Lethargic, Puffed up Pullet?? HELP *UPDATE FOUND A DEAD PULLET TODAY!*

[snowhorse]

I have a Barred Rock Ameracuana Mix, that is 6 weeks old. I noticed this morning she was looking a little lethargic and sleepy compared to her flock mates.

Her symptoms are, her feathers are puffed up, she is keeping her head close to her body, and just stands around and doesnt scratch or anything. I have seen her eat thought, so Im not sure if Im over reacting early.

We did have a huge temperature change. It was 80 to 90 and extremely humid for 3 days, before that it was somewhat cold in the low 60s at night I think it even got colder, and up to maybe 70 and not very humid during the day. It just dropped again to be like 65 damp and cold. Could the temp change not make them feel great? I have a horse I have to watch when the weather changes quickly because it gets colicy.

Any ideas?

 

[artsyrobin]

how is she today? i'd check her crop, she if it is impacted, squishy or hard etc-hopefully someone can answer soon

 

[chookchick]

Sounds like coccidiosis. Keep a close eye on her and check out her droppings, as well as all the others. There is a "poo chart" on here somewhere that will show you what to look for. I would put her in a crate and keep her warm and quiet until you figure out what is wrong. I used Sulmet, you need to treat the whole flock if it is cocci, but there is another treatment that is supposedly better--I'll look around here.

ETA--Corid is the other medication, but get them on something quickly. Make sure their water stays super clean--no poo!

Here is the poo chart:
http://www.chat.allotment.org.uk/index.php?topic=17568.0

 

[threehorses]

Is she fully feathered yet? If she's not, and even if she was, I'd say that the huge fluctuation in temps could do it. I'd also keep an eye on her for coccidiosis. It doesn't take blood in the poop for it to be cocci- it can just be that her droppings are runny - blood is when it's severe.

I think that the priority will be getting her nourished really well. To help boost her health if she's fighting something, I'd give her some Enfamil PolyViSol (not the iron ones) 2 drops in the beak daily for a week, give her some yogurt, keep her separated with the smallest buddy from the baby-flock so she doesn't get bullied but isn't too lonely by herself. Keep her temperatures steady for a while. (The polyvisol I found at Walmart, vitamin section.)

I'd also buy some Corid and keep it handy in case you need it. Are you feeding medicated feeds? Could you also answer the questions in the second sticky post in this forum, only answer into this thread? By "weight" they mean describe if she feels fat, thin, etc. If they don't have Corid, you can use Sulmet. I'd agree with chookchick's post, too. Also make sure their bedding is fluffy and dry always.

You can also try feeding her and her buddy some boiled or scrambled egg, cut up fine. The extra nutrition might help her if she's fighting something. If she's feeling bad, she won't eat as much as normal - so you have to encourage her however you can.

 

[snowhorse]

She is still looking dreary today. I put her on the side with my younger chicks, where she has access to a heat lamp if need be.

Im going to treat them all for cocci as a precaution anyways, as I have a flock of 22 and range of ages from 2 weeks to 6 weeks. I'm looking where to find Corid and am having trouble so I may start with Sulmet if I cant' find it today.

I have not had them on medicated. I thought they were, but read the bag more closley and realized they gave me non medicated.

Her croup looks fine to me, not enlarged or anything.

And her weight seems kind of small to me, thin. I have seen her peck at some of the food, but not much. And she is fully feathered.

I can't find any bloody poo like listed on that website, some poops may look like they have a little red but nothing crazy. There bedding is changed once a week with more fluffy new pine shavings, and I have 3 groups separated so it stays clean and dry. And I change the water daily, sometimes twice a day.

So I guess I will try the Sulmet for now, and try to find the vitamins and try the hardboiled egg as well. I will keep you all posted. And Thanks a bunch for the help!

 

[threehorses]

I would start with Sulmet today - that way if it's one of the respiratory problems, maybe it will pick that up, too. I'd look carefully for any signs of lower respiratory issues - any funny breathing, any tail bobbing.

Is she eating? You have to actually see her eat to make sure in case her crop is slow and just not emptying well. Her crop could feel fine even if she hasn't eaten in 2 days.

And bloody droppings AREN'T the only sign of coccidiosis. That's only when it's so severe that it's caused the cecum to bleed. That's the last symptom you see before they die. So don't wait til that sign to treat. If you're seeing diarrhea and these symptoms, consider it.

Please let us know how she's doing, and thank you for this update. I wish we were psychic and could tell you exactly what she has. /sigh Sometimes it's so frustrating not being able to say "oh I know this is exactly this!".

 

[snowhorse]

So it took me awhile but I found some Sulmet and bought it tonight. I dont have anything close to me! The nearest TSC is about an hour and a half away, and I found this at Agway which is still about 12 miles away from where I live and it was the last bottle they had! but luckily I got there right before they closed.

I treated all of my flock. I was trying to integrate my flock, but am holding off until this little pullet is looking better.

I also bought some medicated feed. I mixed it with my remaining regular feed, just so my 2 week old chicks can build up an immunity. They didn't seem to mind the new feed at all. This may not do anything, but it makes me feel better until everyone is older.

I did see her eating and drinking which made me feel good that she is getting the medicine in.

I gave everyone some hardboiled eggs. Funny the little ones really didnt know what to do with it. The middle aged flock didnt either, but my older birds dug right in and had a ball. I didnt see my little pullet making an attempt at the hardboiled eggs, but atleast she had some water and feed.

I will see how everyone fairs in the morning. I checked late tonight and she was under the light with some of the younger birds.

