Possibly losing hens to Marek’s

[Bry310]

Hello,

Small flock keeper (15 hens) of 2 years in Northern CA.

The other day we lost a hen to what we believe is Marek’s disease. The only symptoms she showed was green droppings and a purple floppy comb. Within the day, she became lethargic and the following evening she passed.We don’t know the cause for sure and were surprised as our entire flock seems very healthy and active and we haven’t had any issues previously.

we’re aware it could be something else that killed her, however, this morning we noticed a different hen has a gray milky eye. When we saw this, our first concern became Marek’s as it looks exactly like it. I attached a photo for reference.

I have confirmed with our breeder that the chickens are vaccinated at birth, so this has us even more confused. But I fear we are going to lose most, if not all, of our flock over the next few months as they are all exposed. Is there anything we can do now to save the remaining flock?

Moving forward, what can/should we do to prepare our coop and run for future flocks? Even if they’re vaccinated, do we still run the risk of future infections? I’m not sure how to move forward.

 

[nuthatched]

If you lose any more birds, send them for necropsy.
What's their diet? Age?
The mareks vaccine doesn't prevent mareks, it just prevents (usually) the tumors that cause most of the issues.
They can still catch and spread mareks.

 

[Bry310]

If you lose any more birds, send them for necropsy.
What's their diet? Age?
The mareks vaccine doesn't prevent mareks, it just prevents (usually) the tumors that cause most of the issues.
They can still catch and spread mareks.

The one we lost and the other showing signs are both 2.5 years old. Their diet is Kalmbach 17% Protein layer feed. We occasionally toss in cold or frozen fruits and veggies on hot days, but they don’t get many “treats”.

I looked into the necropsy. I can do it, but the closest location that does it is 3 hours away. It won’t be too easy for me to make that happen.

So moving forward, what can I do for my exposed flock? And what can I do for future hens joining or replacing my flock?

 

[Eggcessive]

The photo of the right eye does look like ones I have seen of the ocular form of Mareks. Some people only have that type in their flock, while others have the neural form or the visceral form. Birds can get Mareks even if they are vaccinated, if they are exposed in the first 2 weeks in their environment before the vaccine is effective. The hatchery vaccines are thought to be more effective. Vaccines can fail as well. A friend lost her dog to parvovirus even though it was vaccinated.

You are in a state that has very lost cost necropsies, I think at $30 for up to 2 in a year. You can call the lab, and they will send a prepaid label to ship the body overnight. Keep a body cold, not frozen until it arrives at the lab. It is always a good thing if you lose one to get a diagnosis.

 

[Bry310]

The photo of the right eye does look like ones I have seen of the ocular form of Mareks. Some people only have that type in their flock, while others have the neural form or the visceral form. Birds can get Mareks even if they are vaccinated, if they are exposed in the first 2 weeks in their environment before the vaccine is effective. The hatchery vaccines are thought to be more effective. Vaccines can fail as well. A friend lost her dog to parvovirus even though it was vaccinated.

You are in a state that has very lost cost necropsies, I think at $30 for up to 2 in a year. You can call the lab, and they will send a prepaid label to ship the body overnight. Keep a body cold, not frozen until it arrives at the lab. It is always a good thing if you lose one to get a diagnosis.

I’ll look into it more. Thank you.

I’m realizing this is ultimately unavoidable. I read in an article here that it can travel up to 5 miles and, as you said, infect the vaccinated and unvaccinated.

My thought is I will assess damages and then continue on. As I introduce more birds to my flock in the future, assure they’re vaccinated and keep them separate from the flock for a bit. I typically do keep new birds separate for at least the first two months anyway.

Is this the typical way people continue to raise chickens with Mareks in their flock?

 

[Eggcessive]

There are a number of threads about flocks with Mareks. Some of those people like to share their knowledge and experience. Some chose to vaccinate all new chicks, some don’t, and there are all sorts of opinions on everything. You might want to start another thread at some point asking for “Advice on having a Mareks positive flock.” @coach723 and @microchick have Mareks, and there are others you may come across if you do some research. Here are a few good articles about Mareks to learn about it:
https://vetmedbiosci.colostate.edu/vdl/colorado-avian-health-program/mareks-disease/#:~:text=How do I treat Marek's,pre-vaccinated birds from hatcheries.

https://www.backyardchickens.com/articles/the-great-big-giant-mareks-disease-faq.66077/

 

[microchick]

The one we lost and the other showing signs are both 2.5 years old. Their diet is Kalmbach 17% Protein layer feed. We occasionally toss in cold or frozen fruits and veggies on hot days, but they don’t get many “treats”.

