Old Fashioned Broody Hen Hatch A Long and Informational Thread

[Sydney Acres]

Greetings

This is a very lengthy thread and I've waded through considerable amounts of information!!
I'm searching for specific info and my search terms for this thread are not yielding the answers I'm looking for--may I trouble you folks with some questions?

Disclaimer: I do not currently have chickens but am gathering information and learning as much as possible before taking the leap....please, please feel free to offer any additional advice that will assist me

I would like to have hen raised chicks and am considering game hens as broody's (probably only 3-4 hens). I need someone to walk me through the setting/hatching scenario with multiple hens, specifically game hens if you can speak from personal experience. My concerns are centered around aggressive behavior against chicks. I have plenty of time to design a coop and intend to have an area that can be enclosed and then sectioned into smaller "nurseries" for the sitting and hatching. My hope is that within a couple of days of hatching I could release the hens and their chicks back into the flock without any chick killing happening. I do have a large coop/pen and permanent "paddock" planned (15'x15' and 50'x85' respectively) with additional ranging areas available and will not be hatching more than what is required by my family's table so overcrowding shouldn't be an issue.

edit to add that I'm considering game hens for what I've read is considerable broodiness and their exceptional mothering and foraging skill. If there a different breed that can offer said qualities please let me know.

Does this sound like a logical set up?
Thoughts, advice, opinions, experiences...bring it!

Thanks,
M

I will start with a disclaimer that I do not have game hens, and do not know anyone with game hens, but agree that their reputation is aggressive compared to other breeds, both towards their chicks and each other.

The main breeds that I think of when I think of broody hens are Silkies, Cochins, and Dorkings, although I'm sure many other breeds would also fit the bill. The reason I think of these three breeds is not their parenting skills or their willingness to maintain a brood once they enter it, both of which are quite good, but I think of these breeds because of their reliability at entering a brood. For people who like to incubate instead or brood, some would say their annoying frequency at entering a brood, as it can be difficult to get high volumes of eggs from them when they're brooding more often then laying.

If I were setting things up as you are, which I think is really well organized and I'm quite envious at your forethought, I would not be concerned about exceptional mothering skills, as almost all good broodies have exceptional mothering skills, and would fight to the death to protect their chicks. Obviously, if there is a breed that has a reputation of poor mothering skills, I would cross that off my list, but for most broodies exceptional mothering skills is a given. It's something that all breeders of heritage breeds say about their chosen breed, because natural reproduction is an important part of being "heritage."

I would, however, be concerned about excessive aggression, not just towards chicks but around chicks. A hen that is out with her chicks in the main flock needs to protect her chicks from actual danger, but should not be starting fights because she is naturally aggressive. Small chicks can easily be trampled and killed or injured by fighting adults and bystanders who are fleeing the fight, so a mother who can maintain a protective presence without actually coming to blows will keep the chicks safer than one that attacks when it's not necessary. Also, chicks learn from their mother, so a calm breed mothered by an aggressive breed may not turn out as calm as they should. Personally, I would not consider a broody that has an increased risk of killing a chick, regardless of what steps I might be able to take to control the situation. If the purpose of having a broody is to raise chicks, what good does it do to hatch them if they're going to be killed before they can reach adulthood? "Exceptional mothering" is useless if the mothers only protect the chicks from others, but then kill the chicks themselves, or create unsafe situations that cause the chicks to be killed by others.

Depending on how you set things up, foraging skills may or may not be extremely important. If you only have 3-4 birds that will be brooding 2-3 clutches a year, then foraging skills might not be that big an issue. It's not that many birds. They just need to be good enough at foraging to teach their chicks, but not necessarily good enough to decrease your feed bill, since there's so few of them and they're your "specialized employees." They don't necessarily need to meet all the survivability requirements of your general flock, as long as they're not at increased risk of predation or lack vigor. (Kind of like a priest or a doctor in the Army -- they're just there to do a specific job, not to carry weapons and fight, so they don't need extensive combat training like the other soldiers.)

