Processing Day Support Group ~ HELP us through the Emotions PLEASE!

[Toast n Jelly]

Quote: Seriously?
Each person has the right to their opinion on this board without a need for others to be defensive and jump to conclusions. Think it through before answering a post that did not single you out and one that you so sorely misunderstood.

 

[chicksooner]

It took 4 days to read through this entire thread before I felt I could respond and add to the conversation is a positive manner. I grew up raised by depression era grandparents so processing an animal never occurred to me as something that people may find objectionable or have emotional issues with. That's not to say harvesting and butchering animals was the large part of my childhood as tending a garden and processing fruits/vegetables took far more of my families time. Chicken/rabbit/pig processing was always just another job to do. I have fond memories of the time spent processing chickens not because of the actual processing but because the entire extended family would be involved with even the youngest children having a chore to do. It was almost a communal affair where many birds were processed and family/friends spent time together bringing a bit of comradery to what would be a solemn and tedious chore for one or two people. A post earlier in the thread castigated Joel Salatin about Carrying on a conversation during the butchering. I do not denigrate or negate anyone's values but they would have been appalled at the conversation and joking that used to occur on processing day with my family. IMHO the conversation or joking around in the group does not lessen the respect given the animal being processed, it just further cements the familial and community bonds which used to exist at a time when families and neighbors came together as a group to accomplish tasks that would have expended a lot of energy on the part of an individual. not one of my cousins male or female cried or felt guilty about taking the life of a chicken/rabbit/pig, it was just what happened to get the food we ate. I honestly believe the disconnect from food sources allowed by commercial agriculture over the last few decades is what has allowed the feelings of guilt/trepidation to develop in a lot of people about processing their own food. When I help process 100 broilers I don't feel bad or the least bit guilty because I am among family and friends all working to achieve a goal.

I envy your ease with processing. I think those of us who mostly grew up disconnected from our food sources experience all the emotions. Most of us didn't start out with raising meat chickens but having pet chickens so we have attached a bunch of other emotions on our chicken processing on top of those of taking a life. I have never killed anything until my first attempt at processing. My first attempt was pretty rough on me but I plan on trying again. I am trying to raise my kids to be more connected to their food source rather than have to depend on someone else. Anyway, thanks for posting and welcome to the group.

 

[gryeyes]

Jarocal, I believe I read your post as you intended it - I "got" your sense of incredulosity at discovering a group of folks struggling with what you found to be easy. I could see how carefully you expressed yourself after realizing how many of us encounter difficulty with processing a food source. I know I am a wuss. My poultry experiences are new to me, as I first got chickens at age 56, just four years ago. And it's essentially a hobby for me, not a livelihood nor intended to be a sustainable source of food. I don't show my birds, I just let them be chickens (or ducks, or turkeys, or geese). Their antics give me pleasure. But my practices do produce unwanted roosters, which I feel I should address myself, not fob off on friends not quite so tender-hearted as am I. They have a healthy attitude; I have an immature attachment to each of those feathered friends either raised by my hens or by me in brooders. I wanna grow up and take care of my own stuff. However, it's just as difficult a step to take as actually beginning to exercise in order to lose weight. I know what I need to do, I just haven't reached the point of girding my loins to kill and eat any of my chickens.

 

[ronott1]

Jarocal, I believe I read your post as you intended it - I "got" your sense of incredulosity at discovering a group of folks struggling with what you found to be easy. I could see how carefully you expressed yourself after realizing how many of us encounter difficulty with processing a food source.

I know I am a wuss. My poultry experiences are new to me, as I first got chickens at age 56, just four years ago. And it's essentially a hobby for me, not a livelihood nor intended to be a sustainable source of food. I don't show my birds, I just let them be chickens (or ducks, or turkeys, or geese). Their antics give me pleasure.

But my practices do produce unwanted roosters, which I feel I should address myself, not fob off on friends not quite so tender-hearted as am I. They have a healthy attitude; I have an immature attachment to each of those feathered friends either raised by my hens or by me in brooders.

I wanna grow up and take care of my own stuff. However, it's just as difficult a step to take as actually beginning to exercise in order to lose weight. I know what I need to do, I just haven't reached the point of girding my loins to kill and eat any of my chickens.

We all come from different places regarding processing. I too grew up with processing and eating our Live Stock. I do understand how hard it is to start at an older age and participate on this site to try making the process better for those just starting.

