Lethargic, Puffed up Pullet?? HELP *UPDATE FOUND A DEAD PULLET TODAY!*

[threehorses]

Well I'm very glad to hear she's doing better. If you get any of the gatorade, don't mix with the meds. Mix in with the feed to make a damp mash. Otherwise I'd just wait til the day after meds and give them a poultry electrolyte that is balanced for their needs. If it's one that comes with a vitamin, that should be fine. And of course continue the yogurt. It could be either the Sulmet or yogurt is now working.

And the Probios is wonderful. Refrigerate it and it lasts longer.

On the worming, honestly unless you see one, I'd wait til at least 3 months unless you just see light weights (but heavy eating). I myself wait til about 4 months but mine don't spend much of their chick-hood on the ground but on wire or shavings. Mine don't hit old ground until 4 months at least. But they can get worms early. I don't think I'd do it before 2 months of age, more like 3 though I still feel. Again unless they are shown to have some.

At 3 months, the wazine. At 4 months - maybe the wazine, but at 5 months I give ivermectin after they've been on ground a couple of weeks.

 

[rancher hicks]

Quote:
I went to that post and my posts answer really all of those questions. Am I missing something?

Perhaps. It's just that it would be easier to answer questions if they were listed numerically. Then they could be answered numerically.

 

[snowhorse]

Quote:
I did mix just a little gatorade in with their water yesterday. Got your post too late. But I'm thinking I didn't put a lot in so it should be okay and I ordered a poultry electrolyte online that I should get in next week, as well as about 4 books haha. And Im getting a calender and journal today!

She is looking really good today. I think she is going to be just fine. Thanks for your help threehorses. I added you to my buddy list, as I think I may be looking for alternative to hay for my old man. I'll be in contact soon.

Thank you again. You are a wealth of information, and you really are generous to spend the time to help people out, I really can't tell you how much it is appreciated. And knowing there are people out there still willing to help other people, with out getting paid for it these days, just because they want to. I'm new to this forum, but it makes me feel good to find the type of people that are on here, I thought they didn't exist anymore!

 

[threehorses]

Oh did I mention the bill is in the mail? LOL j/k

Yes, there are lots of people on this board apparently who are wonderfully helpful. Such great folks, seriously - I've never seen so many good hearted folks. It's nice, isn't it?

As for my part in the "team BackYardChickens", I'm just glad to be of assistance.

Please do let me know any time you need anything! And I'm very glad to hear that your girl is doing better. Yay!! That's really great news.

Thanks again for letting us know, and I hope to hear from you.

 

[snowhorse]

So the original pullet I treated is looking and acting just fine.

I found one of my Buff Orpingtons dead.

She would have been 7 weeks old today. No signs or symptoms that she was not feeling well. She looked perfectly fine last night around 9pm. My friend let the horses out this morning and said they looked fine at around 7 am today. I came around 1pm and she was dead...in full rigor, legs straight out. I looked her over thoroughly and could find no signs of trauma. The only thing I noticed was a few very small traces of blood in her feathers that looked like they had come from her poop possibly, but it was very very little. Everyone else at that point looked just fine, including the pullet I had started this thread on originally.

I left tonight and my Buff Roo was not looking great, just lethargic, but not puffed up like my other pullet that wasn't feeling good. I gave them some yogurt which he ate, and I gave him 3 drops of PolyViSol.

So Im at a loss. I soaked the bricks that smelled like mold last night in diluted bleach to kill the mold and rinsed them thoroughly and left them out today in the sun to dry, so they didn't go back into the coop until tonight, but he wasn't on the side where the bricks were.

I mixed their old feed with the new medicated feed sometime last week, so if that was it, I would have thought that would have happened sooner than an entire week.

The Sulmet tx ended the day before last, which I did for the full 6 days. And the only thing I did was put some organic poultry waterer treatment in their waterers, to help things like molds not grow on the inside of the waterer.

WHAT AM I DOING WRONG!!! I really am upset about my Buff, I really don't want to lose my Roo, he's already so sweet. Any help would be appreciated!