If I were approaching this broody issue, I would go in one of two directions -- either get a breed that is frequently, annoyingly broody to do a very specific job within the flock and not worry about its other skills, or I would get a breed that I really like in general and search out a particularly broody strain. (There can be quite a difference between lines and between individuals within the same breed. I have seven Barnevelder hens from the same line. Five have never gone broody. One goes broody like an average broody hen, but will maintain the brood for months if nothing hatches and I don't break her brood. One goes broody with such a deep trance that she has to be tube fed daily or she will die of dehydration before she starves to death, and does not come out of the trance at all unless I rub ice cubes on her cheeks, which I need to do to get her to stand up and poop, as no amount of harassment, including tube feeding, will wake her up. She will maintain that depth of brood for months if I didn't break her brood -- she is actually the reason I've gotten so efficient at breaking broods, as she is quite stubborn, and goes broody quite frequently.)

Or you could get Dorkings, which have all the qualities that you're looking for, but I may be a bit nearsighted about my favorite breed!

Additional disclaimer: For those of you that love gamehens, I'm not trying to discredit them. I don't know anything about them, so can't say whether they're wonderful or horrible for this purpose. I'm just trying to draw a logical conclusion from the information given to me. I apologize ahead of time if I offended anyone, as that was not my intent.

 

[bumpercarr]

I will start with a disclaimer that I do not have game hens, and do not know anyone with game hens, but agree that their reputation is aggressive compared to other breeds, both towards their chicks and each other.

The main breeds that I think of when I think of broody hens are Silkies, Cochins, and Dorkings, although I'm sure many other breeds would also fit the bill. The reason I think of these three breeds is not their parenting skills or their willingness to maintain a brood once they enter it, both of which are quite good, but I think of these breeds because of their reliability at entering a brood. For people who like to incubate instead or brood, some would say their annoying frequency at entering a brood, as it can be difficult to get high volumes of eggs from them when they're brooding more often then laying.

If I were setting things up as you are, which I think is really well organized and I'm quite envious at your forethought, I would not be concerned about exceptional mothering skills, as almost all good broodies have exceptional mothering skills, and would fight to the death to protect their chicks. Obviously, if there is a breed that has a reputation of poor mothering skills, I would cross that off my list, but for most broodies exceptional mothering skills is a given. It's something that all breeders of heritage breeds say about their chosen breed, because natural reproduction is an important part of being "heritage."

I would, however, be concerned about excessive aggression, not just towards chicks but around chicks. A hen that is out with her chicks in the main flock needs to protect her chicks from actual danger, but should not be starting fights because she is naturally aggressive. Small chicks can easily be trampled and killed or injured by fighting adults and bystanders who are fleeing the fight, so a mother who can maintain a protective presence without actually coming to blows will keep the chicks safer than one that attacks when it's not necessary. Also, chicks learn from their mother, so a calm breed mothered by an aggressive breed may not turn out as calm as they should. Personally, I would not consider a broody that has an increased risk of killing a chick, regardless of what steps I might be able to take to control the situation. If the purpose of having a broody is to raise chicks, what good does it do to hatch them if they're going to be killed before they can reach adulthood? "Exceptional mothering" is useless if the mothers only protect the chicks from others, but then kill the chicks themselves, or create unsafe situations that cause the chicks to be killed by others.

Depending on how you set things up, foraging skills may or may not be extremely important. If you only have 3-4 birds that will be brooding 2-3 clutches a year, then foraging skills might not be that big an issue. It's not that many birds. They just need to be good enough at foraging to teach their chicks, but not necessarily good enough to decrease your feed bill, since there's so few of them and they're your "specialized employees." They don't necessarily need to meet all the survivability requirements of your general flock, as long as they're not at increased risk of predation or lack vigor. (Kind of like a priest or a doctor in the Army -- they're just there to do a specific job, not to carry weapons and fight, so they don't need extensive combat training like the other soldiers.)

If I were approaching this broody issue, I would go in one of two directions -- either get a breed that is frequently, annoyingly broody to do a very specific job within the flock and not worry about its other skills, or I would get a breed that I really like in general and search out a particularly broody strain. (There can be quite a difference between lines and between individuals within the same breed. I have seven Barnevelder hens from the same line. Five have never gone broody. One goes broody like an average broody hen, but will maintain the brood for months if nothing hatches and I don't break her brood. One goes broody with such a deep trance that she has to be tube fed daily or she will die of dehydration before she starves to death, and does not come out of the trance at all unless I rub ice cubes on her cheeks, which I need to do to get her to stand up and poop, as no amount of harassment, including tube feeding, will wake her up. She will maintain that depth of brood for months if I didn't break her brood -- she is actually the reason I've gotten so efficient at breaking broods, as she is quite stubborn, and goes broody quite frequently.)

Or you could get Dorkings, which have all the qualities that you're looking for, but I may be a bit nearsighted about my favorite breed!