 

[Jarocal]

Jarocal, I believe I read your post as you intended it - I "got" your sense of incredulosity at discovering a group of folks struggling with what you found to be easy. I could see how carefully you expressed yourself after realizing how many of us encounter difficulty with processing a food source.

It honestly was meant to express that I have become less participatory in my community outside my close circle of family/friends to not realize that the taking of an animals life would be emotionally challenging for a large portion of society.

I know I am a wuss. My poultry experiences are new to me, as I first got chickens at age 56, just four years ago. And it's essentially a hobby for me, not a livelihood nor intended to be a sustainable source of food. I don't show my birds, I just let them be chickens (or ducks, or turkeys, or geese). Their antics give me pleasure.

Difficulty in a new experience either emotionally or physically does not mean your a wuss. A bit of caution and trepidation venturing into new territory is natural. Approaching it with an air of overconfidence and surety will have more disastrous results when the unexpected happens and the unexpected will eventually happen.

But my practices do produce unwanted roosters, which I feel I should address myself, not fob off on friends not quite so tender-hearted as am I. They have a healthy attitude; I have an immature attachment to each of those feathered friends either raised by my hens or by me in brooders. I wanna grow up and take care of my own stuff. However, it's just as difficult a step to take as actually beginning to exercise in order to lose weight. I know what I need to do, I just haven't reached the point of girding my loins to kill and eat any of my chickens.

[/quote] I thoroughly enjoy watching the antics of chickens, rabbits, and other livestock. I find it more entertaining than watching television. I was raised to believe that animals raised for food as well as pets should have a full and rewarding life that allows them to enjoy that life however long or short that life may be. Reading the thread gave me a new appreciation for how I was raised learning skill sets at a young age that are not taught much today.

I envy your ease with processing. I think those of us who mostly grew up disconnected from our food sources experience all the emotions. Most of us didn't start out with raising meat chickens but having pet chickens so we have attached a bunch of other emotions on our chicken processing on top of those of taking a life. I have never killed anything until my first attempt at processing. My first attempt was pretty rough on me but I plan on trying again. I am trying to raise my kids to be more connected to their food source rather than have to depend on someone else. Anyway, thanks for posting and welcome to the group.

Bear in mind the "ease" in processing you feel I enjoy is based on decades of doing it and when learning it I was surrounded by a caring community of friends/family that "lightened the load" do to speak by coming together and working as a team rather than the situation you appear to be in which is trying to learn a new skill set to you without the aid of being surrounded with a group of people passing their knowledge and experience onto you. While the YouTube videos and pictures posting step by step instructions are a valuable tool it is not the same as having that knowledgable teacher there in person to answer any questions or concerns you may have. Similar trepidation and fears (other than the taking of a life) could be applied to preserving fruits/vegetables. Will the canner explode? Did they seal properly? Did I mess it up to allow botulism etc to develop? Is my sauerkraut fermented correctly? It is still a knowledge base that has been historically passed down through generations but with the advent of more industrialized food processing seemed to have been largely forgotten until more recently with a growing segment of the population returning to more traditional food to avoid growing concerns about health issues associated with the industrial food model. My advice when you go to try again is to see if you can find a knowledgable mentor to help you or other people interested in learning too so that you have multiple persons to interact with aside from the chicken. Humans are social beings and surrounding yourself with others to support you during a stressful learning experience will only have a positive effect on the outcome.

 

[Beekissed]

Agreed! And talking, laughing and sharing work is not a bit "disrespectful" of the animal...what kind of lame brained idea is that? I talk, laugh and share around my animals all the time they are living and it's no different when they are dying and dead. Life is happening all around and it doesn't pause because something dies....no mourning is happening amongst the other birds in the flock or in the humans, so why be quiet and try to show this so-called respect? Weird.

They........are.........not.........humans. This statement might help all who try to equate them with such if they only want to get it through their heads..if they don't, and insist on acting like animals are humans, then I guess that's where the disconnect is happening. Could explain why this is so very hard for some. I'd be having some difficulty if I thought I was killing humans too...

