Quail on Deep Litter - Why it Works

[PinkBee]

Thank you, Quailsong, for posting this wonderful "how-to"! As I'm getting my first quail in the next month (FINALLY) and have been struggling with the best way to set things up for the time being, reading this has helped me decide to go the "deep litter" method. But, now I have some questions as I get everything together before I get the quail. I'm going to be getting (hopefully) two sets of four (3 hens and 1 rooster per set), jumbo sized coturnix. I'm putting each set into a portable rabbit cage (47x22 inches) with a 7.5 inch deep plastic tray. They'll be out within my screened pool area, but if necessary, I'm hoping they'll be easily moveable. (Thus the "portable" cage idea.) There, that's the basic info. Now, the questions!

Should I put holes of some sort into the plastic tray? I'm not foreseeing it getting flooded, but I do get the random torrential downpour that will probably dampen the litter a little more than it should be.

I've been reading that putting DE onto deep litter for chickens is often done, is this fine for the quail as well? I'm a believer in DE for bug control.

Wood ash...*sigh* I live in a 10b/11 gardening zone and everyone wants me to use wood ash. I simply do not ever have a fire and my friends that do, won't be until the weather gets down past 80 at least. Is there something that will substitute for wood ash? I've read for chickens (because everything except this thread is about chickens) some people use garden lime, is this a substitute for wood ash or just something different?

Grass clippings...another *sigh*. The lawn service mulches it all straight into the yard. Sometimes there are soggy clumps, but not often. How about something like alfalfa? Could this work as a "grass" substitute? I could even figure a way to chop it, I'm sure.

Dried leaves. (I'm beginning to feel like there is nothing here to make this work!) Nope, no dried leaves. My mango tree drops leaves, but mango trees have a caustic sap that I wouldn't want to try. I do have a few other trees, but they really don't drop leaves at any one time in any quantity. Would the alfalfa work for this, too? Or? I can get mulched wood (like I use around plants), would this be okay?

Garden soil...I have garden sand. The only soil I have is in those areas I've been gardening in for the past 4+ years. Is this what I should use? I also have worm castings, both semi-dry and soggy. I can make these totally dry, if that would be best. Or, no castings, just garden dirt?

Oh, and with the deep litter, do they ALSO need a sand box?

I'm pretty certain I'm over-thinking this, I generally do when I first start a new project, but I want these quail to be in as nice conditions as I can currently provide (I'd love to have them out in the yard in a tractor or something, but until I get a fence and have a good talk with the lawn guys, that'll have to wait.) I'm currently expanding my herb garden efforts and planting various greens for them (preparation!) but getting the right litter mix so it all comes together is my current stumbling block.

ANY advice or suggestions would be welcome!

 

[quailswiss]

PinkBee,

I have 5 quail in a cage like you describe on deep litter, and don't need any holes in the bottom. It's actually quite dry, and when it gets too wet (because of spilled water or rain coming in) I just take some of the damp litter out.

I covered the sides in a strip of a couple of inches to keep them from kicking the litter out and the lid to keep the rain off.

I understood the ash was for critter control? So if DE is ok for quail would you still need ash?

I don't use grass clippings. I added some green hedge trimmings I shredded with a lawn mower. Mulched wood is fine but remember their feet are little, they need to be able to scratch it up. Hence the shavings. Sure alfalfa would work as a grass substitute, they might like eating it too. I think as long as the pieces are small it doesn't actually matter which greens you use. Think of it as a mini compost.

Worm castings are great esp. if they are dry. I actually put a tray of castings+worms in for the quail to pick over, about 1-2inch deep.

They don't need a sand box but I was given a corner tray with the box, I hung it in a corner so they can shelter underneath and fly up to use the sand bath. That part of the cage is very popular. I also put in a partition cut from cardboard which reduced the friction in the pen (I have 3 roos and a hen, juveniles, waiting to fatten up a bit)

I also hung the feeder a little bit higher on one side to keep the litter from getting into it. Actually a pet bottle feeder and a pet bottle waterer work great, check the web for instructions.
Let us know how it goes.

 

[PinkBee]

Thank you! It's great to hear that it's working for others. I am definitely doing this. I'll probably just use pine shavings unless I can get some very well-shredded mulch to add (thanks for explaining the size thing.) I'll also cover the sides partway up like you said, maybe with screening (as I have some sitting in the garage...) Somewhere recently I read not to use DE with the deep litter because it kills the bugs that the quail would otherwise be snacking on. So, maybe I'll randomly put in a sand/dust bath with DE added to it within the nesting box area for that kind of bug control (lice?) but try and keep it out of the main area.

I'm also going to think about the other things you mentioned you have with yours (partition, corner tray, dust pan), all sound like great ideas. And, I'll definitely add worm castings and worms now. That sounds like fun to watch.

Thanks again!

PS. Quailswiss, do you have any pictures?