Additional disclaimer: For those of you that love gamehens, I'm not trying to discredit them. I don't know anything about them, so can't say whether they're wonderful or horrible for this purpose. I'm just trying to draw a logical conclusion from the information given to me. I apologize ahead of time if I offended anyone, as that was not my intent.

x2. I know two owners with game hens. One owner has no problems at all with her game hens, the other has hens fighting like roosters. I sort of ignore the second, hers come from fighting stock and were originally used to get fighting cocks until it was outlawed here a few years ago. Soooooooooo, if you do go with game hens, make sure that they come from good stock. If you get a chance, go and see their set up and how the hens act with each other (this is a good indication of how any chicks from there will act). If they are aggressive, I'd move on to another breeder or another breed. The second owner keeps hers completely free ranging, mainly because they would probably kill each other in a normal coop. The first owner has a normal coop set up and her hens are very passive. I really don't think it is the environment that determines these two very different attitudes, I believe it is in the breeding.

For my money, silkies are the best. You might be able to find a mix somewhere that doesn't look so funny if you don't like the looks. Mine looks like a regular barred rock until you see the feathered feet and the number of toes.

 

[southernmomma]

I personally let the hens integrate the chicks when they are ready to do so. Most of the time, it is about 3 days. If you set all of your eggs at the same time under the broody, with really good luck they will all hatch within 24 hours of each other. The broody hen will usually sit tight until the last viable egg hatches (she seems to be able to tell when that is). I usually put food and water in close proximity to her nest, the rest of the flock has separate food and water (although they usually also help themselves to the food and water I put out for the broody). After a few days, the broody will take the chicks out of the nest. They stay very close to her and she generally stays away from the rest of the hens. Whenever another hen comes near, she will puff up like a turkey and growl at the offender. The chicks will hide behind her wings while she is scaring off the others. As they grow older and more able to regulate their own temperature, the chicks will wander further and further from the mother. If they interfere in the pecking order of the flock, they will usually get a little peck aimed at them, I've never seen any blood drawn or any serious injuries. One day, the mother decided that they are big enough and then won't let them hang with her anymore.

So, in answer to your questions, no, hens will not attack or act aggressively towards another hens chicks. If they do, the mother will protect them. If it continues, I'd recommend the offending hen for the stew pot.

The mother will determine how and when to integrate the chicks, provided you leave her with the flock.

Game hens are a sensible breed for broodies, as are silkies and silkie mixes. I would choose whichever fits your plan the best and try to get some stock from a breeder rather than a hatchery. Some hatchery birds do not have the broody instinct, even if their breed tends to be broody.

A most excellent response!! Thank you for the detail, your time and patience

M

 

[southernmomma]

I would, however, be concerned about excessive aggression, not just towards chicks but around chicks. A hen that is out with her chicks in the main flock needs to protect her chicks from actual danger, but should not be starting fights because she is naturally aggressive. Small chicks can easily be trampled and killed or injured by fighting adults and bystanders who are fleeing the fight, so a mother who can maintain a protective presence without actually coming to blows will keep the chicks safer than one that attacks when it's not necessary. Also, chicks learn from their mother, so a calm breed mothered by an aggressive breed may not turn out as calm as they should. Personally, I would not consider a broody that has an increased risk of killing a chick, regardless of what steps I might be able to take to control the situation. If the purpose of having a broody is to raise chicks, what good does it do to hatch them if they're going to be killed before they can reach adulthood? "Exceptional mothering" is useless if the mothers only protect the chicks from others, but then kill the chicks themselves, or create unsafe situations that cause the chicks to be killed by others.

Depending on how you set things up, foraging skills may or may not be extremely important. If you only have 3-4 birds that will be brooding 2-3 clutches a year, then foraging skills might not be that big an issue. It's not that many birds. They just need to be good enough at foraging to teach their chicks, but not necessarily good enough to decrease your feed bill, since there's so few of them and they're your "specialized employees." They don't necessarily need to meet all the survivability requirements of your general flock, as long as they're not at increased risk of predation or lack vigor. (Kind of like a priest or a doctor in the Army -- they're just there to do a specific job, not to carry weapons and fight, so they don't need extensive combat training like the other soldiers.)


Or you could get Dorkings, which have all the qualities that you're looking for, but I may be a bit nearsighted about my favorite breed!