 

[Elke Beck]

I don't feel superior in any way nor did I mean to denigrate anyone with my post. I agree with you on everyone coming to something through a different path. I merely expressed my own personal blinders and shortcomings with never realizing other people may have difficulty in processing an animal (beyond the technique of doing so). If I failed to clearly articulate that it was a revelation to me insomuch as I had never placed myself in another's shoes I offer my most abject and humble apologies.
I don't expect you(or anyone) to "worship at the altar of saint Joel". Keep in mind when you think of that video where he is talking during processing that it is a task he has repeatedly done for decades. He didn't start at tha point it has taken thousands of repetitions over the years to develop and refine his skills with that knife. I imagine most people on this thread are wanting to process their own to give themselves and their families a better food on the table and that is commendable. Just bear in mind while your doing it that it is a skill developed over time and processing a few birds a couple times a year is not going to hone the skill set the same as processing hundreds of birds at a time repeatedly over a lifetime. That is not saying you are not going to be proficient at it, just that it is a different level needed when butchering for home use and processing because that is part of how you earn a living.

Wow. Just...wow.

 

[Beekissed]

Jarocal, I see your point and I also find your explanation to be articulate and polite. Please continue to educate as you do it so well!

 

[Jarocal]

Agreed!  And talking, laughing and sharing work is not a bit "disrespectful" of the animal...what kind of lame brained idea is that?  I talk, laugh and share around my animals all the time they are living and it's no different when they are dying and dead.  Life is happening all around and it doesn't pause because something dies....no mourning is happening amongst the other birds in the flock or in the humans, so why be quiet and try to show this so-called respect?  Weird. 

They........are.........not.........humans.  This statement might help all who try to equate them with such if they only want to get it through their heads..if they don't, and insist on acting like animals are humans, then I guess that's where the disconnect is happening.  Could explain why this is so very hard for some.  I'd be having some difficulty if I thought I was killing humans too...

 

I don't think it may necessarily be assignation of anthropomorphic traits on the chickens. I think it is more along the lines that it started off with the birds being pets. It may liken to the need to put down a cat or dog that has been in the family. Individual chickens do have their own traits they exhibit without designating human characteristics to them. Some birds are more docile and are easier to handle others go running off squawking when you draw near even though they rush back in when the new feed is given. I have a fondness and attachment to the birds, I would not bother doing it if I didn't. I think doing it allows me my own selfish satisfaction every time I eat at a fast food chain to know that the meals I prepare at home enjoyed a far better existence when they were alive than the chicken that spent it's life in a CAFO had. I laughed watching them as chicks bumbling around, got amusement at their antics of scratching/running around, and can enjoy them as a meal knowing that the life they had leading to my dinner plate was a good one for them.

In order for me to have BBQ chicken something had to die. Whether I am the one who does it or I buy it already cooked that same sacrifice was made. The disconnect from our food source and daily reminder of that sacrifice is not any individuals fault. It is the result of society trying to feed ever growing numbers even as it became less agrarian and more urbanized/industrialized.

 

[Beekissed]

Agreed again! My point is that most people equate their pets with humans and attach those kind of feelings upon that animal. Suggesting that one is "disrespectful" when talking during processing would seem to suggest that one is at a funeral of a loved human instead of merely processing a food animal. I too have loved my chickens from chick to death and that level of love and respect for the animal is in no way diminished by the fact that I do not view them as pets. The label "pet" does not give that animal any more or any less value than my chicken, that is not a pet.

If my dog or cat was a food animal, I'd feel much the same about them...if they are good to eat and will eventually be eaten, it is best to eat them while their meat is still good. In the process of their life I will insure they have a good, natural existence and a good, quick and merciful death~as I do any animal in my care. The label "pet" does not dictate how I treat them while they live and it also doesn't change how I think about or treat them as they die. I am a steward of all of them and I hope to be a good steward...but attaching human characteristics or treating them as if they are human isn't something I subscribe to, so this issue of life or death doesn't hold the same anxiety for me as it does for other people.

When one can separate that animals are animals and humans are humans, the whole issue of anxiety, grief, drama and pathos can be removed from the equation. Do I cry if my dog is in pain or when I have to put one down? You betcha. But I do it. And I don't find it difficult to do if I love him..and I do. I would find it much more difficult and anxiety producing if I were to let him linger around in pain for my own benefit, than if I give him mercy and dignity in his dying.

I guess it's all a matter of perspective. And that was what you were trying to convey in the first place, I do believe...how different it is to be raised with one perspective and then reading about one so very different than your own. It's hard to understand all the stress that comes along with that other perspective when you've had instruction from the time you were a child about the place that animals hold in our lives.