 

[flg8r]

I switched my coops over last week. I wanted to build an aviary style cage but since I'm redoing my kitchen, the time and money aren't there right now. I never would have thought of doing this inside of a cage/coop if it hadn't been for this thread. I had a girl with a hurt foot (got a toe tangled in moss) so I wanted to do something sooner than later to get her off wire.

I bought aspen shavings and a hay bale ($17 total and I've used less than 1/4) and tossed in some small leaves I raked up. I lined the wire with a layer of newspaper to keep everything from falling through. A bit has but they're just on a concrete slab so I'll sweep it and put it in the compost bin. Or just leave it there, it's just hay and wood shavings anyway. It's kind of a "shallow litter" right now because I keep adding a bit at a time while they stomp it down and move it around. It is pretty messy the way I have it set up so you would definitely want more to keep it in if it was on a porch or inside, but since they are outside, it is perfect.

Even if I didn't stick with it, it's been totally worth it for all the fun they're having. So far, I like it way better too. They don't stink within a couple of days, I'm not having to change dirty liners/newspaper or rake up stinking poo and the best part - almost no flies! I added new quail two days ago and have been throwing seed in for them to hunt for to keep them entertained and so far, no problems. I love going out and seeing them buried in the hay. Thanks for the ideas!

 

[PinkBee]

flg8r, I would love to see a picture of your setup and birds with this. I've been talking to others who raise quail, friends who've never heard about this, about setting my pens up with deep litter and they are skeptical. It'd be nice to have more pictures showing it working.

 

[flg8r]

I'll try to get some pics tomorrow. I've been swamped with kitchen demo and school work and haven't even been on here to see the request.

 

[flg8r]

I completely forgot to take pics (unless you want some of my kitchen demo) but this was one I took the first day. They are not on a lot of hay here because it was so fluffy, they have stomped it down quite a bit since this picture was taken. I keep adding an inch or so and they stomp it down a bit. Some parts are still thin but I'm up to 2-3" in a few spots.

 

[PinkBee]

I completely forgot to take pics (unless you want some of my kitchen demo) but this was one I took the first day. They are not on a lot of hay here because it was so fluffy, they have stomped it down quite a bit since this picture was taken. I keep adding an inch or so and they stomp it down a bit. Some parts are still thin but I'm up to 2-3" in a few spots.

Oh! This looks wonderful! Cozy, pleasant, neat (in a messy with hay sense). I'll bet your birds love it. This is what I want for mine, too. The picture really helps because I was wondering what to do with the water and feed containers. Putting them in the aluminum trays is perfect. How old are the quail in this picture, btw? They look young. Also, how high is the wall around the litter? I'm thinking of using a 1x6 (so it'd be 5-1/2 inches high...you know how annoyed I was when I first found out how "they" label lumber sizes? I ranted the the HD person for about 5 minutes. LOL) And, is that a tray with sand or something else? Have you had to clean the pen out yet? Is it smelling? Are you using just hay? (Not straw?) I'm thinking of using pine shavings and either hay or alfalfa (as I can get those, but not straw.)

Thank you for the picture! (And sorry about all the questions. I'm sure I'm just over stressing and obsessing about this, but I want to make everything as perfect as possible while I still have time. Eggs are on Day 7 of incubation...)

 

[flg8r]

These are all full grown. I think the depth perception makes them look smaller, the feeders are at the front and they are 3' back and 5' to the side and half buried in hay. I used hay and aspen shavings with some small dead leaves thrown in. I don't have any wall on the front it. There is a 1" lip to keep eggs from rolling out when it was wire and that's it. I may add a small piece later but right now, once they stomp it down a bit, the bottom layer isn't going to go anywhere. And yes, that's a sand tray. They don't have it in right now, they get it every now and then.

It's been about two weeks now. They need another fresh layer since they're down to the newspaper in some spots, but still no odor and I think I've seen one fly (they were swarming) and I haven't cleaned anything out. So far it seems to be a much easier system to maintain.

 

[PinkBee]

These are all full grown. I think the depth perception makes them look smaller, the feeders are at the front and they are 3' back and 5' to the side and half buried in hay. I used hay and aspen shavings with some small dead leaves thrown in. I don't have any wall on the front it. There is a 1" lip to keep eggs from rolling out when it was wire and that's it. I may add a small piece later but right now, once they stomp it down a bit, the bottom layer isn't going to go anywhere. And yes, that's a sand tray. They don't have it in right now, they get it every now and then.

It's been about two weeks now. They need another fresh layer since they're down to the newspaper in some spots, but still no odor and I think I've seen one fly (they were swarming) and I haven't cleaned anything out. So far it seems to be a much easier system to maintain.

Definitely a depth perception thing! But, isn't that even better? Obviously they are not over-crowded in there.

That's great to know that the bedding doesn't fly around or try and escape. That had been a concern as mine will be near my pool. Thank you for sharing what's happening with you and your birds with me! If you think about it, could you update in another week? It'd be nice to know if it continues to work over time with you. Thank you!