Marans Thread for Posting Pics of Your Eggs, Chicks and Chickens

[Germaine_11.20]

Novice question about the previous roos and who to keep. I agree that #5 looks best but he has black ear tufts. I am under the impression that black ear tufts throw pullets with little to no coppering in the hackles. Is this incorrect?
If it is correct, would you still pick this roo and why?

 

[cpartist]

Novice here too, which is why I appreciate all the help!

His ear tufts (thanks, I didn't know what they were called) do have copper coloring. Here is a close up:

Geebs has commented that he has excessive red, but he has the least amount of body coppering of them all.

Now I'm really confused

.

 

[Germaine_11.20]

Good Job with the pics! I have read that. Also great he has red ear tufts. Next question...Does the degree of red make any difference?

I have seen some with very red (and they seem over red in the breast area too) Then I see dark...

Number 5 Roo seems to have a nice mix. Does that mean he will throw a balanced coppering pullet rather than too much black or too much copper?

 

[millebantam]

Is there any documented proof that breeding an "overly red" rooster to a "too black" hen will "correct" both problems in subsequent offspring? It sounds ok on the surface, but I simply don't buy into the concept that breeding two birds with significant, serious, color faults will somehow miraculously "fix' the offspring by merely cancelling each other out. Conventional wisdom would dictate that breeding forward ANY serious fault would do more to perpetuate further more serious faults, and less "correct" birds. In my experience, it's much easier to just use 2 birds without any serious faults to produce better birds.

I'm not a genetics expert by any means, but I have years of experience selectively breeding and improving exhibition rabbits. Over time I took slightly better than average stock and improved them to a point where the animals consistantly placed in the top of their classes at National events, in very tough competition. I know that chickens and rabbits are different animals, but I would think that successfully breeding and improving a line by selecting for certain traits would apply to either animal.

It's just my opinion, but I don't think that those "overly red" BCM's belong in ANY breeding program where the desired result is BCM coloring that complies with the proposed standard, and I don't use them period. I've been following this thread for the last couple of days and it seems like there has been quite a bit of misinformation posted lately, from well-meaning folks, but is based upon personal opinion rather than fact. For example, someone made a comment about a picture of a rooster and proclaimed that it had "good coloring", when in fact it visibly had way too much yellow in the hackles, a problem that most of us are plagued with. If someone inexperienced, and new to BCM's were to read that, he/she might be inclined to believe that yellow hackles are a good thing. There is always a great amount of good information shared on these forums by some very experienced, dedicated breeders, but it is wise not to believe everything that you read here. If someone out there is consistantly producing better birds by breeding two birds with significant faults, then I'll admit that my line of thinking is short-sighted, and I'm totally wrong in my approach to breeding better stock.

 

[Germaine_11.20]

I am in agreement with that, although some people don't manage to hatch out the great ones and have to work with what they have until they can get better. So, again my question on the ear tufts

Does the degree of red in the ear tufts make any difference?

I have seen some with very red (and they seem over red in the breast area too) Then I see dark...

Number 5 Roo seems to have a nice mix. Does that mean he will throw a balanced coppering pullet rather than too much black or too much copper?

 

[marquisella]

A roach back is humped up, not flat. In the one picture it looks a little humped, but could be the way he is standing, but it caught my eye.

Sue

 

[drom]

Quote:
You know, you might want to put this question above here to Ron Presley and pick his brain a bit on this one and see what his wisdom offers on the subject. As I recall he has some information on this based on his experience in breeding the birds but also on some specific methods the French use to balance color on the hens and roosters. The information on ear tufts and color balance if you are interested in a good read can be found on the MCF BCM variety page here: http://marans-club.perso.neuf.fr/ncuiang.htm#NCUI

"I've been following this thread for the last couple of days and it seems like there has been quite a bit of misinformation posted lately, from well-meaning folks, but is based upon personal opinion rather than fact."

Actually for the last few days we have had the pleasure of hearing from some very experienced Marans breeders and breed club reps posting on the thread and taking the time to answer people's questions and I think doing a great job of it.

But, again this is a Marans picture thread. This is not an official outlet for the MCF, the MCC or MOAC. This is a Marans chat thread for breeders and hobbyists. I highly recommend you join one of those clubs if you haven't already. They all have forum and chat rooms as well and very valuable information.

 

[Germaine_11.20]

cpartist, are you ok with us analyzing your Roos? If not I won't go there. If so then...


Thank you Drom, I had lost that information in my overload of information!

Would you consider the ear tufts on that #5 the correct color or too much black? ETA it has both.

 

[drom]

Quote:
Well, I don't think the MCF means to imply that black ear tufts are a fault or that by themselves they influence color, but they do say that if you have a mature rooster with black ear tufts, solid black breast and shoulders which are not solid red (have black patches in them) that those roosters tend to produce more black hackeled hens. They have some very specific information on that in the BCM variety link.
But most BCM cockerels start out with black tufts. Mine didn't turn reddish until fairly late.

 

[cpartist]

Quote:
Of course, that's why I posted

(but thanks for asking!) I didn't breed them just hatched 'em. This roo decision seems to be a critical one going forward. All analyzing welcome and appreciated. Anyone preffering to give a private critique is welcome to PM me, but I think this analysis is helpful to everyone.

I do have a Blue Copper hen from another breeder to pair the winning roo with. I've posted her and her egg on this thread a few pages back. She's started laying at 20 weeks during cold weather, and has given me 9 dark eggs in 12 days (I think she's a keeper!). I just want to know what I have to work with regarding the BCM's, and if I need to start from scratch I'd rather know that now.

Another question- if the mossy hens tend to lay the darkest egg, as some have indicated, does a hen with little coppering tend to lay a lighter egg?