I am going to try and get the vitamin that you mentioned threehorses, as well as the Corid, I called about some and in my area you have to get it from a Vet. Im going to call TSC in NH which is right over the border from me and see if they have it so I can have that on hand next time. Hopefully there wont be a next time! but you never know.

Im new to the forum thing so I dont know if Im responding correctly! Thanks for all your help again. Ill post tomorrow.

 

[threehorses]

Definitely don't integrate until you get this fixed. And phew!! Boy did you have good timing!

The medicated feed might help those 2 weeks olds in case they run into some cocci while the antibiotics are working. If it's amprolium, NOT bmd (bacitracin). And yes you know - I've had chickens for years and years. I'm sure I don't need medicated feeds to be able to cut coccidiosis off. But I sure like the insurance policy, and honestly - it's an coccidiostat - not an antibiotic. After their first 6 weeks, they have the rest of their lives where I can avoid medicines til the last minute.

GOOD on the eating and drinking! I'm glad they liked the eggs. From now on in the treatment, I'd hold them back - don't feed them, try a little cooked oatmeal to sneak the yogurt to them. sometimes proteins can cause cocci to bloom more. But oatmeal will be safer and you can hide yogurt in it to get good bacteria to them. To me the live bacteria in the yogurt are as essential a part of the treatment as the meds are. Honestly - since I caught on to probiotics, and keeping the environment very nice and dry and clean for babies (who tend to spill their water), I haven't had to treat for any coccidiosis in nearly 10 years. I start my babies on weekly probiotics on their second day of eating (I use "Probios" powder from the feedstore or TSC more often than yogurt). I do that weekly for the first 6 weeks, then less often. When they get near 5 months or their combs start to turn red in the girls, I'll use yogurt (because of its added calcium and D3) weekly until they get settled laying well without.

And since you have Sulmet, you won't "need" Corid but honestly I like it better on non-adult birds for coccidiosis. So don't worry about it. Just buy some when you can for your chicken-cabinet.

And you're doing wonderfully in responding, thank you.

 

[snowhorse]

Still was still looking about the same this morning, but it's only been over night.

The Sulmet is for 6 days, so hopefully by day 3 she will start perking up, and I really don't think the weather is helping my cause, we have had terrible fluxations in the weather and its just terrible for all animals, including people!

The medicated feed I picked up has amprolium, which was very helpful information by the way, thank you! Learning something new everyday and I love it.

As far as yogurt, what type do you buy? I would assume, no flavor, organic plain. But any brand you find to be better out of curiosty, my mom buys real Greek yogurt and I have given that to them before, but it's on the more expensive side.

I agree with you on the probiotics, I just didn't know it came into play with chickens. Do you think the Probios would be beneficial at the age they are at now? I love the idea of giving it to them.

And a little off subject, but I noticed you have horses, do you give them probiotics at all? I have a horse on constant steroids, and would love to give his system a boost. He is an old man, 25 now, and his lungs are in not good shape, I have to give him 200mg of Prednisone daily just to keep his asthma stable. I have been looking for something good to give him, didn't know if you had any ideas.

 

[threehorses]

The 'medicated' feed issue - to me that's like a patchwork quilt. I've been learning a piece of that at a time for years and years.

It all makes better sense once you stitch it all together though doesn't it?

And the weather - that's where it gets tricky. It is bad weather for chickens - and when something hits, there's just so many directions you could take: mildew, cocci from the extra moisture, lower respiratory problems that might look like everything else because no obvious upper respiratory signs, etc etc etc. It's frustrating.

On the yogurt, any plain is fine - doesn't even have to be organic. Greek would be fine, too but yeah - that's best for just eating. (I love the stuff!)

And yes - probiotics are even more important to chickens (and horses) because they eat a lot of otherwise indigestible foods. Horses have teeth and a more acidic stomach, but chickens' food spends barely any time in the organ that would be somewhat like an acidic stomach (the proventriculum) and really it's not the main organ of digestion. The gizzard breaks down the cellulose and structure of feeds and then passes the feed on to the bacteria, who do the REAL digesting. They produce enzymes that break down the food so it can cross the gut barrier into the blood stream. Otherwise, they couldn't.

In the class on feeding horses and feed designs (Kentucky Equine Research), I first learned about the importance of bacteria in horses and comparative digestion in other animals. That's when my light bulb went off in my head. Back then, probiotics were not commonly fed - much less to chickens. But around the turn of the century, they WERE fed - but as milk products. THey didn't pasteurize milk then and milk was commonly given in feed, on feed, and sometimes in place of water. So they were really supplementing probiotics then.

Somewhere along the way, when pasteurization started, people forgot about the supplementation of good bacteria they had been giving their birds. Is it any wonder, then, that we have a lot more digestive problems with our birds? Well that and the fact that they're not hen raised, either.

So I just give mine some occassionally, but always start the babies on them to get them really strong.

On your horse - and your chickens - Probios is great stuff! Or since you're talking about a horse, Fastrack also works for both. I routinely used probiotics for my 27 year old horse to help his digestion. Particularly because at that age, much of their digestive tract bears the scars from years and years of worms. They need more help with breaking stuff down, particularly as their teeth usually aren't quite all there. My mare is 22 now and I've started her on probiotics this year - but hers were in her supplement (Microvet - great stuff). But a probiotic for your old man would certainly help him! IT also helps a little against ulcers, etc. Just in case he has any digestive upsets from his diet or the medication - or pain.

Hug that old boy extra today - one from me. I love old horses.