I answered the questions on this one:


1) What type of bird , age and weight. - Buff Orpington, 7 weeks, weight?

2) What is the behavior, exactly. - One Dead and the other is lethargic, not puffed up, just looks sleepy

3) Is there any bleeding, injury, broken bones or other sign of trauma.- No signs of trauma at all

4) What happened, if anything that you know of, that may have caused the situation.- I explained a little before, plus the history with the other pullet I had treated


5) What has the bird been eating and drinking, if at all.- He did eat some yogurt and I gave him some PolyViSol tonight, 3 drops

6) How does the poop look? Normal? Bloody? Runny? etc.- His poop looked a little runny to me, and ligh brown

7) What has been the treatment you have administered so far? My entire flock had a treatment of Sulmet for 6 days, the last treatment was the day before last

8 ) What is your intent as far as treatment? For example, do you want to treat completely yourself, or do you need help in stabilizing the bird til you can get to a vet? Treat myself, we have few avian specialist, and Im sure I couldn't afford there bills.

9) If you have a picture of the wound or condition, please post it. It may help.- No Pictures, I could take one of him tomorrow, if he is still alive

10) Describe the housing/bedding in use- I have a coop which is around 13x6. There is also a Rabbit hutch in the same building (Not in the coop) Right now it has 3 windows that open, and I leave the door proped open during the day for more ventilation. I use pine shavings on a wood floor. I have 7 chickens in half the coop around 7 to 8 weeks. I have another 7 chickens in the other half of the coop around 5 and 6 weeks, and a smaller brooder with 7 chickens 3 to 4 weeks. Its been around 80 to 90 during the day, drops off from anywhere to low 60s to 70s at night. It has been very rainy and damp, and when the sun is out super hot and humid. Right now I am working on my outdoor coop, so none of them go outside at all. I clean half the shavings once a week, and every 2 weeks change all the shavings (The brooder more often every 3 days or less).

 

[threehorses]

For some reason it's just hitting me about the rabbit hutch. Are there rabbits in it? If so, do the chickens have access to the droppings? (Did I ask this before? I'm sorry if I did.)

One thing is the mildew. If it's possible that the birds got into some mildew, moldy feed, or something similar it could be that while the original fungus is gone from the premises, that there might be still some in their systems. Treating to help reduce fungal issues in their system is about like the aftercare of coccidiosis or any time you use antibiotics: probiotics (with a twist - see below), and particularly for fungal rists - OACV (organic apple cider vinegar). However, if there was at all a risk of fungus/mildewed anything that could be ingested, you'd also want to treat as if there's a minor oil vitamin deficiency (A, D, E) and treat for a light selenium deficiency. For selenium you can use a combination vitamin E and selenium oil capsule for people that has around 400-700 IU of vitamin E and less than 50 MICROgrams of selenium. Micrograms are listed as "ug" not "mg". You'll have to read the label. You cut the end of the capsule with a knife or scissors and put a few drops right into the beak of the bird for an adult. A couple of drops for younger birds. I'd also consider using PolyViSol vitamins 2 drops in the beak daily for a week. These Enfamil baby vitamins should not be iron fortified (there are 2 formulas) and can be found in the vitamin section of grocers. I found mine in Walmart - my grocery store didn't have the non-iron.

This treatment can be useful for any ill bird with any neurological symptoms or any chance of fungus toxins. Vitamin E also has effects against E. coli.

Additionally, do use yogurt or another probiotic daily for a week as you would after any digestive issue or during stress of any kind. Only if you're using a -mycin or -cycline drug, then don't use yogurt - use an acidophilis capsule/tablet or Probios dispersible probiotic powder from the feedstore, or a poultry probiotic like First State Vet sells. All your birds should get this as multiple cases are happening. Same with the vitamins. For flock treatment, you can use the vitamin/mineral supplement made for poultry and then use the polyvisol and vitamin E selenium for any lethargic birds spot treating.

