comparable sizes. The dosages and mixtures are actually different for cats. Now it is actually mandatory for all companies to label their dog products with "not for use on cats" even if they were previously safe (well, safer).

I would also be very careful about using ivermectin, especially in mixed breed dogs or dogs with any sort of herding breed. I have an Australian cattle dog that got some horse wormer after the horse spit it out and had severe toxicity. It was horrible. The dose in most heartworm pills from the vet is not enough to cause toxicity in even dogs susceptible to it. The reason horse wormer should not be used in animals smaller than horses is because the dose in that paste is not evenly distributed through out the paste. Therefore, it is extremely difficult to get the correct dose without first emptying the syringe into a bowl and thoroughly mixing the paste up.

I would be careful about buying HW preventatives from suppliers without a yearly (or every two years) negative HW test. Giving some products with an active infection can be fatal, and if the dog develops heart worms while on a product, the company will cover the treatment 100% IF that dog has a neg test from within the year. Dogs should also be tested before switching products for that very same reason.

I don't believe it is necessary to give cats HW preventatives. While they can still get HW disease, they generally carry a significantly reduced worm load than dogs do, and so they rarely develop clinical disease. If you are using Advantage, that should cover HW, fleas, and roundworms though.

As for vaccinations, I think they all have their merits. I briefly researched the claim that lepto vaccine can cause lepto and found evidence to support what I originally thought. The vaccine does not cause disease. In fact, none of the commonly administered vaccines can cause the disease in animals, though certain older vaccines (like lymes for example) used to cause positive test results on the SNAP test. Now they have developed marker vaccines which do not cause a reaction on the screening test. Any dog that has access to water or urine of wild animals (basically any dog that spends time in woods or likes puddles) is at risk for lepto. It is a terrible disease, with zoonotic potential (and can cause serious issues in other farm animals, like horses and pigs...this disease causes moon blindness and renal failure in horses!). The kennel cough complex is so easily preventable through vaccines, that I recommend it to anyone that exposes their dogs to other dogs. The vaccine can now be given orally (GREAT and more effective option) and can be bought for a few bucks at tractor supply. The antibiotics to treat bacterial kennel cough are still more expensive than the vaccine. Distemper is also considered a core vaccine, and it is another that is more common than people think and entirely preventable. It can be devastating in animals that contract it.

 

[perchie.girl]

A few things I saw briefly that caused me concern so I just wanted to make mention.

Please dont use dog products on cats, especially for flea/tick/heart worm. Some are very toxic to cats and others, even if safe for cats, can cause severe Nervous system signs if overdosed. It is very, very hard to dose dog products for cats, even of comparable sizes. The dosages and mixtures are actually different for cats. Now it is actually mandatory for all companies to label their dog products with "not for use on cats" even if they were previously safe (well, safer).

I would also be very careful about using ivermectin, especially in mixed breed dogs or dogs with any sort of herding breed. I have an Australian cattle dog that got some horse wormer after the horse spit it out and had severe toxicity. It was horrible. The dose in most heartworm pills from the vet is not enough to cause toxicity in even dogs susceptible to it. The reason horse wormer should not be used in animals smaller than horses is because the dose in that paste is not evenly distributed through out the paste. Therefore, it is extremely difficult to get the correct dose without first emptying the syringe into a bowl and thoroughly mixing the paste up.

I would be careful about buying HW preventatives from suppliers without a yearly (or every two years) negative HW test. Giving some products with an active infection can be fatal, and if the dog develops heart worms while on a product, the company will cover the treatment 100% IF that dog has a neg test from within the year. Dogs should also be tested before switching products for that very same reason.

I don't believe it is necessary to give cats HW preventatives. While they can still get HW disease, they generally carry a significantly reduced worm load than dogs do, and so they rarely develop clinical disease. If you are using Advantage, that should cover HW, fleas, and roundworms though.

As for vaccinations, I think they all have their merits. I briefly researched the claim that lepto vaccine can cause lepto and found evidence to support what I originally thought. The vaccine does not cause disease. In fact, none of the commonly administered vaccines can cause the disease in animals, though certain older vaccines (like lymes for example) used to cause positive test results on the SNAP test. Now they have developed marker vaccines which do not cause a reaction on the screening test. Any dog that has access to water or urine of wild animals (basically any dog that spends time in woods or likes puddles) is at risk for lepto. It is a terrible disease, with zoonotic potential (and can cause serious issues in other farm animals, like horses and pigs...this disease causes moon blindness and renal failure in horses!). The kennel cough complex is so easily preventable through vaccines, that I recommend it to anyone that exposes their dogs to other dogs. The vaccine can now be given orally (GREAT and more effective option) and can be bought for a few bucks at tractor supply. The antibiotics to treat bacterial kennel cough are still more expensive than the vaccine. Distemper is also considered a core vaccine, and it is another that is more common than people think and entirely preventable. It can be devastating in animals that contract it.

in addition you can give an asparine to a dog but that same asparine will kill a cat.... I dont do either but have read up on it.

I have always kept a first aid kit for all the animals and each one I have acquired I make note of the differences.

deb

 

[Tikkijane]

 Interesting education I am getting here....  i have had dogs 59 years...  all my life...  still learn something new every day...  same goes for horses.

I live in a low heart worm area...  but I certainly would be using those meds if I were.  Very dry here very few mosquitos...  Matter of fact I havent had a mosquito bite in about 25 years now.

And a strange occurance once I moved up to the high desert I havent seen a flea on my dogs or cats.   And San Diego is known to be one of the flea capitals of the world.

No dogs and cats now.  This will be my first year in a very long time without a dog.  Cant get one again till I move home.

deb

We didn't have fleas *at all* in the desert, but we did have some mosquitos. That's the only thing I miss about the desert....

 

[Tikkijane]

I had a rescued greyhound and they are sensitive to barbituates...  Like deadly to them.  So when I had him neutered they had to use a different kind of anesthesia.

breed of dog and their sensitivities is very important to know.  We humans bred them this way so we are responsible to be up on what they need.

I use ivermectin paste for the horse and the goats.  oral...  My goats mugged me for their dose after they tasted it.....   I went to a reputable goat site for dosage information AND went to several others to confirm before I dosed my goats.  With horses its pretty forgiving and hard to over dose.  My girl gets TWO whole tubes...  for 2000 lb horse thats just a little over dosed.

Ivermectin is also absorbed through the skin as in the pour on for cattle.  if you cant give it by injection I suspect the pour on would work.    DO not take my speculation as word.... please

We are talking drops not actually pouring a bottle on your animal.  Thats how the heart guard or heart worm drops work.

So... dosage is very very important.  If you dont know go the vet route.

I wouldnt even dose with herbals till I understood their effects, the strength required, and their interactions with anything else.  and if someone just said use X amount in Y manner I would thank them for their info and confirm with at least three others to be certain.

I have seen too much info passed around as being gospel  Not just here but Internet wide.  Be proactive and verify verify verify.

deb

X2. And verify with *reputable* sources. A lot of folks think herbals are fine with all animals, too. Not so. CATS are very sensitive. Some oils that can be used for digs/horses are toxic to cats.