Ready to pull out my hair...

[anthonyjames]

First off let me say to all of you the wealth of knowledge is great and I am thankful for it. My chickens that have all came thus far and lived or arrived alive are all doing great and so are all the new ones that were shipped as replacements.

This pertains to meat rabbits. I know why don't I post in the sister site. Well to be frank there is such little traffic on that site and I have gone days if months with no answers and everyone here seems to either have raised rabbits or still are as well. Here is my issue and I am at wits end and have never had issues breeding other animals before but these rabbits are making me crazy and down.

I have 7 does and 1 buck. And let me note that this is the first round with all the does as they are only about 8 months old.

Doe 1 White Satin had kits 2 weeks ago. I put in the nest box and bam! Came out next night 9 kits and they are doing well.

Doe 2 California last week had her kits on the wire and proceeded to eat portions if not just about all 8 of them.

Doe 3 California had her kits on the wire as well and was a full 10 days early from the calendar and had them durning the day. One head was severed off all the rest were in great condition but were frozen to death literally. We had a cold snap. This was last weekend.

Doe 4 New Zealand White built this great nest on Monday full of fur on doing all the things doe 1 did and then the last 3 days here have been severe thunderstorms, hail, winds at over 70 mph and today snow!?! Well this morning still no kits and she is now eating her nest.

Doe 5 New Zealand White put in the nest box yesterday morning and according to the calendar is 3 days before. Let me say I was out just about every hour until until 1am this morning and nothing. Finally had to sleep. And of course we have had these bloody storms (see Doe 4) and this morning I went out and all the kits were on the wire and she was trying to pull fur and cover each one. So I grabbed these put them in a nest box and put some of her fur mixed with nest filler that have and put them under a 100 watt heat lamp. There are 8 kits. There were ice cold to the touch all because of this darn weather here. Is there any chance these will make it under the heat lamp? If so, after they warm up can I put the nest box back in the cage with this doe and will she take care of them? If not I am out yet another batch of kits and that makes almost 30 in a week.

Does 6 & 7 should be having kits this weekend. Can my luck get an worse? Any input would be great. And is there something different I can do for nest boxes? They are the standard metal nest box that goes into a corner. I have heard about drop in nest boxes but can't find any info on them. Does anyone know about these or have images? Something about dropping in the floor? Or external nest boxes just so that the doe has plenty of room in the cage and hopefully will use the nest boxes.

Help anyone and everyone please.

 

[chicks4kids]

So sorry to hear about your luck.

I've never raised rabbits, but I'm wondering if maybe the buck is too close to them? His scent or noises perhaps...Maybe it's making them nervous? I've read on here through other threads that rabbits are natural burrowers...maybe they don't feel "safe" or "hidden" enough in those nest boxes. Also, with this being the first time for all of them, this may be why all of the peculiar behaviors and habits....maybe next time they'll know what's going on. These are just a few things that pop into my head.

I wish you better luck on your next couple of litters soon to come.

 

[uhuh555]

Where are your coops (inside or outside)? Are they Facing East if outside? Do you have wire on all sides? The doe loves to have two sides that are either against a building or protected from the sun and weather (west and north sides).

Some times their first time they can do these things. Storms (thunderstorms) are especially devastating to them when giving birth.

You can breed them back immediately. If they have another failed litter than cull them. It is always wise to have extra does when starting with a unproven breeders. The failures can be minimized by having the extra does. It is always easier to down size the herd than to wait for young does to mature enough to breed.

It would be wise to have two unrelated bucks so you have two blood lines. One to select replacement bucks and the other for replacement does. Always choose replacements from good mothers that are calm and consistent producers of large litters of big kits.

Do you handle your rabbits on a daily bases? This will lessen their nervousness. By handling I mean pet/scratching between their ears and back. It is best to do this when giving a treat. I use calf manna (2 tablespoons for each adult rabbit) in a separate treat dish. When a doe has kits 4 tablespoons a day is safe to feed. Calf manna has many extra nutrients and amino acids that the regular feed doesn't have and it seems to have a calming effect. They will crave it like cats do catnip. It is low on fiber so do not go overboard with it. The kits will be larger at birth and when they begin to eat will greatly improve their weight gain on less feed.

The kits that were taken out of the doe’s cage and used a heat lamp on will probably be a difficult at best to reintroduce. Try some Vicks on the doe's nose so her sense of smell will be blocked. Most likely she will refuse them and may eat them.

If you should find them on the wire again don't touch them until you have washed your hands and rubbed Vicks onto your hands. Pick them up and place them into the nest box. If she has not made a nest yet, place some straw in the nest box and near the center make a pocket and place the kits in it. She may continue to pluck fur to line it with. Do not use a heat lamp as this will dehydrate them. The mothers usually feed their young in the AM and again in the PM. Their milk is very rich.

These failures are always going to happen with unproven breeders. Usually the second time around they will know what to expect and will probably do better.

I wish to better luck!

 

[anthonyjames]

Uhun555,

My coops/cages are part inside/outside. They are hanging above my chickens in the coop/run area.

Wire is on all sides but the back and sides at each run end is wrapped in plastic stopping wind, rain, etc.

My does cages are on the East/West side of the coop/run.

Do we handle our rabbits on a daily basis? No. We feed, them water them and when they get greens I just pet them about 20 seconds or so and leave them be.

