North? South? East or West?

[Leigti]

Love the idea of south facing coop, it will go well with our passive solar house

We want to attach a run east or westward. What are we we considering in choosing which way to angle the run? Tia.

Where are you located? That will give us a clue. And what is around? Do you have trees, buildings etc.?

 

[Kraxxx]

Where are you located? That will give us a clue. And what is around? Do you have trees, buildings etc.?

Coop will be in a small clearing in aspen forest. House is closest thing around but will be ~200ft to the west of coop area. I thought facing coop south with run angling east would be the best plan, but just curious how you decide!

 

[Ruralhideaway]

I have a weather station so its easy to know what the winds are doing right here. A nearby valley(so I theorize) pushes my winds to be more truly from the south.

But if you visit this link you'll see where your winds are coming from easily.
https://www.wcc.nrcs.usda.gov/ftpref/downloads/climate/windrose/

Here's mine

 

[Howard E]

Good info. When I looked at mine a few years back I was surprised to discover how often our wind blows from the east. It NEVER blows from the east?!? Or so I thought.....then started paying attention, and yest, it does blow from the east quite often.

I know it was blowing yard yesterday......from the southwest and 25 +/- mph all day. But inside the woods house? The one with wide open front facing south? Drafty up front, but dead calm in the back.

Observed another curious thing......it was pressurized. You could hear the air hissing from cracks around the door. Open it and the door would almost knock you down. Try to close it and you had to lean on it. But inside? As long as the door was closed.....dead calm in the back where the roost are.

Anyway, this also might help......on why to face it south in the temperate climates of the northern hemisphere.......

https://www.backyardchickens.com/threads/on-being-high-and-dry.1205839/

 

[aart]

Observed another curious thing......it was pressurized. You could hear the air hissing from cracks around the door. Open it and the door would almost knock you down. Try to close it and you had to lean on it. But inside? As long as the door was closed.....dead calm in the back where the roost are.

Excellent example of the Woods 'air cushion'.

 

[squadleader]

This is an interesting thread. Howard is an expert on chicken structures and their placement, he enjoys research and history, and brings tremendously useful information to this board.

As much as we all respect opinions, the proper placement of a living quarters for chickens, really does have to account with the science of the sun.

An argument for the best exposure of openings, if a site experiences any winter at all, isn't factually based, if the best (not always available though, of course) exposure recommended isn't south.

I built a passive solar house and spent days researching the best possible exposure for the main glass in the house. The perfect exposure is 10 degrees off south, to the east. That's perfect, but perfect isn't necessary in life, so just get as close as you can.

If someone actually studies the issue, like Howard has, you'll realize the sun is an incredibly dynamic, moving force.

In the winter, it's much lower in the southern sky, rising far down in the southeast. This places almost the entire heat load on the south face of any structure during the winter.

If you have any cold winter weather at all, it would be foolish not to harness this warmth for your flock, by placing your major opening to the south. Because of the extreme low angle of the sun, sunlight will flood in sideways from the south, usually bathing the whole interior of your structure, in warm sunlight.

Now here's where the average person misses the boat, they think that happens in the summer too, but it doesn't.

The protest arises, I live in the south, and with a southern exposure, my birds will burn up. Not true at all.

What they fail to realize is, in the summer the sun rises due east, runs almost directly overhead, shedding very little sunshine on the south wall at all, and sets, due west. Almost all the heat load in summer, switches to the east and west walls.

That means the vast majority of sunlight, in even the deep south, in the summertime, is coming into your coop from the east in the morning, straight down at noon, and the west in the afternoon, those are your summer heat loads, not the south wall.

All the great pre-civil war (think no central heat or air) mansions of the deep south used these priniciples. Big triple hug windows facing south, with wide eaves that block the small amount of summer sun, but flood the whole room with sunlight in the winter, when the sun is very low in the southern sky.

As Howard points out, these facts were essential to home builders over a hundred years ago, but forgotten and ignored in the age of central heat and air.

Our coops, which also lack these amenities, will be much more comfortable for our birds if we harness these natural forces.

So even a coop in the deep south benefits from a southern exposure, with the proviso that a large eave on the south side should be extended, perhaps as much as three feet.

However, you'll also benefit from eaves to the east and west, assuming those sides are open, because those are actually the walls that will face the brunt of the sun in the summer, not the south wall.

So as much as we all have an opinion, these are real facts about the sun, not opinions, and anyone struggling with which way to face the openings of a coop, that has a winter, will be well served knowing them.

A southern exposure is going to keep your coop warm in the winter and ironically, cool in the summer.

One other point raised in this thread that's very important, the wind. Unlike the sun, wind is something unique to an area, because of regional influences and local ground features.

Howard and Aart, mention the air cushion effect. If you experience strong winds from the south, by blocking any openings to the north, east, and west, during these events, that will prevent the south wind from creating a draft at the rear of your coop, even if your south wall is open.

The south wind can't come far into your coop because there's no outlet for it on the north, east, or west wall. Instead the wind creates that cushion of still air Howard and Aart mentioned.

