Question regarding the 4sq ft rule for coops

[Mikedero]

OK I have been battling this whole 4sq ft per bird rule for chicken coops. When I look online for coops for 18 layers I come accross things like this http://amishcoops.com/5x8-chicken-coop/

that is a 5X8 coop 40 sq ft and they are stating it is for 15-25 birds. but based on the 4sq ft rule that is 10 max on the birds. I have 9 layers 1 year old and another 9 layers 4 weeks old. I am in the process of building another coop it is 5X8 see the pics below

So my question instead of having 2 different coops could I fit all 18 in the coop the floor plan is 5X8 at the highest point 7 Ft tall and the back side 6 ft tall I am planning on a 8X40 run if i can fit them all in one run.

I am only half way done I will finish this week




oh and this is where I keep my meat birds that is 5X10 with 22 Cornish X going to process some this weekend and then the rest at 8 weeks

 

[NestingHillsSC]

OK I have been battling this whole 4sq ft per bird rule for chicken coops. When I look online for coops for 18 layers I come accross things like this http://amishcoops.com/5x8-chicken-coop/

that is a 5X8 coop 40 sq ft and they are stating it is for 15-25 birds. but based on the 4sq ft rule that is 10 max on the birds. I have 9 layers 1 year old and another 9 layers 4 weeks old. I am in the process of building another coop it is 5X8 see the pics below

So my question instead of having 2 different coops could I fit all 18 in the coop the floor plan is 5X8 at the highest point 7 Ft tall and the back side 6 ft tall I am planning on a 8X40 run if i can fit them all in one run.

I am only half way done I will finish this week




oh and this is where I keep my meat birds that is 5X10 with 22 Cornish X going to process some this weekend and then the rest at 8 weeks

The 4' rule is like anything, it's just a rule. When you look at coops online they always state they can hold this many birds. But really they can not. I have 3 coops right now and building a forth. My first one was only 4x5 and have 13 birds in it. By the rule I should only have 5. But my only go in to roost and to lay eggs. They don't spend any part of the day in there. They are always outside. So my fix was I put 2 5' roosting pole in there. That way they all have enough space to roost. But 13 is the max for that house.

 

[Mtn Laurel]

Below is a link from a post from a similar thread that gives a lot of good info regarding coop size.

https://www.backyardchickens.com/t/...3x3x3-what-problems-might-arise#post_10834873

 

[4 the Birds]

4sf per bird is not a rule but a "rule of thumb". I think that it is a good guideline to go by. A 2ft x 2ft space is adequate for a bird to spin around or move without bumping into another bird. Same thing with the 1ft of roost space per bird. The more room that you have the less fights, squabbles, and stress will occur. It also opens up the ability to add flexibility to the interior design (light blocking partitions and feed or water stations). IMHO a 5x8 ft coop can hold 15 to 25 birds but it is not adequate enough. 2 that size would work well.

 

[Ridgerunner]

What you are dealing in the 4 square feet in the coop along with 10 square feet in the run is a guideline, not an absolute law of nature. It’s something that is intended to keep practically everyone from Minneapolis to Miami, Denver to San Diego, Perth Australia to Inverness Scotland out of trouble, even with widely varying management techniques. It’s overkill for a lot of people as far as the absolute minimum room they need, but it’s a good starting point. I don’t believe in magic numbers for much of anything to do with chickens, but if someone has no experience with chickens they need a starting point. And this is geared more for people living in suburbia with a limited number of chickens, not a rural setting where space and neighbors are less restrictive.

There are a lot of things involved in how many chickens you can shoehorn into a teeny tiny space. Things like the personality of your individual chickens and how well they take confinement, flock make-up, climate, your management techniques, and who knows what else.

In many ways “coop space” is pretty irrelevant. Its how much space they have and when it is available. It doesn’t matter if that space is in the coop, coop and run, or they totally free range and sleep in trees. It needs to be available when they are awake. If all you use your coop for is a place for them to sleep and they have access to more space as soon as they wake up, the coop does not need to be big at all. The more you leave them locked in there the bigger the coop needs to be.

How you manage them has a big part to play too. Commercial operations have proven you can keep chickens in as little as 2 square feet for each chicken, but these are all hen flocks (no roosters), the hens have been specifically bred to take confinement really well, and they still trim their beaks to keep them from eating each other.

I’m an advocate for providing as much space as reasonable for three reasons. I find that I have fewer behavioral problems to deal with if more space is provided. The behaviors I’m talking about range from feather-picking, fighting, aggression, to cannibalism. Chickens have learned to live together in a flock but one thing that makes that possible is that the weaker will run away from the stronger if there is conflict. They need room to run away.

