Oh no!!! Coccidiosis!!!!

[Junibutt]

I just received my order of 3 week old Jubilee Orpingtons and the first thing I found is an abnormal poop. I sent the picture to the breeder and he insists it is intestinal lining being shed due to shipping trauma/stress. All the chicks are slow/sluggish per my assessment but its possible that it may be their behavior since I have never dealt with Orpingtons before. At first they were not eating or drinking anything but now they are. I am giving them Save-A-Chick plus probiotics & organics crumbles. Don't want to start them on Corid unless its definitely Coccidiosis, So please opine!

Here is the poop picture:

 

[kittydoc]

@Junibutt IMO this is coccidiosis. Orps should be active, just like other breeds.

Medicated feed does NOT contain enough Amprolium to kill an actual outbreak of coccidiosis. It is designed to help prevent suspectible young chicks from getting it, but not to treat the full-blown disease. FYI for others--you did not mention it per se.

Please purchase Corid (amprolium) powder for the water and give it as directed for 7 days. I also disposed of their poo/bedding daily for a few days (helps you see if you're making progress, too). Truth be told, I upped the recommended dose by about 20% and also gave it for 10 days. I did NOT want this stuff, and I did not want a relapse.

Interestingly, I also imported my recent coccidiosis from a Jubilee breeder after being totally clean for 3 years...we may have to compare notes. They were 8-12 week old pullets, and did not show symptoms during isolation--only after I put them outside with the rest. The stress probably caused them to break with it. That's typical. Stress often precipitates an outbreak.

Someone else asked if they are always carriers. Pretty much yes. Almost all birds, dogs, and cats carry some coccidia in their GI tract, but as they mature, their immune system keeps actual disease in check. Still, it is important to treat any and all infected/exposed chicks/chickens as quickly as possible. While it can kill, if you treat quickly, it should not. Since most people freak out at the sight of blood, that prompts quick action and is why the death rate is low.

It will be fine--good luck!

 

[JoySiegel]

What is the impact on eggs? Is there a period of time that they should not be eaten after worming?

 

[casportpony]

If they were mine I would get them started on Corid ASAP. Tractor Supply will have it in the powder in the cattle section. The 20% powder dose is 1.5 teaspoons per gallon for 5-7 days, make fresh daily. If you have the 9.6% liquid the dose is 2 teaspoons per gallon for 5-7 days, make fresh daily.

Directions on Corid products sold in the US are for cattle, not chickens, so follow the directions listed in this post for best results.

Corid is a very safe product, so when I have one that's pooping blood like your birds I give them an oral drench in addition to their medicated water.

FDA recommendations:
http://www.accessdata.fda.gov/scripts/animaldrugsatfda/details.cfm?dn=013-149
"Chickens
Indications: For the treatment of coccidiosis.
Amount: Administer at the 0.012 percent level in drinking water as soon as coccidiosis is diagnosed and continue for 3 to 5 days (in severe outbreaks, give amprolium at the 0.024 percent level); continue with 0.006 percent amprolium-medicated water for an additional 1 to 2 weeks."

And this link has these instructions:
http://www.drugs.com/vet/amprol-9-6-solution-can.html
"Poultry - as Soon As Caecal Coccidiosis Is Diagnosed, Give 0.024% Amprolium In The Drinking Water For 5 To 7 Days. Continue The Treatment With 0.006% Amprolium Medicated Water For An Additional One To Two Weeks. No Other Source Of Drinking Water Should Be Available To The Birds During This Time."

Per US gallon doses are:
The severe outbreak dose (0.024%) for Corid Powder is 1.5 teaspoons
The severe outbreak dose (0.024%) for Corid liquid is 2 teaspoon.

The moderate outbreak dose (0.012%) for Corid Powder is 3/4 teaspoon.
The moderate outbreak dose (0.012%) for Corid liquid is 1 teaspoon.

The 0.006% for Corid Powder is 1/3 teaspoon.
The 0.006% for Corid liquid is 1/2 teaspoon.

More Corid info, including the way I came up with the dosing here:
https://www.backyardchickens.com/t/818879/updated-corid-and-amprol-amprolium-dosing

That info also in this spoiler.
Due to some confusion on dose amounts regarding the powder, I decided to do some research and this is what I have so far. For those of you that use powder Corid, if you have been using 1/2 teaspoon per gallon (~270mg) you haven't been using enough.

The preventative dose (.006%) for Corid Powder is 1/3 teaspoon.
The preventative dose (.006%) for Corid liquid is 1/2 teaspoon.

The moderate outbreak dose (.012%) for Corid Powder is 3/4 teaspoon.
The moderate outbreak dose (.012%) for Corid liquid is 1 teaspoon.

The severe outbreak dose (.024%) for Corid Powder is 1.5 teaspoons
The severe outbreak dose (.024%) for Corid liquid is 2 teaspoon.

