Newbie struggling with flock management

[SnowflakeMama]

Just going to throw it out there, but I would start removing roosters, one at a time, and see what happens. You are right, multiple roosters affect rooster behavior. Roosters are a crap shoot, multiple roosters almost alway make the odds increase of things going wrong.

As for your dominant rooster at 19 weeks of age... nothing is set in stone how he is going to keep acting. You really have to get past the 6 month age, and better yet, 1 year old before you are kind of sure of what your rooster is like. A rooster crowing all the time, can be a sign of aggression, but then sometimes they just crow, but still irritating. If I don't like a rooster, that is reason enough.

And if you have a run, then I would strongly think about getting rid of all the roosters. I always recommend a hen only flock for the first year. Get some experience without dealing with roosters. Personally, I think you get better roosters when they are raised up with older birds, not flock mates. Roosters are easy to find and get, people are always wishing to get rid of really nice roosters that they can't keep. Next year would be a fine time to start with a rooster.

How old are your youngest birds? Because I have had better luck when I get them into the flock very young, between 3-4 weeks. I have a safety zone set up, that they can venture out into the flock, and retreat if the flock becomes too much.

When a bird is eating at one feed station, can he/she see birds at other feed stations? Because that will help. That is why you add clutter, so birds can get out of sight of other birds.

I would recommend, culling all the roosters. I think your enjoyment of the flock will really rise. I can hear a lot of tension and worry in your post, this is less than fun, the way it is set up. Remove the roosters, see how the flock settles. If there is still a lot of discord, cull again. Always solve for peace in the flock, they are a lot more fun to be around.

Mrs K

You make some very good points, and starting culling one by one to see how things evolve makes very good sense. Unfortunately after posting I went out to inspect some of the birds and found the one cockerel has been attacked within the last day or so, he's missing a lot of feathers and he was super sensitive to being touched and held which is unusual for him. He will probably be first to go, he's already having difficulty defending himself with his mucked up feet, I'd rather see a bird go than watch them suffer aggression.

As for the guy who crows non-stop, it's almost like he's yelling at us. If he hears me call the kids (inside the house) he yells back, if we pull in the driveway he starts calling, he crows when my husband goes to work and then when my alarm rings later he gets going again... The coop isn't even near the house! He has incredible hearing and it's seriously ticking me off. I was feeling bad about culling him, but the truth is that since he fought the fox we haven't been letting them free range unless we're out with them anyway, so it's not like we need a rooster at all. You're right that we can always pick up a rooster from someone else in future if we decide we want/need one.

The feeding/drinking stations are not in view of each other, but he always seems to know when someone he doesn't like is trying to feed anyway. I suspect you're right, we will enjoy this a lot more without the worry of any cockerels - and the pullets will too!

The youngest pullets are 9 weeks, they'll be moving out to their mini-coop within the big run tomorrow and they'll have their own separate part of the run for the first while. I'm going to try a suggestion I've seen on other posts, to raise the wire up just enough that the youngest ones can run back under if they need to, but the older birds won't be able to get through.

Thank you for your thoughts, you brought up points that I hadn't considered on my own - much appreciated!

 

[ChickenCanoe]

You've gotten great advice so far but I haven't seemed to be able to find out, what is the problem with the more docile cockerels feet that you mentioned?

When building another housing option, Build it as far as possible from your main coop. That way when you add birds to your flock, you'll then be able to do a proper quarantine.

 

[NatJ]

When building another housing option, Build it as far as possible from your main coop. That way when you add birds to your flock, you'll then be able to do a proper quarantine.

For quarantine, good idea.
But for easy integration, it is more useful to have one directly adjoining, so you can do look-no-touch without having to put something temporary together each time.

Ideal might be to have two adjoining coops and one distant one

 

[Folly's place]

All good advice above, and i agree that three cockerels is a lot this first year, especially.
A bird with 'messed up' feet? As in deformed? Definitely not a breeding prospect! If you want to keep him for other reasons that's fine, but not as a breeder next year.
Temperament and correct structure are both very important when choosing breeding stock, and that's a process that starts this year.
I think you are doing fine too! Flock dynamics are so interesting, and hatchmates will stick together for a long time within a flock. It does take time for everyone to really get along, as they all mature.
Mary

 

[Ridgerunner]

My first rule of integration and just flock management in general is that none get hurt. You've done well on that. Not sure how badly injured that one cockerel is, that may be becoming an issue. As far as I'm concerned, fights and skirmishes are OK as long as there are no injuries. But they can lead to injuries.

Yours are all pretty immature. There can be a big difference in how immature pullets and cockerels behave compared to mature hens and roosters. My pullets tend to start acting like mature hens when they start to lay, has nothing to do with a calendar. There is no set time for a cockerel to start acting mature. I had one do that at 5 months another took until 11 months. Most of my boys manage that around 7 months but it could be any age.

Most of what you describe is pretty typical with my flock. More mature birds outrank less mature birds and often aren't shy about enforcing those pecking order rights, often pecking when their personal space is violated. It doesn't take my younger ones long to start avoiding the older ones as much as they can, day and night. During the day they typically hang separately. At night they generally do not sleep on the same roosts as the older ones.
I don't consider that a crappy life, that's being smart enough to not get beaten up unnecessarily. When they mature enough to join the pecking order, with my pullets about when they start to lay, they become one big happy family. They may still hang with their buddies instead of staying with the older ones all the time, but that's by choice. Until they are ready to merge on their own let them stay apart. How much room you have has a direct effect on how well this works. The more room the better.

