my time for bad luck on feed as come

[CrazyTalk]

i only buy organic feed and i have never had a problem. i dont like to buy anything that says grain products on it. its too vague. it can have wood shavings in it, and they frequently do. plus all the health problems with gmo feed and the the fact the bees and butterflies are disappearing. i dont want to contribute to that.

There are no health problems with GMO foods, and they have nothing to do with bees and butterflies disappearing.

Bees are disappearing because of Varroa Mites, and the fact that standard wax foundation has cells that are way too large, which increases mite load.

 

[rancher hicks]

Tractor Supply is like every other chain - they're exactly as good as the local store manager is, and they're going to be better in areas that the local manager thinks are important. If hes got chickens, the chicken feed will probably be stored well. If he's a horse guy, the horse supplies will be stored well, and kept rotated, etc.


There's one to the north of me that is fantastic and one to the south that is terrible. On a similar note, the Southern States near me never seems to have anything I want in stock (unless I special order it), while the one 30 minutes away has pretty much everything.

The country max near me runs out of feed and has to order it. I don't have time for that.

i only buy organic feed and i have never had a problem. i dont like to buy anything that says grain products on it. its too vague. it can have wood shavings in it, and they frequently do. plus all the health problems with gmo feed and the the fact the bees and butterflies are disappearing. i dont want to contribute to that.

you could also try making your own formulation and buy grains and lentils and oats in bulk and mix them. there are alot of sources online as well as the grocery store to buy grains from as well.

I would be happy to buy organic but it's twice as much. $22 or more for a 50# bag. I just can't afford that.

 

[speckledhen]

I'm with Tim, can't afford organic feed. Living on a military pension with a disabled veteran husband, we cannot afford organic for ourselves, much less our chickens. They eat organic when they free range because we don't use pesticides for our crops/berries. To me "certified organic" is a crock. My fruits, berries and other crops may not have some government seal of approval but they ARE organic.

The chickens' feed is for supplementing what they get on range. Mostly, I was happy to find the non GMO, non soy because it's a feed for non layers. I cannot get grower feed here that has animal protein in it that is not powdery chick stuff, nor that has animal protein in it, or that isn't way too expensive. The non GMO, non Soy is cheaper than the Broiler Grower feed they have at the co-op. I wanted a feed for adults that was NOT Purina (smells like toxic chemicals to me) and without the calcium for layers so the non layers, including roosters, could eat it. It is the perfect solution for my situation. I'm not on the organic bandwagon, per se. We've had debates about the problems from soy here on BYC for years and I don't even want to go into that. I was merely offering an alternative to those who wanted to find an affordable non GMO feed on the market.

 

[chicbaby]

crazy talk, i guess you havent read the studies about the effects of glyphosate or other poisons on the environment and everyones health. the EU declared a moratorium on these things due to the bees disappearing. all of these suppressed studies and the fact that these things have been silenced is coming out now. do you work for monsanto or any other company like that?

rancher hicks, i dont think that is expensive, we pay 30 for 40 lb bags here and for me, i would rather pay for healthy food than be chronically ill and have to pay exorbitant fees for health care. i also dont want to contribute to the environmental disaster these poisons are causing and the birth defects and cancer and autoimmune disorders these are creating. its not just a decision that affects only me, but affects everyone.

the bottom line, i prefer to feed myself and my animals real food that has life to it. "grain products" or "roughage products" are not real food. they are fillers and have no life. you are paying for leftovers they sweep off the floor. if you read about what glyphosate does to the soil plants and our flora in our gut you will see it prevents us from absorbing the nutrients that are vital for health.

 

[speckledhen]

Quote: I'm not Tim, but that is extremely expensive, IMO. I pay $13 for 50 lb of non GMO, non Soy feed with fish meal. That's less than most folks pay for regular old layer feed. There is no money for what you propose. It's not there. Just not there.

You are going to pay exhorbitant fees for health care no matter what you do-you buying organic and being healthy in today's world is not going to get you any reduced fees. You're going to now pay for everyone else with this new system. I can't take care of the world on a military pension. I grow as much of my own food as I can in summer, healthy food, rather than pay someone else's overpriced fees for it. Beyond that, we survive however we can. The world will have to take care of itself-it need not depend on us to do that.

 

[rancher hicks]

crazy talk, i guess you havent read the studies about the effects of glyphosate or other poisons on the environment and everyones health. the EU declared a moratorium on these things due to the bees disappearing. all of these suppressed studies and the fact that these things have been silenced is coming out now. do you work for monsanto or any other company like that?

rancher hicks, i dont think that is expensive, we pay 30 for 40 lb bags here and for me, i would rather pay for healthy food than be chronically ill and have to pay exorbitant fees for health care. i also dont want to contribute to the environmental disaster these poisons are causing and the birth defects and cancer and autoimmune disorders these are creating. its not just a decision that affects only me, but affects everyone.

the bottom line, i prefer to feed myself and my animals real food that has life to it. "grain products" or "roughage products" are not real food. they are fillers and have no life. you are paying for leftovers they sweep off the floor. if you read about what glyphosate does to the soil plants and our flora in our gut you will see it prevents us from absorbing the nutrients that are vital for health.

I am Tim and I think that if you can afford it then all the more power to you. I'd certainly pay for organic if I could afford to but I can't. Fact is most can't. However the Organic farmers have a lot to do to get prices down.

Yesterday I got three eggs from far to many hens. These are some expensive eggs. All I can say is I'm doing the best I can with what I've got.

Not wanting to open a Pandoras box of debate and being old, we've always had our share of health problems. I doubt that is likely to end.