Corid mixing instructions for preventative (.006%) and moderate (.012%) outbreak dosing.
http://www.corid.com/SiteCollectionDocuments/CORID Slim Jim-All.pdf

Amprol 20% powder:
http://www.asp-inc.com/products/documents/prodinfo/a/amp128.pdf

Amprol 9.6% liquid:
http://www.asp-inc.com/products/documents/prodinfo/a/amp96.pdf

FDA recommendations:
http://www.accessdata.fda.gov/scripts/animaldrugsatfda/details.cfm?dn=013-149
"Chickens
Indications: For the treatment of coccidiosis.
Amount: Administer at the 0.012 percent level in drinking water as soon as coccidiosis is diagnosed and continue for 3 to 5 days (in severe outbreaks, give amprolium at the 0.024 percent level); continue with 0.006 percent amprolium-medicated water for an additional 1 to 2 weeks."

And this link has these instructions:
http://www.drugs.com/vet/amprol-9-6-solution-can.html
"Poultry - as Soon As Caecal Coccidiosis Is Diagnosed, Give 0.024% Amprolium In The Drinking Water For 5 To 7 Days. Continue The Treatment With 0.006% Amprolium Medicated Water For An Additional One To Two Weeks. No Other Source Of Drinking Water Should Be Available To The Birds During This Time."

Here's the math, let me know if I made an error.

• There are 200mg of amprolium in every 1 gram of powder.
• 1 ounce = 3.5 tablespoons = 28.35 grams
• 200mg x 28.35 = 5670mg in 3.5 tablespoons of powder.
• There are 10.5 teaspoons in 3.5 tablespoons
• There are 21 1/2 teaspoons in 10.5 teaspoons
• 5670mg divided by 21 1/2 teaspoons = ~270mg per 1/2 teaspoon
• There are two 1/4 teaspoons per 1/2 teaspoon
• 270 mg divided by 2 = 135mg per 1/4 teaspoon

Amount of Amprolium (Corid or Amprol) powder per 1/4 teaspoon
​

• One 1/4 teaspoon = 135 mg
• 1/2 teaspoon = 270 mg
• 3/4 teaspoon =405 mg
• 1 teaspoon = 540 mg
• 1 & 1/4 teaspoons = 675 mg
• 1 & 1/2 teaspoons = 810 mg
• 1 & 3/4 teaspoons = 945 mg
• 2 teaspoons= 1080 mg

Amount of Amprolium (Corid or Amprol) liquid per 1/4 teaspoon
​

• One 1/4 teaspoon = 120 mg
• 1/2 teaspoon = 240 mg
• 3/4 teaspoons = 360 mg
• 1 teaspoon = 480 mg
• 1 & 1/4 teaspoons = 600 mg
• 1 & 1/2 teaspoons = 720 mg
• 1 & 3/4 teaspoons = 840
• 2 teaspoons = 960 mg

There are 4.92892ml/teaspoon, but the numbers above were calculated using 5ml/teaspoon

​

Here is what's in 1-10ml of the liquid

• 1ml = 96mg
• 2ml = 192mg
• 3ml = 288mg
• 4ml = 384mg
• 5ml = 480mg
• 6ml = 576mg
• 7ml = 672mg
• 8ml = 768mg
• 9ml = 864mg
• 10ml = 960mg

Bottom line, 1 teaspoon (540mg) of powder is equal to 5.625ml of liquid and 1/2 teaspoon powder (270mg) is equal to 2.8125ml liquid.

1/2 teaspoon of 20% powder = 2.8125ml of 9.6% liquid - Both have 270mg of amprolium.
3/4 teaspoon of 20% powder = 4.21875ml of 9.6% liquid - Both have 405mg of amprolium.
1 teaspoon of 20% powder = 5.625ml of 9.6% liquid - Both have 540mg of amprolium.
1.5 teaspoons of 20% powder =8.4375ml of 9.6% liquid - Both have 810mg of amprolium.
1.75 teaspoons of 20% powder = 9.84375ml of 9.6% liquid - Both have 945mg of amprolium.
2 teaspoons of 20% powder = 11.25ml of 9.6% liquid - Both have 1080mg of amprolium.



And if that doesn't convince people, here is another way I did it:

From:
http://www.asp-inc.com/products/documents/prodinfo/a/amp128.pdf:

Dosage Level Mixing Directions
0.024% Dissolve 8 ounces of AMPROL 128 20% Soluble Powder in about five gallons of water in a 50-gallon medication barrel. Stir, then add water to the 50 gallon mark. Stir thoroughly.
0.012% Follow same directions as above but use 4 ounces of AMPROL 128 20% Soluble Powder.
0.006% Follow same directions as above but use 2 ounces of AMPROL 128 20% Soluble Powder.

Facts

• One pack = 10 oz. (283.5 grams)
• One ounce = 28.35 grams
• One ounce of powder = ~3.5 tablespoons
• 200mg amprolium per 1 gram

My twisted math for the .024% level
If 8 ounces (28.35g x 8 = 226.8 grams) are needed for 50 gallons, then 1/50 of that is needed for 1 gallon, right? So that would be 226.8 grams divided by 50 = 4.536 grams per gallon. (doing this as I type, so correct me if I'm wrong, please!)

