Never had bumblefoot... is this it?

[brettzim]

Thanks in advance for reading this and for any advice offered up. I have a year old pullet (my only double-yolk layer) who came up lame a couple weeks ago. I palpated her leg from foot to hip and could not find any area of tenderness or deformity. I put her in a carrier and gave her vitamins in her water to see if she just tweaked it and needed some time to heal. After two days she was very ancy to get out. All other activities are normal for her but she won't put weight on the leg. I ran it by my goat vet when I was at the clinic and she mentioned bumble foot, something I'd never heard of. I had her contained again to try to let it heal so I pulled her out and checked out the underside of her foot. It seemed more tough and a little bigger than the other side and the top of her foot was black and not her normal grey. I assumed this was from dragging the foot. I could not find any black scab that I heard accompanies bumble foot. I did soak her in epsom salts though and poked around with a knife a little to see if I could find a point of entry for an infection. I didn't see anything that made me feel comfortable in slicing her foot open. So, now I'm sort of stuck.

In summary:
- No noticeable deformity or tenderness in leg
- top of foot is black, not grey (but she has been dragging that leg)
- She pecks at the top of her foot
- Pad of her foot seems tougher and bigger on the injured side
- Injured leg definitely has heat to it
- Otherwise moving around as best she can and eating and drinking normally

My plan is to continue with the epsom salt soaks, get her on electrolytes, truly keep her contained her her carrier and not let her out until this is resolved, spray a topical antibacterial on her that works against staph (GenOne) that my vet is prescribing for me. I called a dozen local stores looking for Tricide-Neo but no one carries it. I may order it just in case the GenOne does not do the trick. I have sulfa, oxytetracycline, tetracycline hydrochloride, terramycin. (I also have Quartermaster penicillin-dihydrostreptomycin for mastitis if that happens to be useful...)

Does this seem likely to be bumble foot?
If so, can they get it on the top of their foot? (as that seems to be where the scales are discolored)
Worth giving oral or injectable antibiotics in addition to the spray?

Here are pictures of her normal foot and the lame one. I sprayed blu-kote on it after her soak but you can still see where the foot is black under the spray.

 

[sanchabird]

I don't think it's bumble foot, but then again I can't see the foot closely. Is there a bumble foot spot on the foot? If you don't know what bumble foot is, look it up and then examine the foot again.

 

[Eggcessive]

Since you have probed it and with the BluKote on it, it's difficult to see bumblefoot. Besides bumblefoot, other diseases that can cause swelling in feet and legs are MS (mycoplasma synoviae,) viral arthritis (tenosynovitis,) and gout, but I believe that gout is bilateral swelling, where the rest can affect one leg more than the other. The swelling in that foot looks more like pictures of MS or arthritis, but without testing by your local Ag agent or state vet, it would be hard to know what it is. I would look for swelling in the hocks and upper legs. Have you had any chicken with respiratory symptoms in the flock? MS can have resp. symptoms or none at all. Here are some links to read: http://www.merckmanuals.com/vet/pou...nfection_in_poultry_infectious_synovitis.html
http://www.thepoultrysite.com/diseaseinfo/164/viral-arthritis

 

[brettzim]

I didn't see any sort of thing that looked like bumblefoot (black scab or those round swollen areas) but I've never had it on my chickens before so I just looked at pictures online and read a few different articles on it. All I can tell is that her foot is hot (infected) and seems swollen. Then again, maybe she hurt her leg somehow and her foot is infected from her dragging it around?

 

[Eggcessive]

This photo from Merckmanuals is mycoplasma synoviae

 

[brettzim]

Hmm... Thanks for that idea. I'll look into that option. I have had a couple deaths here that I was unsure about. One was an old hen (seriously old) that was breathing really ragged and I finally had to pull the plug on her. Another was a young pullet (year old) who I found dying on the perch last week. I don't know what killed her. So, maybe I do have an illness in my flock. Out of 30(ish) hens I've lost three youngsters over the last year for unknown causes (found dead in the coop) and a couple old ones. I also had one rooster who was imbalanced and walking really poorly for about 1-2 months. I had him isolated and tested for Marek's and the test came back negative. All of this could definitely be related though it sounds like.

 

[Eggcessive]

I don't think it would be all that expensive to get a chicken tested. In some states a necropsy can be done from free on a sick bird, but some will charge a small amount. Contacting the state vet in this link http://www.aphis.usda.gov/animal_health/animal_dis_spec/poultry/participants.shtml may get you information on how to go about this testing or necropsy. If you don't test, and want to keep a closed flock, Tylan 50 injections 1 ml given into the breast muscle for 5 days may help symptoms for awhile.

 

[brettzim]

I will have to keep that in mind. I think if I have another loss I will definitely send them in for a necropsy. I actually meant to do it with the last bird but I was one hour away from going out of town for a week when she died so the timing was not good.

Regarding this gal with the lameness. She is still one-legged. I am soaking her 10-15 minutes a day in epsom salts and now giving her penicillin shots (.25 cc 1x a day for 7 days). Now that the blu-kote has worn off here is a better picture of the leg now. She pecks at it often, like it's bugging her. There is no grip sensation in her foot and she just sort of acts like the leg is not there. With the nice weather I have been letting her out of her crate to hop around and she mostly lays in the sun but besides pecking at it and not using the leg she is acting normally. Is it worth taking her into the vet? Or should I let the penicillin run its course and see if that improves her at all. It's probably optimistic that she'll get the use of her leg back but I'm crossing my fingers.

You can see where that black area extends up her leg. That's why I wonder if its not staph... since it seems like it spread upward.

None of this is blu-kote. This is all discolored. Originally I thought it was like that because she'd be off her leg and sort of limping on it/dragging it for a couple days so I figured she just hurt the top of her foot doing that but it seems like now that's she's fully off the leg and on cage-rest it really is the problem area. Not to mention this is where she always pecks.

This is obviously blu-kote still. But the pad of her foot is callused feeling, way harder than her other foot which feels squishy and normal. The hardness is why I wondered about bumblefoot originally. I just cannot find a scab on her foot anywhere. But is it possible the initially wound was on the top of her foot since it's all black?


Thanks

 

[brettzim]

A large portion of that black scab on the top of her foot came off. I was worried that her leg was necrotic at this point but under the scab was a bunch of new skin. There was one small area that was white like a pimple but it didn't seem large enough to be the point of infection. I pulled off as much of the scab as possible (about half of what is showing in the picture above) and doused the wound with penicillin (quartermaster) and bandaged it up. She still has no grip sensation in her toes and does not put any weight on the leg but I am hoping this is a good sign. Any feedback is much appreciated.

 

[Eggcessive]

I'm wondering if that black skin was a mild case of frostbite, and now is sloughing off. Frostbite will turn the feet black, but she could have just had it on the surface. I would finish the course of penicillin only because you started it.