I find I don’t work as hard if they have more room. An easy example is poop management. They poop a lot. The more restricted they are, the more the poop builds up and the more I have to manage it.

The more room I have to work with, the more flexibility I have in managing things that happen. Say you restrict their coop space so you have no choice except to let them out at the crack of dawn every day of the year but you want to sleep in in a Saturday. Maybe you get a blizzard where they can’t get out for a few days. Say you have a predator that is killing off your flock and you need to be somewhere else. If you don’t have enough space to leave them locked up safe, what are you going to do? Most predators won’t hang around until you get a good shot.

Will you ever want to add new chickens? That goes a whole lot easier if they have space. Will you ever want a broody hen to raise chicks with the flock? The hen’s job is a lot easier if she has room to work with.

That’s my take on how much room chickens need. You can often get by with less than the magic numbers of 4 and 10, but you may have days where your stress level gets pretty high. It’s not about pampering your chickens, it’s about pampering yourself. How much pampering are you worth?

 

[Mikedero]

Also I might add I do not add feed or water inside the coops ever. they stay outside

let me also add I am only allowed 20 chickens so 18 is my max, and all hens. I only hatch out Quail which I am pretty much done with waste of time and effort for me.

 

[NestingHillsSC]

What you are dealing in the 4 square feet in the coop along with 10 square feet in the run is a guideline, not an absolute law of nature. It’s something that is intended to keep practically everyone from Minneapolis to Miami, Denver to San Diego, Perth Australia to Inverness Scotland out of trouble, even with widely varying management techniques. It’s overkill for a lot of people as far as the absolute minimum room they need, but it’s a good starting point. I don’t believe in magic numbers for much of anything to do with chickens, but if someone has no experience with chickens they need a starting point. And this is geared more for people living in suburbia with a limited number of chickens, not a rural setting where space and neighbors are less restrictive.

There are a lot of things involved in how many chickens you can shoehorn into a teeny tiny space. Things like the personality of your individual chickens and how well they take confinement, flock make-up, climate, your management techniques, and who knows what else.

In many ways “coop space” is pretty irrelevant. Its how much space they have and when it is available. It doesn’t matter if that space is in the coop, coop and run, or they totally free range and sleep in trees. It needs to be available when they are awake. If all you use your coop for is a place for them to sleep and they have access to more space as soon as they wake up, the coop does not need to be big at all. The more you leave them locked in there the bigger the coop needs to be.

How you manage them has a big part to play too. Commercial operations have proven you can keep chickens in as little as 2 square feet for each chicken, but these are all hen flocks (no roosters), the hens have been specifically bred to take confinement really well, and they still trim their beaks to keep them from eating each other.

I’m an advocate for providing as much space as reasonable for three reasons. I find that I have fewer behavioral problems to deal with if more space is provided. The behaviors I’m talking about range from feather-picking, fighting, aggression, to cannibalism. Chickens have learned to live together in a flock but one thing that makes that possible is that the weaker will run away from the stronger if there is conflict. They need room to run away.

I find I don’t work as hard if they have more room. An easy example is poop management. They poop a lot. The more restricted they are, the more the poop builds up and the more I have to manage it.

The more room I have to work with, the more flexibility I have in managing things that happen. Say you restrict their coop space so you have no choice except to let them out at the crack of dawn every day of the year but you want to sleep in in a Saturday. Maybe you get a blizzard where they can’t get out for a few days. Say you have a predator that is killing off your flock and you need to be somewhere else. If you don’t have enough space to leave them locked up safe, what are you going to do? Most predators won’t hang around until you get a good shot.

Will you ever want to add new chickens? That goes a whole lot easier if they have space. Will you ever want a broody hen to raise chicks with the flock? The hen’s job is a lot easier if she has room to work with.

That’s my take on how much room chickens need. You can often get by with less than the magic numbers of 4 and 10, but you may have days where your stress level gets pretty high. It’s not about pampering your chickens, it’s about pampering yourself. How much pampering are you worth?

X2

 

[NestingHillsSC]

Also I might add I do not add feed or water inside the coops ever. they stay outside

Same!

 

[Mikedero]

Well I guess I will run 2 different coops I was trying to make it easy on me by only having to worry about watering and feeding one pen

 

[4 the Birds]

Well I guess I will run 2 different coops I was trying to make it easy on me by only having to worry about watering and feeding one pen

Ah... good choice. Why not connect the two bldgs. together? Then you can still have your one feed/water if that is important. My coop is that way... add on... add on....