raising Chickens is for the Birds

[centrarchid]

I have   raised   dogs  for  over 30 years  & your  dog is way to young to understand,  and so it must always be under control...! thats your real problem,keeping it under control..! plus most  puppies will chase  and  try to catch  things ,& that breed is always up for some good fun  & ive heard they are  pretty active...??? i almost  bought  one my self  until i heard that they are  like trying to nail jello to the wall..????

More age needed on pup. Most of mine need supervision for a solid year unless another source of excitement is around. Really fast maturing dogs can be trusted at 18 months but having one take 24 is not exceptional. The trust I look for is being with birds 24/7 and all life stages are safe. The prey drive will not be your enemy, rather it is boredom. Smart dogs are the most difficult to train sometimes.

 

[chickengeorgeto]

A rat terrier in fact all terriers instinct is to kill any small animal that moves. About 45 years ago I owned a pair of Feist squirrel dogs. They were good about keeping chicken killing vermin out of the main run, but they could catch and kill chickens faster than a fox.

If I caught them killing a chicken and whipped the dogs for it, they must have thought that I was punishing them because they weren't killing my chickens fast enough to suit me. One day I heard a commotion and one of the dogs came around the corner of the fence with an escaped hen in her sights. On instinct I grabbed up a stick laying there and bopped her on the head. The dog yelped and fell over kicking like she was "Grave yard dead." Without enough time to think it through, I scooped the dog up and soused it down into a 55 gallon barrel of freezing rain water. The icy bath had a bad effect on the pooch, it snapped it out of its dying trembles. That was the worst good deed that I ever did. Soon after that I gave both dogs away.

There are three types of training. Positive reinforcement training which works for thing like "Sit Rover" or "Roll over Spot" followed by a reward.

Negative reinforcement training which earns the pooch an immediate punishment for observed bad behavior.

The third type is aversion training which is intended to break bad habits, behavior that the dog may not know is Verboten, but that its owner can not easily catch the pooch committing. Bad aspects of a dogs' instinct falls into this realm. Aversion training is not cruel on its face, nor is it "retroactive" punishment, it is just another tool in the dog owner's tool box. Think of aversion training like the little boy who steals a quid of his pappy's chewing tobacco and is deathly sick for his troubles. The idea is that the little boy associates his stomach discomfort with the chewing tobacco and not with his father.

Besides, I don't think anyone here has yet weighed in on how cruel it is to maintain a pack of or even one chicken killing k9 in the midst of a flock of chickens.

Before handing me my own aversion training my old man used to tell me "Son, this is going to hurt me worst than it is going to hurt you." I have to say though that my father took my whippings like a man, I never once saw him cry.

 

[centrarchid]

Even Feist's can be used around a cockyard in the hands of parties that know their way around dogs. Numerous examples of terriers working well with poultry can also be found. When so employed the terriers are still efffective at controlling rats. Proper keep and use of dogs requires effort, more than just feeding and watering and whacking dog too late after an offense.

 

[ChaoSS]

Everyone who says tying a dead chicken to a dog is effective or cruel clearly has never seen the way a dog acts around dead meat. Every dog I've ever known has much preferred well rotted meat to fresh.

That's like tying candy onto a kid, the only thing they don't like about it is that they can't eat it.

 

[diditotaro]

Seriously- tie a dead chicken around the dogs neck???????????
You should not be a pet owner of any kind...any kind...how awful!
Dogs are intelligent creatures that need to be taught not abused.
Chickens are treats to dogs until you train them otherwise. You don't punish a dog for being a dog!

 

[6of6chicks]

The third type is aversion training which is intended to break bad habits, behavior that the dog may not know is Verboten, but that its owner can not easily catch the pooch committing. Bad aspects of a dogs' instinct falls into this realm. Aversion training is not cruel on its face, nor is it "retroactive" punishment, it is just another tool in the dog owner's tool box. Think of aversion training like the little boy who steals a quid of his pappy's chewing tobacco and is deathly sick for his troubles. The idea is that the little boy associates his stomach discomfort with the chewing tobacco and not with his father.