So how much does a teaspoon of Corid or Amprol powder weigh? Anyone know? Well, time to break out my gram scale and do some weighing... also have a call into the mfg of Corid and I'm expecting a call back from them.

Just got a call back from them and it is 4.536 grams per gallon. He also said that it's a very safe product and the risk of overdosing is very slim.

-Kathy


Disclaimer:
In the past I have treated my chicken chicks with 2 teaspoons of the liquid for 5-7 days, that's it, but I *might* try the .006% follow up the next time I have to treat chicks.


-Kathy

 

[casportpony]

Oops, sorry, didn't notice that that was an old thread! @Junibutt , did your chicks recover?

-Kathy

 

[Junibutt]

Oops, sorry, didn't notice that that was an old thread! @Junibutt , did your chicks recover?

-Kathy

@casportpony Yes and No. I decided not to treat them at that time because I did not see any more poops like that. However the birds remained a little sluggish, I gave them Sav-A-Chick electrolytes for a week and they started doing a little better. It was strange that they did not show any vigor or energy when left alone, but as soon as I would put a hand in their brooder for any reason, they seemed like full of electricity and jump up and down like crazy.

Anyways, I had to leave for New York for 2 weeks and left them with a friend. Came back August 28th, happy they would be doing good, however the day I was going to be pick them up, my friend noticed a similar poop. So we finally started them on liquid Corid on August 29th. 2tsp per gallon. Yesterday was Day#8, so they received that dose for 7.5 days. I have them on 1/2 tsp dose now and will continue it for 2 weeks. I still saw some intestinal lining like poops today but mostly solid clean poops. So don't know if that was blood or intestinal lining. I don't know what to do at this point since they have had Corid for 7.5 days already, is there something else they might have that may be causing this poop?

Weight wise, some are thriving but others not. so I decided to cull some today. Gave a pair to the friend who took care of them (she claims she knows there is one pullet) and gave 2 with the lowest weight (330 g compared to 510 g the highest one has) to the garbage collectors who were showing some interest. I made sure they went home with some Corid.

All of the remaining 7 were eating like crazy today all day long. but in the evening I still found a poop with slight piece of purple/red in it. Again I don't know whether its intestinal lining or blood. Where do I go from here?

Shall I increase the dose back to 2 tsp for 3 more days? Is it safe?
They are 7.5 weeks old. All except one weighs 500 g or more, is the weight fine for Orpingtons of this age?
I have put them out in a small coop as of yesterday, hoping fresh air may help, also being exposed to other living objects may eliminate their skittish behavior. I have added the 3 x 7 weeks old Barnies in the same coop. (Barnies were treated concurrently with Corid) so that they may instill some better behavior in them as well. Since they are about 15 feet from my main coop, risk of exposing the rest of my flock (all more than 19 weeks old) is high, so I have started them on 1/2 tsp Corid for 2 weeks as of today. How long after stopping Corid shall I not use their eggs?
Any other measures, please suggest because I really am clueless at this point.

 

[Purpletie3]

Hi~
I just had 3 little chicks shipped to me. I got them Wednesday. (3 died en route) One of them dropped a bloody poop today. They are all active and alert at this point. From what I can tell ...maybe around 2+ weeks of age. Should I go ahead and treat for Coccidiosis as a preventative measure?

Any help is appreciated.

 

[mp5girl]

I would if you see more than one bloody poo. I don't believe that there are any negative side effects of corrid so even if they don't have it, you should be ok!

Good luck!

 

[cafarmgirl]

Hi~
I just had 3 little chicks shipped to me. I got them Wednesday. (3 died en route) One of them dropped a bloody poop today. They are all active and alert at this point. From what I can tell ...maybe around 2+ weeks of age. Should I go ahead and treat for Coccidiosis as a preventative measure?

Any help is appreciated.

If you are seeing bloody poop then I would not consider treatment to be preventative at this point. If you wait to treat until symptoms worsen then you are far less likely to save them. They can only withstand so much damage from the overgrowth of the cocci protozoa. It never, ever does any harm to treat with Corid if by some chance chicks do not have coccidiosis. But if they do have it and you don't treat or don't treat soon enough... birds will be lost.

 

[Purpletie3]

If you are seeing bloody poop then I would not consider treatment to be preventative at this point. If you wait to treat until symptoms worsen then you are far less likely to save them. They can only withstand so much damage from the overgrowth of the cocci protozoa. It never, ever does any harm to treat with Corid if by some chance chicks do not have coccidiosis. But if they do have it and you don't treat or don't treat soon enough... birds will be lost.

I just got back from TSC. I got a pack of CORID 20% soluble powder for bovine. I have 3 chicks probably 2 weeks old to treat then because they are all together and eating each others poo.