Predator Proofing Question

[taylorashleyd]

We are in the process of building our coop and run. I wanted to use chicken wire for the run since we live in a city. I have never seen a racoon, rat, coyote, or anything like that in the 27 years I have lived here. We do have hawks, cats, and dogs that have gotten loose but I think the wire would be able to keep them out. Our yard is fenced with a 6-foot fence which keeps stray dogs at bay. Our neighbor has had chickens for 5 years and has never lost any to predation. He used construction fencing for his coop. I just couldn't imagine having that bright orange, so I wanted to go with the chicken wire. About five other people I know with chickens also uses chicken wire and have had no problems.

I really don't want to spring for hardware cloth if I don't have to. If we are in a safe area is chicken wire fine to use?

 

[chfite]

Chicken wire will control the chickens, but little else. It will keep raccoons from reaching through, but will not prevent them from tearing through it. A dog can rip chicken wire apart with little effort.

Chris

 

[baldessariclan]

Chicken wire will control the chickens, but little else. It will keep raccoons from reaching through, but will not prevent them from tearing through it. A dog can rip chicken wire apart with little effort.

Chris

Actually, I think that it's the other way around for raccoons -- they can easily reach an "arm" in through the holes in chicken wire to grab any unwary or curious chicken (they will usually then pull its head off, or similar unpleasantness), but may have trouble tearing through it. Think that they usually get in by pulling up a loose edge or corner. They are definitely very strong for their size. And of course, large dogs can pull / crash through chicken wire as well, if they are strong / excited enough.

These types of predators might not be an issue for a long time (or ever) for you, though, so chicken wire may suffice. You can always retrofit hardware cloth later if you start having problems / losses.

 

[taylorashleyd]

Actually, I think that it's the other way around for raccoons -- they can easily reach an "arm" in through the holes in chicken wire to grab any unwary or curious chicken (they will usually then pull its head off, or similar unpleasantness), but may have trouble tearing through it. Think that they usually get in by pulling up a loose edge or corner. They are definitely very strong for their size. And of course, large dogs can pull / crash through chicken wire as well, if they are strong / excited enough.

These types of predators might not be an issue for a long time (or ever) for you, though, so chicken wire may suffice. You can always retrofit hardware cloth later if you start having problems / losses.

Thank you for your answer. I've honestly never seen a raccoon inside the city and we don't have a protected garbage can either. It never gets messed with. I'm also not worried about dogs since our yard is fenced all the way around. The only predator I've seen are some hawks in the air and the neighbor cat (who also takes care of all the mice and rabbits for me so I don't need any pest protection in my garden either), but neighbor cats family has chickens so he runs at them out of curiosity and not malice most of the time.

 

[Ridgerunner]

I don't know where in Montana you live, but you can check with animal control to see what they deal with. I'd guess you have more predators than you might imagine. When I lived in suburbia, I'd often see raccoons heading home in the early morning hours when I was going to work. They used the storm sewers to travel in. My garbage was left on the side of the street at night and was never broken into by a raccoon, but they were around. One even broke into a neighbor's attic and had her kits in there.

I grew up way out in the country. We had chickens in a coop that was never closed. It was in a pasturefield/apple orchard and a woodland was pretty close by. We would go years without a predator attack but eventually a dog or fox would find them and would have to be dealt with. There were hawks around, but I don't remember ever losing one to a hawk.

There is a difference in whether a predator CAN take one of your chickens and a predator actually TAKING a chicken. You and your neighbors may go for a really long time without a problem. One of you may have a problem tonight. You just don't know.

It is really hard to build a totally predator proof run, especially if it is any size. They can be really good at finding any weakness. I look at it as building something predator resistant, something that will discourage them from going after your chickens. What degree of resistant you build it is up to you. We all have different circumstances, experiences, and risk tolerances. Build whatever you are comfortable with according to your risk tolerances and pocketbook.

By the way, people have posted photos of fencing after a predator attack. One I specifically remember was from someone in eastern Arkansas on the Mississippi River delta. It was a dog attack. The chicken wire fencing had been destroyed in two ways. The wire was literally broken apart in some of the photos. But chicken wire is made by twisting at the joints. Some of that had become untwisted from the pulling enough to create an opening.

Chicken wire, like other wire, comes in different gauges or thicknesses. The stronger wire you use the more resisant it is. And how you attach it matters too.

I never worry about a domestic cat around mature chickens. They will sometimes take baby chicks, but usually a broody is enough to keep them away.

 

[rikithemonk]

If you really read these forums you will see a ton of "Oh my god I lost 12 chickens last night" posts. Predators don't attack everyone, but when they do target your home, the aftermath is always devastating. Personally when I built my coop I chose chicken wire due to price concerns, but to be honest, I regret that decision. I ended up spending an additional $150 on an electric fence to try and boost the security for my girls. After really looking at Chicken wire, I realized that there is no way that it would stand up to a vicious attack. Its just way too thin.

If keeping chickens is an experiment for you, to see if its something you can get into, then by all means cut corners. You can build a better coop when your certain this is something you want to do. But if keeping chickens is something you plan on doing for a while, spend the money up front for the better security. There is nothing more devastating that walking into the yard one morning and finding most of your flock wiped out.

Riki

 

[rikithemonk]

Based on the forum posts that I have read here, the three top animals that kill chickens are:

Neighborhood Dogs

Raccoons

Hawks / Eagles

 

[Roxannemc]

I just put up hardware cloth for my pen and my (granted shes really BIG)Mastiff dug a 4x4" hole thru it in 3 times outside for about 15 minutes or less each.I was sort of suprised.Guess even it isnt impervious

Now i doubled the hardware cloth on the pen 2 layers.One inside, one out. all around

To be Frank, I think it depends on how much you trust what wire you use and also how important is it to you to keep the chickens safe Wil it be devastating and make you feel so guilty and upset if they get killed ? or will it sort of be "well i dont want that to happen again".

Everyone has a different tolerance and thinking towards chickens dying.After all we eat them.

I am a bleeding heart I guess but i feel i am responsible for their welfare. They cant protect themselves. so its up to me.
. If i thought it was total over kill though to do a heavy expensive wire fence then i guess i wouldnt.

You seem pretty convienced the chicken wire will be enough. I wonder though if you arent hoping for agreement to the chicken wire from the forum here because deep inside you arent SURE it wiil be enough and then the responsibility will sort of be the forums?...Just a question.Not a judgment.

 

[taylorashleyd]

Well I talked with animal control and they have very few complaints of raccoons and those are on the opposite side of town from where we live. I'm not worried about neighbor dogs since our yard is fenced and we don't (and won't) own dogs. Hawks and eagles won't be an issue because the top of the run will be fenced. Though we did have a bear wander into town the other day, but I don't think anything I do will stop a bear.

I am worried about raccoons though. I'd just rather not attract them. We live kind of in the middle of the city, but if only takes one brave one to venture further into the city. Does anyone know a good supplier of hardware cloth and what size I should get? Is half inch good enough or should I go with quarter inch?

 

[taylorashleyd]

q