This is effective ONLY in situations where the aversion acts as an immediate deterrent to the behavior. For example, there are puppy-safe snap traps that you can buy to teach a dog not to get on the counter. They are essentially the same style as traditional rat traps, but the force is much less, so the dog is startled rather than hurt. The idea behind them is to "bait and trap" your dog so that it learns the expected behavior whether you are there or not. So in this case the dog puts it's nose up on the counter and gets popped on the nose for his efforts. The punishment is immediate WHEN the act takes place, and only IF the act takes place. So the dog learns that IF he puts his nose on the counter he gets punished, but IF he leaves it alone he doesn't get punished. That's aversion training, and can be highly effective when used correctly.

Putting a dead animal around the dog's neck is not aversion training because the cause-effect link is broken. In that situation, the dog kills the chicken, time passes, THEN the dead chicken is used to punish the dog. There's two basic problems with that method. First, there's a gap in time between the cause and the effect, so the dog is not going to connect the two. Dogs simply are not capable of understanding past crimes. He will certainly know you are angry, but he will not know WHY. Second, you're assuming the dog will realize the live chicken and the dead chicken are the same animal. It looks different, smells different, is no longer acting the same, etc., and there is NO evidence whatsoever that your dog will make that connection.

Tying a dead chicken around your dog's neck does NOTHING to teach him to stay away from live chickens. It simply teaches him that you are angry. Dogs are HIGHLY perceptive and very in tune to their owner's emotions and body language. The very first time you get angry at your dog he learns one KEY rule in his life: that if he acts like he is sorry, odds are you'll stop punishing him. That's why dogs tuck their tails, the ears droop, or they go down on the floor in a submissive gesture. As people we like to think it means our dog is sorry for what he did. It doesn't. It simply means your dog has learned how to make YOU stop yelling at him, because it is human nature to cool off when the opposing party is submissive.

 

[growsaposy]

So sorry for your 'attack,' we've had it happen twice. Was so mad at the dog (for following his instinct) that I squirted him with water. And am much more careful about gates and such. We do lock ourselves in chicken yard now, and make sure we have hardware cloth in strategic places. Good Luck!

 

[swamperkk]

how long will u tie the dead chicken to the dog before he understands dont kill the chickens,and when the chichen goes to the rot mode will u be the one to take the rotton chicken off,be sure to wash the dog with dawn soap,whew

 

[sbhkma]

Even Feist's can be used around a cockyard in the hands of parties that know their way around dogs. Numerous examples of terriers working well with poultry can also be found. When so employed the terriers are still efffective at controlling rats. Proper keep and use of dogs requires effort, more than just feeding and watering and whacking dog too late after an offense.

Totally agree. One of my dogs is a rat terrier and he takes his job VERY seriously. He kills rats, mice and baby rabbits. And he saved one of my hen's life when a coyote grabbed her and he freight trained that coyote to the ground so one of my GSDs could beat the ever-loving snot out of it. Totally trustworthy around the chickens. He wasn't born that way. He was trained that way.

 

[sbhkma]

You know, there is an old remedy for dogs who are chicken killers. You can look it up too- farmers swear by it.
It requires your wife and family to be on board though, and a good family meeting with gentle words so they understand this isnt about being mean but about using the dog's own natural dynamic to teach him not to kill chickens. This mentality would go for ANY dog and the general practice of "You are boss- not the dog" should be a constant.
You would need to have his kennel or an outside place prepared asap (because you will NOT want the little guy anywhere near you).
You take the dead chicken, and you tie it to his neck good. Leave it there for a week.
Not kidding.
The rotting thing will get really really old and yucky and he will NOT like it. He will earn that chickens are yucky and you dont mess with them.

Now- many people say this doesn't work for all dogs. We dont really know how efficiently these people followed through or how they did it, but I know some people are more stubborn than others and dogs are the same way.
The issue is that dogs are not people- as much as people try to believe they reason like we do. They understand through trial and error, through pain through lack of the things they enjoy and through rewards.

So you're also saying you need to keep the dog outside for a week, with a rotting bird tied to it and he's going to LEARN from this abuse? Not bloody likely. Dogs are smart, but they can't reason to that depth. Seriously, don't ever get a dog.