Additional disclaimer: For those of you that love gamehens, I'm not trying to discredit them. I don't know anything about them, so can't say whether they're wonderful or horrible for this purpose. I'm just trying to draw a logical conclusion from the information given to me. I apologize ahead of time if I offended anyone, as that was not my intent.

This is very insightful...I had not even considered two broody's fighting each other--a very dangerous position for chicks. You have given me even more to mull over, thankfully I'm in no hurry and want to work out the kinks of my plan (like this one) BEFORE purchasing stock. Perhaps I'll be lucky enough to have a Game owner weigh in on the subject.

Thanks,
M

 

[southernmomma]

For my money, silkies are the best. You might be able to find a mix somewhere that doesn't look so funny if you don't like the looks. Mine looks like a regular barred rock until you see the feathered feet and the number of toes.

You hit the nail on the head--I have a hard time with their appearance

thanks,
M

edited to add that yes, I am definitely going to searching out a reputable breeder.

 

[bumpercarr]

You hit the nail on the head--I have a hard time with their appearance

thanks,
M

Well, Dorkings are pretty and not funny looking like silkies are. The silkie mixes are hard to find, sometimes there are some farmers out there that have them in their hen yards, but I find that they don't usually want to sell them. I got my mix by accident....was supposed to be something else but when it hatched it had 5 toes. I was really worried it would look like a silkie, but it turned out to look like a barred rock. Most people think that is what it is until they see the feet! I think if I was specifically going to buy a broody hen (or hatch one), I'd probably go for the Dorking. I have Brahmas, and they can be broody, but because of their size they can also crush the eggs or the chicks. So, I stick with my silkie mix for broodiness and otherwise hatch in the incubator when she's not broody. I much prefer it when she'll raise my chicks for me (my house doesn't smell like a barn when she does the work). I find my other hens to be part-time broodies, they only stay on the nest until something else attracts their attention.

Cochins are also good broodies. As are game hens. Whichever breed you choose, go with a breeder. Hatchery birds can be great, or have none of the characteristics that you picked that breed for, which means you are taking your chances where with a breeder you can be pretty sure you are getting birds that are close to what the real thing is supposed to be.

 

[southernmomma]

Well, Dorkings are pretty and not funny looking like silkies are. The silkie mixes are hard to find, sometimes there are some farmers out there that have them in their hen yards, but I find that they don't usually want to sell them. I got my mix by accident....was supposed to be something else but when it hatched it had 5 toes. I was really worried it would look like a silkie, but it turned out to look like a barred rock. Most people think that is what it is until they see the feet! I think if I was specifically going to buy a broody hen (or hatch one), I'd probably go for the Dorking. I have Brahmas, and they can be broody, but because of their size they can also crush the eggs or the chicks. So, I stick with my silkie mix for broodiness and otherwise hatch in the incubator when she's not broody. I much prefer it when she'll raise my chicks for me (my house doesn't smell like a barn when she does the work). I find my other hens to be part-time broodies, they only stay on the nest until something else attracts their attention.

Cochins are also good broodies. As are game hens. Whichever breed you choose, go with a breeder. Hatchery birds can be great, or have none of the characteristics that you picked that breed for, which means you are taking your chances where with a breeder you can be pretty sure you are getting birds that are close to what the real thing is supposed to be.

Dorkings, Silkie mixes and Cochins- check Time to start looking in their direction.

I'm definitely going to be researching and contacting breeders when the time comes. I've been given that advice several times and believe the time and money spent will go a long ways to a successful flock. I think it's interesting to note from Sydney Acres that some lines may be purposely more broody than others--something else added to my growing list of questions to ask

You have both been exceptionally helpful and I'm most appreciative.

Cheers,
M

 

[bhj123]

Southernmomma

You will have a blast with raising your own birds.
Speaking from experience games are the most awesome breed I have EVER kept. Now there are a couple other larger breeds that are pretty good as well. Buff orpingtons, barred rocks, black australorps

 

[bhj123]

Southernmomma

Sorry my reply got cutoff. As for your proposed bird living conditions I think it's all fine. You're very well read for not having chickens and very well prepared. All that's left is acquiring some birds!! Have fun!!

 

[CarolinaHen]

We have bred and are continuing to breed Silkie/OEGB crosses just for this purpose. They have the sweetness of the Silkie and the game bantam combined. They are absolutely amazing!! Most of them end up with smooth feathers, a small crest, and dark skin. If you can find someone in your area with some of these, snatch them up quickly because they are the best of both worlds