So you can see, with proper opening placement, and the ability to close off the other three sides when there's a strong southern wind you want to stifle, a southern exposure deals with wind, and still allows you to harness the tremendous benefits of its warmth in the winter.

Thank you Howard, yet again, for facts, that will truly help those looking for a solution to their coop placement and orientation questions.

I would recommend anyone new, searching for good solid information on starting a flock, to do a search on Howard's posts. They'll all well researched and thought out, and will get you up to speed quickly.

 

[squadleader]

These concepts were driven home to me in an experience as a teenager I've never forgotten. My mother was an interior designer, and was always very interested in architecture, and restored several pre-civil war houses.

It was March, and I was sitting on the patio on the south side of one of those houses, reading a book all morning. It was very pleasant, and warm enough that I was wearing shorts.

She asked me to go get the mail from the mailbox on the front porch, on the north side of the house. When I went around the house, the difference was shocking, it was shady, cold, and there was still left over snow on the steps of the porch.

It went from warm, pleasant, and shorts weather, to shady, and cold enough to preserve snow, in the space of moving from the south side of the house, to the north side.

It was such a difference, that it made a strong impression on me, that I still carry over 40 years later.

Think about that the next time you're trying to decide where to place a patio, that is pleasant nine months or more per year, as opposed to three months.

I've got family that have beautiful river view on the north face of their house, with a big fancy porch, yet they habitually sit on the dinky south facing porch, with no view, because there's that much difference in how pleasant it feels, compared to the porch in the shade, exposed to the north wind.

Think about how much better your birds lives will be, with a southern exposure too.

 

[Ruralhideaway]

Great thread!

My pre existing shed and barn didn't leave me options, but my observations since have really taught me the value of that winter southern sun. Just adding one 2' x 2' window in the coop helped immensely on the rare clear day we have here. After that window went in I was quick to modify the covered run/hoop house I'm adding for winter to edge it into as much of that sun as possible. I've been mulling heat sink arrangements wondering if there's a way to bring that greenhouse heat into the coop itself.

In the summer quick and easy growing sunflowers will help shade where needed. I used them for shade somewhere else last summer and that was really great bang for the buck.

Thanks everyone, eagerly learning.

 

[Noi]

Hope you don't mind me reviving this thread. I need some advice.

I live in central VA, where it gets hot in the summer (mid-90s are common, and high humidity), and I believe only down to about 26F, occasionally, in winter, and just a little snow, which usually melts the next day.

I just had a custom coop made and delivered. My first coop, my first flock (33 birds, 17-22 weeks old now).
It's beautiful and I love it and I'm sure the birds will love it.
6x12' solid coop which will sit in/adjacent to a 18x30ish run.

Designed it with huge windows to face south, and the pop door and human door on the east, vents on the E and W at floor level, and vents under the entire roof.

You can't see it, but the pop door is behind the open human door. Nest boxes will hang inside, under the windows. Windows can be propped open.

Problem is... the original location is a bust. Can't get the ground straight enough - it's a bigger slope than I had remembered (we just bought the house), can't dig nor build a retaining wall, can't afford to bring someone in to do it for us at this point.

So it's going to go at a flatter part of the property - at the top of a hill, close to edge of woods on the south and adjacent to them on the west, open grass area on east (there will be a vegi garden there - yes, it will be fenced) and north.
I believe those trees are mostly deciduous (no pines, etc.) but honestly, I don't know specific names, just moved here a few months ago

Still with me? Great, thank you!
So, location wise, it makes the most sense to place the coop with the long front (windows) facing east, big human door and the pop door on north.
I know the ideal is for them to face south!
But wondering how to make the reality work better for my birds, because the groumd conditions say it should face east....

I can paint the south side a dark color, to absorb the sun which should be coming in through those (winter naked) trees. And it's VA, it doesn't get THAT cold, and not for long, and I only have cold-hardy large fowl birds, on purpose.

And I am sure I can find something to put on the windows, so that when they're open, they're providing some shade and radiating less heat into the coop from the morning sun hitting them.

The trees on the west will provide some nice protection from the summer storms.

And I can always hang nylon on the north side of the run, so that wind doesn't blow in from the north-facing pop door. How close should that run wall be to provide that protection (which, I'm guessing, will only be needed occasionally in winter)?

And your thoughts on the rest of it?

Please tell me it's going to be okay, I'm really bummed about the change of location after I designed the whole thing differently :-(

 

[aart]

Please tell me it's going to be okay, I'm really bummed about the change of location after I designed the whole thing differently :-(

You can't always place a coop in the ideal location on your site,
and geographical location, as well as your sites micro-climate, can have can an affect on the solar gain aspect.
In your climate heat will probably be more of a problem than cold.
Sounds like you have good handle on how to adjust things.
Your idea to block morning sun is good, that the west sun is blocked by trees is excellent.
I wouldn't fret it too much, the front of your coop (or anyone's), does not have to face south.