I looked into the necropsy. I can do it, but the closest location that does it is 3 hours away. It won’t be too easy for me to make that happen.

So moving forward, what can I do for my exposed flock? And what can I do for future hens joining or replacing my flock?

Hi Bry.

So sorry that you are having to deal with this, even suspecting that you have it is stressful. My motto is, if you think you have Marek's disease, you probably have Marek's disease in your flock.

The eye looks like it could very well be OMD to me also, @Eggcessive. The best way I can describe it is that it equal to the ocular form of herpes in humans or iritis as a result from a herpes infection. It is painful in chickens the same as it is in humans and it does cause vision loss in chickens (humans also without treatment). With chickens it is an ocular manifestation of an overall systemic infection of avian herpes, aka Marek's disease.

I wish I could tell you that there is something you can do. I lost 3-4 birds to ocular MD. My best advice is to give her a baby aspirin for pain and make sure she has ample shade to get in. Bright light will cause her pain. My birds liked to hang out inside or in deep shade and lived approximately a year to a year and a half after they developed the obvious symptoms. All died at around 2.5 to 3 years of age of neurological symptoms, stroke, seizures, etc.

As for the rest of your flock. If you are indeed dealing with MD or OMD, they are all carriers from this point on. No birds out and for me personally, the only birds in were vaccinated. My best advice is to enjoy your birds. Unfortunately more will probably die but they won't all die and the ones who survive the initial infection will be survivors. Those birds need to live to be at least 3 years of age before they are considered resistant to the disease.

I invite you to read my article:
https://www.backyardchickens.com/ar...-i-learned-to-deal-with-mareks-disease.76944/

Life has kept me away from the forum more than usual but I always respond to tags about MD. We are in this together and remember that you are not alone.

 

[Bry310]

Hi Bry.

So sorry that you are having to deal with this, even suspecting that you have it is stressful. My motto is, if you think you have Marek's disease, you probably have Marek's disease in your flock.

The eye looks like it could very well be OMD to me also, @Eggcessive. The best way I can describe it is that it equal to the ocular form of herpes in humans or iritis as a result from a herpes infection. It is painful in chickens the same as it is in humans and it does cause vision loss in chickens (humans also without treatment). With chickens it is an ocular manifestation of an overall systemic infection of avian herpes, aka Marek's disease.

I wish I could tell you that there is something you can do. I lost 3-4 birds to ocular MD. My best advice is to give her a baby aspirin for pain and make sure she has ample shade to get in. Bright light will cause her pain. My birds liked to hang out inside or in deep shade and lived approximately a year to a year and a half after they developed the obvious symptoms. All died at around 2.5 to 3 years of age of neurological symptoms, stroke, seizures, etc.

As for the rest of your flock. If you are indeed dealing with MD or OMD, they are all carriers from this point on. No birds out and for me personally, the only birds in were vaccinated. My best advice is to enjoy your birds. Unfortunately more will probably die but they won't all die and the ones who survive the initial infection will be survivors. Those birds need to live to be at least 3 years of age before they are considered resistant to the disease.

I invite you to read my article:
https://www.backyardchickens.com/ar...-i-learned-to-deal-with-mareks-disease.76944/

Life has kept me away from the forum more than usual but I always respond to tags about MD. We are in this together and remember that you are not alone.

Thank you so much for your reply. Through my research earlier today, I actually did come across your article and I very much appreciate you sharing your story. I’m really grateful you took the time to respond to my post.

My two hens who have shown signs are both 2.5 years old. There are three others in the flock who are the same age and not showing any signs yet. Hopefully they never do. The rest of my flock are all 1.5 years old, so I’m assuming any signs of disease will take a little longer to show.

As I understood it, this has now just become part of our life with chickens. Am I correct that we just monitor for signs, make comfortable where we can, and euthanize those we can’t?

You mention you only introduce vaccinated chickens to your flock now. So we can still expand our flock, which makes me happy. I hasn’t planned to stop at 15 hens and I hour to someday have a flock like you do. So many I can no longer count haha. But I’m guessing we will be losing a few of the hens we add along the way.

Also, do they still lay normally? Or can we expect an impact to egg production?

Thank you again

 

[microchick]

No problem. We are all in this hobby together.

As for the egg production. I can't speak from everyone's experience but my girls with active Marek's laid very poorly or not at all. In general do I think that being carriers even after 7 years has affected their laying? Maybe at first but not so much now. I think my original flock of Buff Orpington's egg production fell off dramatically at 3 years of age but my Egyptian Fayoumis and bantams who are now 4 years of age or older are still laying pretty regularly.