Another thing I'd recommend would be to use the organic apple cider vinegar in their water. If you use vitamins, alternate days. Two days vitamins, one day oacv in the water. 1 teaspoon per gallon of water. Unfiltered has the good bacteria you want in it, and the prebiotics to help feed the probiotics. It also is said to help cleanse the liver (which can sometimes be effected if there is some exposure to the toxins of fungi) and is known to help adjust the pH of the gut to be friendly for GOOD bacteria and unfriendly to pathogens such as bad bacteria and fungus.

So a summary - without other symptoms occuring and with the known mildew in the area:

Treat all birds with vitamins in their water daily for a week.
Spot treat all effected birds with polyvisol and additional vitamin E/selenium for 7 days. Reevaluate with us then.
Treat all birds with probiotics x 7 days. Do every other day for a week thereafter.
Recommended: treat the water every other day with organic apple cider vinegar for 2 weeks. First week: alternate with the vitamins til the 7 day reevaluation period. (You can continue with the enzymes, which do the same thing minus the good bacteria, after the 2 weeks so you can still use it.

I don't think you're doing anything wrong. I think that there's still something going on either yet undetected, or this possible issue still not quite complete. So maybe this will help. And in the mean time, really really look for any symptom you can find at all - anything that doesn't fit the picture.

/hugs

 

[snowhorse]

You have not asked this before:

The rabbit hutch is very close to the chicken coop, and there is a rabbit in there.

If the rabbit kicked about, he could possible throw some of his droppings into the coop.

 

[snowhorse]

Okay some Questions: (Boy do I have alot to do!)

I'm going out shopping tonight for OACV and the Vitamin E/Selenium Capsules.

I just bought some Econo-Lyte for their water:
Ascorbic Acid - 20,000 mg/lb
Cations: % meq/100g
Potassium 44.88 1151
Sodium 4.00 174
Magnesium 0.05 4

Anions: % mEq/100g
Chloride 41.09 1161
Sulfur 0.10 3

Ingredients: Potassium Chloride, Citric Acid, Sodium Chloride, Ascorbic Acid(20,000 mg. per pound), Potassium Sulfate, Magnesium Sulfate and articifcal flavor.

Could I use this as the vitamin/supplement in there water for every other day? Or do you have a recommendation on something else. This is all I have for a vitamin supplement, otherwise I will have to buy one.

As for the enzymes in the water- Do I stop those for the 2 weeks, or continue using them daily, or should I go to every other day?

I just got my container of Probios in the mail today and put it in the fridge. It says 1/4 tsp per bird at the size they are at up to 1/2 tsp. I have free feeders, any suggestions on how to feed this to them, or just measure out enough Probios for each bird and mix it in the feeder? Or should this be going in the water?

And if I use the Probios, should I swap the days I use the Probios and the yogurt or just use one or the other for the first week?

 

[snowhorse]

I looked up different vitamins and there is a ton of them!

McMurray Hatchery has:

Immuno Charge and Avia Charge 2000

I found on another website:
http://www.poultryhealthcare.com/animal-protein-supplement.html

Protozol, C-Promin, Coli Care, Eselcare, MED3EC...etc etc etc

Any suggestions or is what I have okay?

 

[snowhorse]

Okay so

Vitamin E with Selenium having less or equal to 50 ug is very difficult, everything I find has 100 ug. Know where I can get it?

And Organic Apple Cider Vinegar, is also not an easy task... I have regular from the store, is that okay to use until I find some. Would Trader Joe have that maybe?

Found both, making a trip tonight to Trader Joes for vinegar and The Vitamin Shoppe for the Vitamin E w/ Selenium 50 ug

So tonight, I put some Probios in the younger chicks feed, they are not keen on the yogurt yet.

I put yogurt in the older chickens coop, and spot treated my Roo with the PolyViSol.

I put the Enzymes in everyone's waterer tonight.

Tomorrow, I will be better equiped, and hopefully have a few more of my questions answered and go from there. Keep your fingers crossed!