Calf manna? Where would I find this? They currently don't get anything extra except a chewing block and marsh hay (once a day).

I am just hoping the kits come back to life after they warm up. Will they? I can put them back in the cage with the mommy and put some kids vicks on her nose. Should not be an issue. This one is very calm and likes to meet us at the door.

As for breed them back right away that means 3 - 4 days later correct?

Do you have any info on the recessed, drop in or exterior nest boxes? I am thinking this may help the issues as well. I do put the nest boxes were they like to lay in the cages currently.

As for getting more rabbits. Well it took my 5 months to find the one buck I have. I am hoping that from the first buck I will get another to keep. I also had a very hard time finding the does in my area. Not many breeders of meat rabbits that I could find.

 

[LizzyJo]

We had pet rabbits and the first litter was a disaster. The doe refused to care for the babies. We went to the vet to see about artificial bunny milk and he said that it is common for does to reject their first litter.

As far as breeding back, we had a buck that mated with the doe while the babies were coming out one time. We seperated them, of course, but 30 days later there was a new batch born.

 

[Kittymomma]

I always give mine a second chance and then cull if they're still not good mammas. How much activity goes on around the hutches? If the chickens can get up on them and hang out that just might be too much stress for young does causing them to eat their young. One of the things I always do, especially when dealing with young does, is to breed at least two of them on the same day. If one of the does won't care for her young (has them on the wire etc.) the other doe will usually foster the litter with no problems. You have to put the babies in the other doe's nest before they start getting fur though, if you try after 2 days or so it doesn't work.


The storms have really hurt you and I'm sorry you've had to go thru this. Don't give up though it's pretty common to have problems with the first litter and the bad weather certainly has added to that, next time will be better.

As far as the little ones you found on the wire this morning--nothing is dead until it's cold and dead. I've taken thermacare shoulder patches and stuck them to the bottom of nesting boxes when it was particularly bad and the litter was small enough (usually DD's little ND bunnies) that body heat wasn't going to cut it. If you think you can do it without completely stressing out the mamma hold her on your lap and place the little ones under her so that they can nurse. If she is more skittish you'll be better off just putting them back in with her after they're warm and check them tomorrow a.m. to see if they have full bellies.

 

[Dogfish]

Our rabbit rejected her first litter, second litter was fine.

 

[spamee34]

we had all the same problem's last summer and our neighbors dogs were really loud too so we just culled them all and focused on our flock. But I wish you good luck!

 

[SteveH]

That's a terrible start , I feel for you . I suspicion either something is making your does nervous or they don't like those metal nest boxes . I always used wooden boxs with a partial roofs for privacy and heat retention .
I had first timers drop a couple on the wire floor and the rest in the box . I revived them even though I had thought it was hopeless at the time . I was blessed in that the does never rejected the additions to the nest and most lived .
Due to my cold climate , my outside hutches were closed on three sides and faced east to block the prevailing west wind . I had a few beginners make mistakes but did fine on the next litter . Worst problem was a Satin show doe I bought that was over a year before breeding . She not only ate her first litter but then got very nasty about being handled . I tried her two more times and she ate them every time so she went to the freezer . I bred the all the others at 8 months , some Rexes as early as 6 months , with fewer problems so I wondered if allowing them to go too long before breeding was a problem or if the show Satin was just a bad doe . My best performers were one mutt and the commercial New Zealands . Aside from the Satin , I also had to cull a Rex buck I bought at a show that couldn't throw a litter ; stopped buying expensive show winners after that

and bred mine for productivity

.

 

[uhuh555]

With rabbits too much light (direct sun) is a problem. They have very sensitive eyes and should never have coops facing west or south. East is best. The nature of all rabbits is to eat in the early/late daylight hours and rest during the hotter hours of the day. They also rest from about 11pm to 4am at night.

With the chickens activity on the inside of the building it could interrupt their quiet time making them skittish/nervous.

Here is a link to Tractor Supply Company that carries calf manna. It is very good for your chickens also. If 5% of their daily ration is calf manna during the winter months and a 40 watt light kept on for 12-14 hours a day they will lay all winter long. The eggs will be much larger than normal.

http://www.tractorsupply.com/StoreByStateView?storeId=10551&catalogId=10001

All you can do is try to reintroduce them back to their mother just don’t wait too long.

Rabbits are a natural prey animal. In nature it is important there are plenty of rabbits for hawks, owls, foxes…to eat. Mother Nature in all her wisdom has evolved rabbits to be very prolific in their reproduction. They can give birth and immediately can be impregnated for next litter.

I find that the nest box that is place into the cage is best. I always use wood to make them and put them together with screws so they can be repaired easily. The bottoms are made of ¼ inch hardware cloth that is mounted about 2 inches up from the bottom edge (inside) of the nest box to allow slight air flow in the nest. This prevents mold from building up within the nest box. Being removable they can be cleaned and sanitized (repaired) between litters. Nest boxes should be placed in the cage about 2-3 days before due date for nest making purposes. I have some does that love to rearrange their cage and will move the nest box around even when they have kits in them. Some traits bridge the species gap! LOL
When the kits leave the nest box remove it 2-3 days latter.

You have a large Amish community in you area. They have some good New Zeeland x California hybrids that are excellent for meat production. In our area they sell kits for about $1.50 a pound live weight. This price/pound varies with the seasons. Try Craig’s list, also. Check with your county 4-H coordinator.

Hope this helps.