Finally or all you folks here's a few lines from Fine Gardenings' Grow, issue fall 2014:

When it comes to GMO's , language matters-

For years the media and other have been using the terms "genetically modified" and "genetically engineered" interchangeably, but they are not the same.
And if laws are passed that use the term "genetically modified" too broadly many plants that we grow and depend upon might become unavailable or stigmatized as unsafe.

Genetic modification is a broad term. A GMO (genetically modified organism) is a living thing that has a different DNA - no matter how slight - from it's parent.

In the plant world, genetic modification occurs naturally every day through the cross pollinations of plants.

Crops that are "genetically engineered" are the real source of concern. These varieties completely bypass the mating process and do not occur in nature. DNA is often introduced from a completely unrelated organism, such as a bacterial pesticide. ( resulting in Bt corn) or an herbicide - resistant protein (such as Roundup - ready soybeans).

The scientific term for these "engineered" crops is "transgenic".

What's my point? Don't be fooled by things labeled organic, know the difference between the two.

Those hybrid chickens we have Golden comets and sex links are GMO, but naturally as of course are all hybrid vegetables etc. etc.

So when petitioning those in power about changes in our food, use the right term, even if it means educating them as I am trying to do here. Pick up a copy of the magazine to get the full story.

Chicbaby, if and when prices for Organic feeds some down to where I can afford them then of course I will, but for now I have to eat and live and survive the best I can. I won't go into our financial situation. You'll just have to trust me on that.

I am of course glad that you can, so the organic business keeps moving forward and hopefully the time will come when we can all afford to eat as healthy as possible. Just don't expect all illness to be eradicated.

Peace,

Rancher

 

[Chris09]

i only buy organic feed and i have never had a problem. i dont like to buy anything that says grain products on it. its too vague. it can have wood shavings in it, and they frequently do. plus all the health problems with gmo feed and the the fact the bees and butterflies are disappearing. i dont want to contribute to that.

you could also try making your own formulation and buy grains and lentils and oats in bulk and mix them. there are alot of sources online as well as the grocery store to buy grains from as well.

Give it time and even the people using organic feeds will have problems, I am starting to see it now. People wanting to boost the proteins of there organic feed because production is down or there going through molt. Most organic poultry feeds are 16% protein at best and use little to now animal protein. A 16% is ok if your raising a leghorn type bird but if your raising a large heritage breed like say a Rhode Island Red, it will suffer on a 16% protein. As for animal protein,,, all chicken feed should animal proteins in it and it should be within the first 5 ingredients, any lower than that and it is a cheaply made feed, no animal proteins at all............ well lets just say I wouldn't use it.

As for this part of your post.
Quote:
You really should learn what term mean before your try bashing it and spreading untrue stories...
Wood shavings is not now or ever will be a grain product, So it is not frequently used as a grain product also wood shaving will never be a grain by-product or grain screenings.

 

[Chris09]

Those hybrid chickens we have Golden comets and sex links are GMO, but naturally as of course are all hybrid vegetables etc. etc.

Not just hybrid chickens, ALL chickens.
There are no wild chickens, never have been.
The "chicken" is a man made animal that we bred from at least two types of jungle fowl.

As for vegetables,,, well lets just say that 90% +/- of all vegetables grown today have been genetically modified by man even in non-hybrids, the organic, the heirloom and the "non-GMO".


What a lot of people need to understand is that we have been "genetically modifying" plants (and animals) for thousands of years.

 

[aoxa]

Not just hybrid chickens, ALL chickens.
There are no wild chickens, never have been.
The "chicken" is a man made animal that we bred from at least two types of jungle fowl.

As for vegetables,,, well lets just say that 90% +/- of all vegetables grown today have been genetically modified by man even in non-hybrids, the organic, the heirloom and the "non-GMO".


What a lot of people need to understand is that we have been "genetically modifying" plants (and animals) for thousands of years.

This term drives me batty.

Especially when they refer to living things.

I guess humans are genetically modified too. We choose our mate based on many factors. Even some we don't realize we are choosing our mate for. We breed with those humans with the traits we desire to produce a child that is a mix of both genes.(well unless said offspring is a mistake). If you use the term genetically modified for a broiler or a layer based on chosen genes for a desired effect everything can be given that term.

We aren't splicing genes into these CX birds, nor are we for red sex link hybrids.

I wish people would stop saying that.

 

[CrazyTalk]

crazy talk, i guess you havent read the studies about the effects of glyphosate or other poisons on the environment and everyones health. the EU declared a moratorium on these things due to the bees disappearing. all of these suppressed studies and the fact that these things have been silenced is coming out now. do you work for monsanto or any other company like that?

I have read the studies. I don't think you have.

The studies all regard Neonictonids, not glyphosate. Neonics and glyphosate have nothing to do with each other. It's funny though, the EU banned most of this stuff - and you know what happened to the bees? Colony collapse continued marching on. On the other hand, Australia, uses neonictonids on basically everything - and they have no colony collapse. You know why? Because they don't have Varroa - and they don't have a commercial bee-hive industry that moves bees around all over the place, spreads disease, and forces bees to use fixed comb of an inappropriate size. .

Also, Neonictonids are based on Nicotine, a naturally occuring compound - funny that.

We aren't splicing genes into these CX birds, nor are we for red sex link hybrids.

I wish people would stop saying that.

Unless you can show that a human splicing a gene in using a retrovirus is different from a naturally occurring retrovirus splicing it in on it's own, the distinction is meaningless. Horizontal gene transfer happens all the time in the natural world.