What are your goals for those cockerels, that's for you to decide. It doesn't matter what my goals are, it's yours that count. The only reason you need a rooster is if you want fertile eggs. Anything else is personal preference. Nothing wrong with personal preferences, I have a few myself. But that is a choice, not a need. I typically suggest you keep as few boys as you can and still meet your goals. That's not because you are guaranteed more problems with more boys but the more you have the more likely you are to have problems. If room is tight that probability goes way up.

I also like to solve for the peace of the entire flock, not in favor of any one individual. To me that doesn't just mean the boys but usually it is. As they mature personalities can change. They may start fighting out of the blue or start treating the girls differently. When they mature the boys and girls often settle down into a very peaceful flock, but watching cockerels and pullets go through puberty is often not for the faint of heart. And sometimes they don't ever grow up.

Not only does their behavior change as they mature, I strongly agree that the boys influence each other's actions. The dominant one may suppress the actions of less dominant cockerels or roosters. The competition may cause them to act out more than they would without competition. If behavior is one of your criteria (it sure is for me) it's hard to judge behaviors when other boyss are around. Those behaviors can change if one or more of others are removed or as they get older. I don't always get it right.

If you are going to remove any I believe in knowing my goals and start eliminating the ones that don't fit those goals first. If I were going to breed them and one had an obvious physical defect, like bad feet, he would be my first choice. But that is my goals, not necessarily yours. Knowing my goals simplifies it a lot for me. Eliminating could be selling, giving away, eating, separately housing, or maybe something else.

My main suggestions are to stop adding until you get more experience, give them as much room as you can, and be patient. Don't try to force them to get along by crowding them into tiny spaces, let then work that out on their schedule.

Good luck!

 

[SnowflakeMama]

You've gotten great advice so far but I haven't seemed to be able to find out, what is the problem with the more docile cockerels feet that you mentioned?

When building another housing option, Build it as far as possible from your main coop. That way when you add birds to your flock, you'll then be able to do a proper quarantine.

All good advice above, and i agree that three cockerels is a lot this first year, especially.
A bird with 'messed up' feet? As in deformed? Definitely not a breeding prospect! If you want to keep him for other reasons that's fine, but not as a breeder next year.
Temperament and correct structure are both very important when choosing breeding stock, and that's a process that starts this year.
I think you are doing fine too! Flock dynamics are so interesting, and hatchmates will stick together for a long time within a flock. It does take time for everyone to really get along, as they all mature.
Mary

The docile cockerel's feet have curled up toes, the outer (what would be our "baby" toes, I guess) are the worst. I had to build him special ladders and keep modifying until I got them right for him to be able to climb anywhere. He won't jump or fly much because he knows he can't land and grip. I also had to give him really wide roosting boards so he can just keep his feet flat while roosting so he's more stable (and able to defend himself when the nightly roosting tussle begins). I considered culling him months ago, I just didn't have the heart, but now I feel I've done him a disservice anyway. It would be one thing if he could remain our pet and be safe but clearly he's not.

I really do not have plans to ever breed our birds, but who knows... things change, right? I might just be able to convince my DH that I need all those extra coops one day and then all bets are off! In any case, I am going to take good advice and start by removing any birds that don't fit my goals - first of which is just a peaceful, healthy flock. Everything after that is gravy.

 

[SnowflakeMama]

When building another housing option, Build it as far as possible from your main coop. That way when you add birds to your flock, you'll then be able to do a proper quarantine.

For quarantine, good idea.
But for easy integration, it is more useful to have one directly adjoining, so you can do look-no-touch without having to put something temporary together each time.

Ideal might be to have two adjoining coops and one distant one

We're fortunate to have a lot of space handy and were able to quarantine all new additions for a month before even thinking of integration. However, we're all tapped out now, no new spaces left and there's no way I'll convince DH I need another coop/run this year. We do have an old coop that's clear across our property that we could use in future years for quarantine if necessary, it needs a bit of work and it's only good for summer use but everything is doable. That would give us the setup you've suggested - two linked coops and one very distant one.

However, I definitely have no more plans for new birds for at least a year or two! It's time to relax and enjoy what we have.

 

[SnowflakeMama]

Just wanted to say thank you everyone for your thoughtful suggestions, and for the reassurance some of you have given. This has been a joyful experience starting out with chickens but also stressful and worrying at times. It helps to know there's help to be found here!

 

[Chicalina]

could you keep the gammy footed rooster in a small pen near the house with either the other rooster or the mutt hen? It could be the bachelor pad for pet roosters. 2 boys together with no hens in sight are much less likely to fight.

 

[SnowflakeMama]

could you keep the gammy footed rooster in a small pen near the house with either the other rooster or the mutt hen? It could be the bachelor pad for pet roosters. 2 boys together with no hens in sight are much less likely to fight.

We've talked about that, it would take a great deal of convincing for my husband though. Definitely something we'll talk about to determine how feasible it would be!